patteren plates any good

[propercartridges]

as per the title people are they any good a static target with a shotgun do they do your head in before you have shot them at anything moving chokes make of shotgun lengh of barrell backbored this post about fibre carts cheers george 07714 323 909

[Gordon R]

Never really seen the point, except for gun fit.

 

If you pattern your gun with one cartridge, do you do the same every time you use a different batch, a different brand or change your chokes?

[propercartridges]

exactly to see where you are shooting yes no problem but to patteren before you go out to shoot moving things to me a complete and utter wast of time you dont need alot to tell if you like them 25 to 50 carts and flighting pigeon at different hights and angles that's all you need and if you come back with half bat using fibre you have done well fibre cartridges I detest them more trouble than what they are worth we are 2016 ment to be going forward not backwards fibre ballistics total waste of time

[TONY R]

Vital its the way a loads efficiencey is calculated, if a loads pattern is iregular full of voids these failings wont improve just because the bird is flying it will still be bad.

[propercartridges]

Vital its the way a loads efficiencey is calculated, if a loads pattern is iregular full of voids these failings wont improve just because the bird is flying it will still be bad.

 

well each to their own if a man can hit a target with half bat on say 300 pellets that's 150 into what he wanted whats going to get out of that ok say a skinny sitting rabbit and give it 50 of those 150 that's gone into a 30 inch circle at 40 yards itll make bugs as dead as julious ceaser and hes been dead a while time you are messing with pattern plates you can find something to shoot surly if you have a place to test for patterns on paper you can find something moving to make dead no good winding yourself up on paper or you will never hit nowt that's before you go out if its dead and you fancy giving it a post mortom to count the pellets fine I often do it you put it into you head that they are no good on paper sure as you want you will miss so that's my feeling about pattern plates

[TONY R]

 

well each to their own if a man can hit a target with half bat on say 300 pellets that's 150 into what he wanted whats going to get out of that ok say a skinny sitting rabbit and give it 50 of those 150 that's gone into a 30 inch circle at 40 yards itll make bugs as dead as julious ceaser and hes been dead a while time you are messing with pattern plates you can find something to shoot surly if you have a place to test for patterns on paper you can find something moving to make dead no good winding yourself up on paper or you will never hit nowt that's before you go out if its dead and you fancy giving it a post mortom to count the pellets fine I often do it you put it into you head that they are no good on paper sure as you want you will miss so that's my feeling about pattern plates

Yes but when you know you go out knowing they are good not bad on paper now that boosts your confidence.

Edited August 18, 2016 by TONY R

[panoma1]

exactly to see where you are shooting yes no problem but to patteren before you go out to shoot moving things to me a complete and utter wast of time you dont need alot to tell if you like them 25 to 50 carts and flighting pigeon at different hights and angles that's all you need and if you come back with half bat using fibre you have done well fibre cartridges I detest them more trouble than what they are worth we are 2016 ment to be going forward not backwards fibre ballistics total waste of time

Can't agree with this, if using bio degradable wads fine! Plastic is OK on the clay ground, if allowed? But why would you want to litter the countryside with plastic which will be there for eons? I use fibre or biodegradable wads for all my live shooting and have done for years, have you seen all the plastic wads washed up on the tideline? this is one reason I don't use steel for fowling.....and I do OK!

But apart from the variables mentioned above no two guns will pattern the same using similar cartridge! Using a different cartridge in your usual gun will probably affect pattern..............So I too think patterning them is a waste of time.

[dougall]

exactly to see where you are shooting yes no problem but to patteren before you go out to shoot moving things to me a complete and utter wast of time you dont need alot to tell if you like them 25 to 50 carts and flighting pigeon at different hights and angles that's all you need and if you come back with half bat using fibre you have done well fibre cartridges I detest them more trouble than what they are worth we are 2016 ment to be going forward not backwards fibre ballistics total waste of time

bit of a rant..I wont use plastic,so are you saying your fibre is'nt up to much?

