Guest cookoff013 Posted August 4, 2013 Report Share Posted August 4, 2013 list and discuss. i`d like a show of hands, on how many guns would be declared obsolete. i have a merkel sxs, it has a 3" chamber, but it has a fixed full choke and half choke. The main issue i have is, the chokes say full and 1/2, but on actual mesurements it is 3/4 and extrafull, the extrafull choke is about 0.045" restriction. its just too tight for steel shot. the gun trade association recomend 1/4 or less, and the CIP recomend 1/2 or less. so it s soft nontoxic loads. i will not be running steel through it. i dont want to open the chokes, because it is brilliant with small shotloads of small shot. not exactly optomal for steel. so guys Q; what do you have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted August 4, 2013 Report Share Posted August 4, 2013 Because I'm knadgered and stumbling around the countrysde is losing its charisma, I shan't be too upset should I have to stop shooting pheasant (all walked up) in a year or two. This does not apply to decoying pigeon so my cartridge usage/my pensions do not equate to anything other than steel. I've sold my little Churchill 21/2" proofed at 11/8oz, taking the money now rather than risk a loss later. This leaves me with an AYA XXV Boxlock now some 60 years old and proofed at 900kg/cm2. This is a delight and arguably better than the Churchill at comparatively little cost so if absolutely necessary and assuming suitable chamber size/loads/pressure I would use it for steel. The rub is though, that I will decide what is 'absolutely necessary' as I don't shoot 'fowl or shoot over any water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted August 4, 2013 Report Share Posted August 4, 2013 I have 8 shotguns now,only two of which are multi chokes,but my game gun is choked 1/2 and full,which means that come the lead ban I would have to have the chokes opened up a tad which is a shame as I like tighter chokes.I have an auto choked at 3/4 through which I have in the past fired Gamebore Supersteel 32grm 4's.It's a bit punchy but throws extraordinary patterns and shreds bolting bunnies around 25 yds away.Birds need to be even further away or otherwise are inedible.None of my guns are steel shot proofed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livefast123 Posted August 4, 2013 Report Share Posted August 4, 2013 (edited) Both of my shotguns (Lanber o/u and Francotte hammergun) would effectively be written off due to them having choke levels that are not suitable for steel shot. The guns are old and worth very little now so there is no point opening up the chokes and the non toxic shot variants are far too expensive for me to consider. Edited August 4, 2013 by Livefast123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaserF3 Posted August 4, 2013 Report Share Posted August 4, 2013 My Kemen is fitted with thinwall Briley chokes, which are engraved with the words Lead Only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildfowler12 Posted August 4, 2013 Report Share Posted August 4, 2013 I have 3 shotguns currently... A Beretta a302, and Lincoln no.2, and my fowling gun a Benelli Supernova. Although the first 2 are not proofed for SUPERIOR steel, they are multichoke, and I have shot ducks effectively with them using 32g steel No.4s through 1/4 choke. That was before I bought a tool meant for the job however. The Benelli allows me to shoot larger, heavier steel loads that are more effective at range. If (or when) a total lead ban comes in to force, It won't declare any of my guns obsolete. I'd just have to be more selective with cartridges, and shooting scenarios. I appreciate not everyone is in the same position. I wouldn't dream of putting steel through my mates 2 1/2' Damascus guns! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted August 4, 2013 Report Share Posted August 4, 2013 I have a 687 game gun proofed for steel at 1/4 and 1/2 choke, a beretta extrema 3 1/2 magnum proof for anything (5 chokes) and an old H&H which will never see anything but 2 1/2 lead. So I can use steel but would prefer tungsten matrix at a reasonable price !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Steel shot can be used through full choke. All the literature that i've seen recommends against using bigger than 4mm shot through nothing tighter than 1/2 choke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Steel shot can be used through full choke. All the literature that i've seen recommends against using bigger than 4mm shot through nothing tighter than 1/2 choke. but the guntrade suggest no more than 1/4 choke and cip, 1/2 or less than. i can see your point. when it is me paying for the damage, i`m going to be extra cautious. even though the chokes dont say what they are, i`d rather not tempt fate. i bought a supernova for steel and the full choke is incompatible with steel. and that is even more open than my merkels full choke. i wonder what a phesent day would be like with a semi-auto or pump? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twistedsanity Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 So what determines if you can use steel shot or not then? I have an old SxS hammer gun that I believe is choked at 1/2 and 1/4 , will that be useable or adaptable if the lead ban comes in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkfanz Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 last couple of years ive upgraded all mine,i have a 28g,20g an 12g o/u multichoke,2 are steel proof the other at 1200bar. an 20g an 12g s/a both steel proof m/c.so i,m ok what ever happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hedd-wyn Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 So what determines if you can use steel shot or not then? I have an old SxS hammer gun that I believe is choked at 1/2 and 1/4 , will that be useable or adaptable if the lead ban comes in? Im with you on this one, confused Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evo Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 i am using an 1974 Eibar SXS and it is choked 3/4 and full, I have never had a problem using steel through it, as long as I am using steel from no4 upwards ie no 5 no6 etc then I will not have a problem what so ever, if you look on the gamebore site it explains this, also those who say you can only use steel through 1/4 and half choke are talking utter tosh, I think there are too many people listening to people who have not got a clue instead of reading the facts from the people who design and build the cartridges, steel shot can be used through any choke as long as the shotgun can handle the pressures, oh and I also asked 4 different gunsmiths the same question and they all agreed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 (edited) i am using an 1974 Eibar SXS and it is choked 3/4 and full, I