lord_seagrave Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 I am more out than in. LS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psyxologos Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 In, of course... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
955i Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Shake it all about. Sorry, out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElvisThePelvis Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Having seen tonight's announcement, I think in is what is best for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodp Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Not seen an announcement ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol p Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Out. No more jundies please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElvisThePelvis Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 I did make a point of saying it's very unlikely we would ever go back in time, so absolutely not naive. However, "Little England" as you condescendingly put it is far from little in ability to make a name for itself. If we're so little why do we keep sending benefits abroad, why do we pay in much more than we get out ? We're only little in the minds of those who are pessimists or benefit from the eu. We do not need the eu, they need us, end of !! Not intended to be condescending but that is fear how we will be viewed, isolated and vulnerable. The days of being ahead of the pack have sadly gone, many of our competitors have caught up or overtaken and without EU membership we will be viewed to lack depth. My heart and my national pride says out. But rationally I think it's a very bad idea. We are heavily reliant on imports, these costs will spiral as Sterling weakens as market confidence disappears and so inflation will rocket and interest rates will soar causing default issues for many and potentially a deep recession. The Farage esque 'foreigners coming here taking our jobs' out campaign will win over many but in reality immigration brings benefits to a country such as ours with its developed population triangle. Of course we need sovereignty over our laws and our tax revenues and we pay more than our fair share, but I see that being agreed and what is more I see this as the start of wider EU reforms. The bigger picture is that we will risk isolation standing alone and that any exit will take years of negotiation and decades of implementation, we are undoubtedly stronger in a reformed EU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danger-Mouse Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Not seen an announcement ?? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-politics-35601369 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElvisThePelvis Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Not seen an announcement ?? Press conference shortly.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
margun Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Ah, we have 'special status' in the EU. Well done Dave. To be forgotten/ignored, along with his other promises as soon as the vote is taken. Let's hope we don't make the same mistake as the Scots did last time chicken Dave appeared genuine. This isn't the rabbit from the hat I thought it might be (with the cynical hat on), surprisingly. More like a Guinea pig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danger-Mouse Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Not intended to be condescending but that is fear how we will be viewed, isolated and vulnerable. The days of being ahead of the pack have sadly gone, many of our competitors have caught up or overtaken and without EU membership we will be viewed to lack depth. My heart and my national pride says out. But rationally I think it's a very bad idea. We are heavily reliant on imports, these costs will spiral as Sterling weakens as market confidence disappears and so inflation will rocket and interest rates will soar causing default issues for many and potentially a deep recession. The Farage esque 'foreigners coming here taking our jobs' out campaign will win over many but in reality immigration brings benefits to a country such as ours with its developed population triangle. Of course we need sovereignty over our laws and our tax revenues and we pay more than our fair share, but I see that being agreed and what is more I see this as the start of wider EU reforms. The bigger picture is that we will risk isolation standing alone and that any exit will take years of negotiation and decades of implementation, we are undoubtedly stronger in a reformed EU I`m inclined to think that the only reason they are negotiating is that they really don`t want to lose us. Do you think that a country that contributed a minor portion of the EU budget would gain any concessions? I severely doubt it. They are scared of the possible repercussions of us leaving. Our exit plus the disagreements brought about by Germany`s open borders policy to the refugees/economic migrants might well bring the whole house of cards crashing down and along with it all those nice MEP benefits that the eurocrats have right now. Whilst ever we`re part of the EU we will never have complete control over our laws and once the threat of the referendum is over we`ll be lucky to negotiate anything in our favour again. The exit is not going to take years and years. As far as I`m aware we will be out in two years max. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElvisThePelvis Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 I`m inclined to think that the only reason they are negotiating is that they really don`t want to lose us. Do you think that a country that contributed a minor portion of the EU budget would gain any concessions. The exit is not going to take years and years. As far as I`m aware we will be out in two years max. There is some precedent here, look into how long it took Greenland, 3 years! For 50,00 fishermen. Switzerland and Finnish treaties took 10 years all told, in two years the leaving won't have even begun. Also, it seems that many people are not looking at what we lose, but what the EU may lose and why they need us and translating that to a good thing... Which it isn't.. Great press conference so far, Dave has done well and for me it is clear that leaving a reformed EU is very a bad idea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mick miller Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Well following Dave's landmark negotiations my left leg is in but my right leg is out. in. out. etc. ad nauseam... I'll be awaiting the (un)official details of what this 'deal' actually involves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James1983 Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Shake it all about... Do the okey cokey and... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElvisThePelvis Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Ah, we have 'special status' in the EU. Well done Dave. To be forgotten/ignored, along with his other promises as soon as the vote is taken. Let's hope we don't make the same mistake as the Scots did last time chicken Dave appeared genuine. This isn't the rabbit from the hat I thought it might be (with the cynical hat on), surprisingly. More like a Guinea pig. Had Scotland exited UK their naive plan would have blown to pieces already, although no one wants to see emperor sturgeon with no clothes on.. I was all for Scottish independence and the resultant improvement in English public finances, hopefully there may be a new referendum, to be followed by the other net deductors Northern Ireland and Wales.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1961 Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 The Eu is so corupt they cannot account for the money they have spent for years to much corruption jobs for the banker boys I vote OUT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danger-Mouse Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 There is some precedent here, look into how long it took Greenland, 3 years! For 50,00 fishermen. Switzerland and Finnish treaties took 10 years all told, in two years the leaving won't have even begun. Also, it seems that many people are not looking at what we lose, but what the EU may lose and why they need us and translating that to a good thing... Which it isn't.. Great press conference so far, Dave has done well and for me it is clear that leaving a reformed EU is very a bad idea That`s not a precedent. Greenland left the EEC. No state has ever left the EU. The negotiations for leaving have a stated period of 2 years although that may be extended if both parties agree. I believe we also have a simpler option to simply repeal the law that made us a member. A drastic solution perhaps but an option nonetheless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawntredder Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Don't care one jot.... I gave up on this country 10 years ago its a joke,won't make a difference to me in or out...by the time I go to the grave this country will be at war with itself and it will also be splitting at the seams with all the migrants coming in....illegals,drugs,rape it all happens right outside my door there must be a drug dealer in every other street and absolutely nothing happens to stop it not a peeler to be seen! So if we can't even sort or country out I couldn't give a ....!!! Disgusting filthy country now,never was like that when I was a lad!!! Rant over for now ;-/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laird Lugton Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Like Grrclark I have a mischievious scamp in me so it's out. If it helps on my work forum we are are running 80% out in a poll. We predicted the great Tory victory of 2015 so here's hoping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mick miller Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 (edited) Well, the smoke has evaporated and the mirror shattered. Matthew Elliott has just said "crucially, this deal is not legally binding and can be ripped apart at any time..." That'll be July then, just after all the IN votes. Edited February 20, 2016 by mick miller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Out out out ,Dave's promises are meaningless and can be overturned any time they want to,Isn't it a miracle that at these do or die negotiations gave Dave the exact things he wanted and promised,amazing that. Lies lies and more lies,anything to sway the british cash cow, sorry the british people that we should stay in the eu.The world is a big place and we are a player quite capable of making our own way in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poontang Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 In, of course... I thought you were against TTIP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Had Scotland exited UK their naive plan would have blown to pieces already, although no one wants to see emperor sturgeon with no clothes on.. I was all for Scottish independence and the resultant improvement in English public finances, hopefully there may be a new referendum, to be followed by the other net deductors Northern Ireland and Wales.. Your posts were fine until that nonsense. Little Englander indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treetree Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 Out. These 'negotiations' are a meaningless stitch-up concocted by the Eu to give the illusion of the UK having a special place in the Eu. Out out out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FalconFN Posted February 19, 2016 Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 I know we dont know the numbers, but why do you all think that the majority MPs appear to be Europhile? I don't buy the 'lining their own pockets' argument so what makes them think we should remain in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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