Vauxhall mokka warranty advice

[hyflier]

All dealerships are different, One dealer local to me would throw rose petals at your feet when you show serious interest in buying a car, Once purchased and if problems arise, the customer experience is a little different: Akin to "There's nothing wrong with it, they all sound like that, get off our carpet"

 

After several calls to the customer services department, I went to another dealer who have been "exceptional" from day one, both with help purchasing and after sales assistance.

 

I can strongly advise you try another dealership, if you've got no further....

[daveboy]

Your third option is to pay them and let them do the work,Write paid under protest on the paperwork and

then decide weather to sue them in the small claims court.

[markm]

That's for all the responses.

 

I have badgered them (politely) on twitter, making a record of every issue.

 

The sensors have been repaired in the exhaust and the parking sensor is getting done on Thursday.

 

Daveboy, does writing that on the invoice / bill give me any advantage?

[daveboy]

This is from the "WHICH" consumer site...

 

http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/regulation/supply-of-goods-and-services-act-1982#payment-under-protest

 

Payment 'under protest'

You might decide to pay under protest and take legal action for compensation if you're still in dispute with a trader.

To do this either write 'paid under protest' on the back of the cheque, or when paying also hand/send the trader a covering letter stating that you are paying 'under protest'.

[Wymondley]

Your third option is to pay them and let them do the work,Write paid under protest on the paperwork and

then decide weather to sue them in the small claims court.

Sue them for what?

 

If they're following the terms of the warranty they've done nothing wrong.

As I noted earlier, when I looked at the Vauxhall T&Cs diagnostics are not covered and neither is lighting.

Apparently Vauxhall customer service have said the dealer is following procedure.

 

If the op signed the job card agreeing to the work, including paying for any diagnostics, then a contract was formed.

 

I would imagine that to keep the warranty valid, the owner is obliged to have any faults discovered rectified straight away, whether they're covered by the warranty or not.

This stops problems developing that may ultimately lead to a bigger bill for Vauxhall.

A cynic may say it also keeps the dealer in work, but then it is in business to make money.

 

My advice would be to arrange a meeting with the service manager and ask for a clear explanation of what's been done and why.

If necessary ask for it in writing, including reference to any terms specified by Vauxhall.

 

I work for a main dealer (not vauxhall), and one of my roles is warranty admin'.

Most warranty issues are down to customers not understanding what's covered, then reception staff giving poor explanations.

[Rewulf]

 

As I noted earlier, when I looked at the Vauxhall T&Cs diagnostics are not covered and neither is lighting.

 

 

 

So if I understand this correctly, your warranty problem cannot be ascertained without a diagnostic,which is not covered by the warranty?

And a fundamental part of the car ,ie the headlights,are not covered anyway ?

 

Sounds perfectly reasonable to me

[Gordon R]

Wymondley - a detailed and sensible post, although a bit of an eye opener.

 

About 2 years ago, I took a car to the local main agents - car was just over one year old, about 10k miles - tailgate lock wouldn't open. First think I was asked was for proof of service history. I provided it, but asked just how a lock would figure in one of their services. I couldn't get a sensible answer. They did not inspire confidence as they appeared to be trying to look for an excuse not to do it, which is surprising given that they get paid by the manufacturer.

[markm]

I agree with what wymondley has said.

 

I wanted the lights fixed, simply to sell it on, but I'm being forced to get the parking sensors done first at a cost to me. TBH I didnt think there was anything wrong with them.

 

The lights work, but the fault is intermittent, to me that is an electrical problem.

 

Does anyone know if I will have any come back with the finance company. Still a few months left to pay, I don't want to just hand it back as there is £5k equity in the car.

Edited March 4, 2017 by markm

[Wymondley]

As this is the "extended" part of the vauxhall warranty the terms will be a little different to first 3 year part.

 

Generally the customer reports a fault and asks "is this covered under warranty"?

The answer in most cases is, we don't know until we've looked at it, this is going to involve time and that has a cost.

 

The customer must agree to cover that cost until such time as the cause of the fault is determined.

At this point, assuming the fault is covered, the diagnostic fee may be covered as well, but it will depend, as I keep saying, on the Terms and conditions.

If the fault isn't covered then all costs are the responsibility of the customer.