have never had a problem using steel through it, as long as I am using steel from no4 upwards ie no 5 no6 etc then I will not have a problem what so ever, if you look on the gamebore site it explains this, also those who say you can only use steel through 1/4 and half choke are talking utter tosh, I think there are too many people listening to people who have not got a clue instead of reading the facts from the people who design and build the cartridges, steel shot can be used through any choke as long as the shotgun can handle the pressures, oh and I also asked 4 different gunsmiths the same question and they all agreed That sounds logical to me,but I think the 'only use steel through 1/4 and 1/2' was a recomendation rather than a 'must' or 'must not'. I have read many instances of American 'fowlers shooting steel through any choke and wondered why over here we daren't,or are 'advised' not to.While I have no qualms about shooting steel through tight chokes in my other guns I may have to do some in depth research before submitting my game gun to it ! Will have a gander at the Gamebore site;thanks for that. It's good to know I'm not the only one who shoots steel through tight chokes,as long as the wad stands up to it. Edited August 5, 2013 by Scully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 That sounds logical to me,but I think the 'only use steel through 1/4 and 1/2' was a recomendation rather than a 'must' or 'must not'. I have read many instances of American 'fowlers shooting steel through any choke and wondered why over here we daren't,or are 'advised' not to.While I have no qualms about shooting steel through tight chokes in my other guns I may have to do some in depth research before submitting my game gun to it ! Will have a gander at the Gamebore site;thanks for that. It's good to know I'm not the only one who shoots steel through tight chokes,as long as the wad stands up to it. the american guys replace there chokes every season, as the steel shot does affect and change the choke over 1000`s of shells. hard to do on a sxs. i`m sticking to the manufacturers recomendation of chokes with the reguards to the use of steel shot. my benelli choke says no. no steel will go through that. will have to get aftermarket, hardened steel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twistedsanity Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 So could the educated amongst us Inform the uneducated as to what makes a gun " incompatible" with steel shot please ? I really have no idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malkiserow Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 How about the little .410's, will there really be steel shot for them? or will this be the demise of the little shotgun for small vermin? I suppose they will produce steel cartridges but the cost will just go higher again..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livefast123 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 So I can shoot steel clay shells out of my o/u which is choked 1/2 and full without any problems? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penelope Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 (edited) I posted this already in the 'steel fibre wad' thread. I have a Midland Gun Company 3" Magnum, built in the 60's. When I bought it in the very early 90's I was choked 3/4 and full. I had it opened out to 1/4 & 1/2 choke by Ladbrooke & Langton (gunsmiths), just after purchase, as it's main purpose was to be used mostly over decoyed geese. The gun was proofed for 1 1/2oz loads, but I had it reproofed by the London proof for the Eley 3" magnum load which at the time was I believe either 1 5/8 or 1 7/8. Since I got back into wildfowling (2003) I guess I have put approx. 200-300 32g 2 3/4" Express 'Supreme Steel' 4's through it without apparent ill effects. A wise move to continue putting steel through her?? list and discuss. i`d like a show of hands, on how many guns would be declared obsolete. i have a merkel sxs, it has a 3" chamber, but it has a fixed full choke and half choke. The main issue i have is, the chokes say full and 1/2, but on actual mesurements it is 3/4 and extrafull, the extrafull choke is about 0.045" restriction. its just too tight for steel shot. the gun trade association recomend 1/4 or less, and the CIP recomend 1/2 or less. so it s soft nontoxic loads. i will not be running steel through it. i dont want to open the chokes, because it is brilliant with small shotloads of small shot. not exactly optomal for steel. so guys Q; what do you have? Edited August 5, 2013 by Penelope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperfection Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Yep,i have a Lanber which isnt suitable for steel.It might be tight choked at 1/2 & 3/4,but it patterns real well and fits me perfectly.Would be a shame to scrap it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkfanz Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 so long as the pressure generated by steel shot carts doesn,t exceed the proof pressure of the said gun,an its not too tightly choked no problem,read what it says on the box eg modern proof 1200bar steel proof 1320 bar minimum,hull steel n game 20g service pressure 950 bar,xpress hunting steel service pressure 850 bar.hope that helps . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamch Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 You would think the the ammo makers would get their research heads on and develop a lead alternative which is affordable and useable in 'conventional' guns. There seems to be a few tungsten plastic shot types on the market Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Got an old english boxlock that i wouldnt want to put steel though. - Thread for me restocking this old gun here : http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/255752-making-a-walnut-shotgun-stock-a-restoration-project/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 I doubt any gun would be steel proof if you got a batch of faulty cartridges where the wad failed for some reason.put a box through where the wad allows the shot to run the walls of the barrel and I think you would be finished with that gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprackles Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Got 3 hammer guns, a 10, a 12 and a 16. Not a chance in hell of steel going through them. My sxs is a Gunmark Sabel which was 2nd hand when I bought it over 25 years ago and my OU is an E Rizzini multi choke..early version again so no steel there either. I have a newish 20 bore sxs which came with some steel shot so it looks like that's all I have that's suitable. The real question is.....why is everyone talking as if a lead ban is a forgone conclusion ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.