[BerettaSV10]

I use a pattern plate just to set a gun up, as no gun off the shelf will fit me with out it having an adjustable stock. Once the gun is set up I may after a while just double check that the set up is correct and nothing has changed in the gun mount, as I have eye dominance switching randomly it does cause a few problems and my take a couple of patter plates to get the best set up.

 

I never pattern the gun for different cartridges as I don't see the point in it for me and tend to stick to the same cartridges, and could be forever tweaking it.

[motty]

I think pattern testing is very useful. It can be a way to find what loads work best for you. Very helpful when loading up for quarry that is likely to be on the very edge of shooting range.

[Guest cookoff013]

i think George is saying, "count the bag, not the pattern"

[Exudate]

I think pattern testing is very useful. It can be a way to find what loads work best for you. Very helpful when loading up for quarry that is likely to be on the very edge of shooting range.

 

Couldn't agree more. It was pattern testing that made me aware that the choke in my Benelli M2 had been cut off-center, and the pattern was centralised high and left. I got a new barrel from GMK as a warranty replacement, and now have the confidence that the gun is shooting where I point it. Often, it's the confidence edge that makes all of the difference.

[rbrowning2]

I think pattern testing is very useful. It can be a way to find what loads work best for you. Very helpful when loading up for quarry that is likely to be on the very edge of shooting range.

+1

 

Their are some mathematical formula etc that can be applied and books on the subject.

 

However with out it getting complicated I find it is a useful way to confirm gun fit, both barrels to same point of aim, what your actual chokes deliver and can confirm quality of shot.

[itchy trigger]

George has a thing about fibre wad cartridges, he would prefer everybody to use plastic, when I lived in Northumberland I went to see George at his Factory, to buy some cartridges, I took some of what I was using at the time, (fibre wad) George fired some of those in his test rig, I then bought some of his similar spec fibre wad, his ultimate game, (which were very good) he really did try to persuade me over to plastic, but will not shoot plastic except for when shooting steel,

[Stonepark]

George, you know my thoughts from previous discussions.

 

On gun set up, patterning should be done by everyone.

 

On change of cartridges, i pattern to see what they do. There is (in my 12b ou), a 12-15% difference in the 30 circle between fibre and plastic of the same load.

 

Pellets within 30 cicle are generally round and arrive ahead of the others so seeing those and their distribution is important to me.

 

I patterned some eleys (which were discounted fibre) and found they were balling/welding shot together which would not be apparent without patterning.

 

I use fibre for almost everything as a lot of clay clubs and landowners won't allow anything but fibre and have used that argument in reverse when refusing to use steel on fields/stubble for geese and duck.

 

Also see my 410 posts where i am patterning and you see more choke does not keep improving patterns and in fact makes them worse.

[achosenman]

I use the pattern plate with every new load I produce. Without a pattern plate how can you get the best from your hand load?

 

My latest trip shows 32grm #6 is best with 1/2 choke, 66% at 40yds, any more and it blows the pattern. The chronograph tells me it's faster than any of the wild claims made by the premier cartridge makers including a very expensive black number. My 32grm #5 runs best at 3/4 choke and flies 20fps slower. It still patterns at 67% at 40yds Both loads perform better than any factory load I've tried.

[propercartridges]

yes noted all but you cant beat taking them out to shoot them thats better than any plate

[wigeon jim]

George have you been on the beer! Of coarse you need to pattern your gun, every gun will throw a different pattern, even the speed can be as much as 100 fps different between skinny and over bored guns with the same shells, have to say I hate fibre wads, I once loaded a listed fast 10 bore ITX load which could only put about 10 pellets in a 30" circle at 40 yds so without patterning that load I would have wasted a lot of time and expensive shot, women can't understand why us reloaders shoot at bits of paper then take photos off the bit paper and then send it to our friends or post it on forums, they think we are strange for some reason!! Jim.

[propercartridges]

George have you been on the beer! Of coarse you need to pattern your gun, every gun will throw a different pattern, even the speed can be as much as 100 fps different between skinny and over bored guns with the same shells, have to say I hate fibre wads, I once loaded a listed fast 10 bore ITX load which could only put about 10 pellets in a 30" circle at 40 yds so without patterning that load I would have wasted a lot of time and expensive shot, women can't understand why us reloaders shoot at bits of paper then take photos off the bit paper and then send it to our friends or post it on forums, they think we are strange for some reason!! Jim.

 

aye jim lad I hear wot u say but all these complicated figures isn't doing the job any good but do you not agree that you have to shoot them so now we come to the target 300 pellets plus fired down range at paper in a straight line what u shooting sitting rabbits pigeon in the decoys wheres the movement a guy in the states used a train now that might tell u a bit more but static paper not for me u can sharp tell on flighting pigeons if they are any good as you know c u jimmy

[bluesj]

If i hadn't tested the eley pigeon select i was given i wouldn't have really known that they through a pattern like a doughnut with 1/2 choke or less in my gun. May be some would say it would have been better to have spent an afternoon just pricking birds to find out what they were like

[achosenman]

Shot string is just one aspect and I thought it was an Englishman. The train was only doing 11mph so the excersise was pointless.

 

What you say regarding a static pattern is somewhat relevant. A seemingly good static pattern with soft shot might look acceptable, but shot stringing due damaged pellets might blow massive holes in your dynamic pattern. I'd still argue that most of the picture is better than none though. The other thing for me is that it gives me confidence that the gun,cartridge,choke combination works.

 

Atb

[wigeon jim]

George if your talking about shot string forget about it as a target like crossing clay or a pigeon will only move a few inches between the first and the last pellets reaching it even with a long shot string,

Jim.

[Continental Shooter]

Patterning, especially in home loading, is -to me- a great tool to ***** what's already been said as well as other things. If you add a test at a properly set up chrony you can gather lots of great info on what you're loading or shooting

 

for instance, you can have an idea if the powder burning rate was altered from batch to batch (well, noticeable changes at least) and you can evaluate if you need to add more powder, lead or take out either or both.

 

 

Of course, if you have a proofing barrel ....

 

If the pattern's too wide it's generally over pressured; a pattern too concentrated in the centre is under pressured (both in comparison to the optimal pressure for each loads); knowing that can give you an idea on how to adjust the load to make it better

 

A well placed pattern is almost certainly deadly so, for instance i pattern my loads at the distance i shoot at and with the chokes i use the most. This exercise provides me with a picture of how the pattern arrives and gives me confidence it can deliver enough pellets to take a clean kill.

[rbrowning2]

 

If the pattern's too wide it's generally over pressured; a pattern too concentrated in the centre is under pressured (both in comparison to the optimal pressure for each loads); knowing that can give you an idea on how to adjust the load to make it better

 

How exactly is a small change in pressure causing this? Is it actually measurable with after all what is a scatter gun? Fibre and or plastic wads? How many shots do you fire to reach this conclusion with each batch of cartridges you are loading? Given their is quite a marked natural statistical standard deviation with shotgun ballistics with regards to pressure.

[Guest cookoff013]

Patterning, especially in home loading, is -to me- a great tool to ***** what's already been said as well as other things. If you add a test at a properly set up chrony you can gather lots of great info on what you're loading or shooting

 

for instance, you can have an idea if the powder burning rate was altered from batch to batch (well, noticeable changes at least) and you can evaluate if you need to add more powder, lead or take out either or both.

 

 

Of course, if you have a proofing barrel ....

 

If the pattern's too wide it's generally over pressured; a pattern too concentrated in the centre is under pressured (both in comparison to the optimal pressure for each loads); knowing that can give you an idea on how to adjust the load to make it better

 

A well placed pattern is almost certainly deadly so, for instance i pattern my loads at the distance i shoot at and with the chokes i use the most. This exercise provides me with a picture of how the pattern arrives and gives me confidence it can deliver enough pellets to take a clean kill.

 

i`m going to have to dissagree with this....

 

i patterned subs.