 

 

Everyone needs to understand what is meant by warranty.

For usually the first three years, the manufacturer warrants the vehicle free from material or manufacturing defects that cause the premature failure of a component or system.

It doesn't cover normal wear and tear, or failure on the part of the owner to look after the vehicle.

So, tyres, bulbs, wipers, not covered. All are consumables. Blocked or frozen up washer jets, not covered. If you break things by being ham fisted, not covered.

I'll also say another item not covered, and I've seen a lot of this as we're in a rural area, is damage to wiring caused by mice/rats.

 

In offering the warranty, the manufacturer asks that in return you will have your vehicle serviced correctly.

That is the basis for the contract, no service history and you've broken your side of the contract. This "can" invalidate the warranty.

 

Once the vehicle is past the first stage of the warranty, there may be an additional or extended section.

This will normally be more restrictive in what it covers and may impose certain conditions.

Again, it's the responsibility of the buyer to satisfy themselves that these meet their requirements.

 

3rd party warranty, the type you get with a used car are nothing of the sort, they are a mechanical breakdown insurance policy and you'd be shocked at the get outs that are built into them.

 

markm,

No, you have no comeback with the finance company, that may only be the case if the dealer repeatedly failed to fix the fault.

As I understand it they've yet to properly investigate it.

 

 

What exactly is the nature of the fault?

[markm]

Thanks for that. The car has the headlight that turn as you turn the wheel. AFL I think it's called.

 

They initially start up, when I start the car and go through their self test. They work and then when I start driving I get a note on the dash 'service AFL'. The lights still work but they don't change direction (both headlights) and main beam doesn't click in automatically or manually.

Edited March 4, 2017 by markm

[Wymondley]

Thanks for that. The car has the headlight that turn as you turn the wheel. AFL I think it's called.

 

They initially start up, when I start the car and go through their self test. They work and then when I start driving I get a note on the dash 'service AFL'. The lights still work but they don't change direction (both headlights) and main beam doesn't click in automatically or manually.

 

Adaptive headlamps, the motors that turn them are probably an integral part of the headlamp unit, and they'll be run via a CAN or LIN network (a way of sending command signals to multiple components with only one or two wires) from a BCM (body control module).

The fault may be in either of the lamp units, the BCM or the comms' network.

 

Once again, looking at the 100,000 mile warranty T&Cs

what IS covered,

10, Electrical equipment: electronic control units EXCLUDING navigation, LIGHTING, and radar system, but including repair by flashing new software.

 

Wiring harnesses and connectors are also excluded.

 

Remember, unless it says it is covered...it isn't.

See here, http://www.vauxhall.co.uk/owners_services/warranty_assistance/warranty/lifetime_warranty_terms.html

 

So, I can't see that any part of the problem would be covered under the warranty, unless it was cured by a software update.

 

Because of the way LIN and CAN networks function, you have to fix any and all faults as you find them, as problems in one component may be affecting another, seemingly unrelated component.

This is why they've done a full vehicle system scan.

Such is the complexity of modern vehicles.

 

Sorry it's not what you wanted to hear but hopefully you have a better understanding of the issues involved.

[markm]

I appreciate your time. This is not a dig in any way, but do you work for Vauxhall?

 

Why haven't they tried a software reset as the first step?

Edited March 4, 2017 by markm

[Wymondley]

No I don't currently work for vauxhall, although I have done. My time with them pre dates this "lifetime" warranty.

 

The first step with any diagnostics is the computer, firstly to check whether the fault is a known one covered by any recalls or service bulletins then to check if the vehicle has the most up to date software installed.

 

My experience with Vauxhall is that they're pretty good at emphasising this to technicians with some well set out diagnostic routes.

I'm going to say this should have already been done.

 

I've replied to your pm.

[Westward]

I'm going to print this thread and stick it up on the notice board to remind to never, ever comtemplate buying a Vauxhall!

[markm]

Got the car back, not as bag as I had thought.

 

As mentioned exhaust sensors fixed on warranty. Parking sensor was effecting the headlights. All done, including mileage on courtesy car for £200.

 

I'm not sure how the paint cost £35 spray a parking sensor, how much is a can of paint these days? No that is not including labour.

 

I live and learn, thanks for all the help and guidance.

[Rewulf]

I'm not sure how the paint cost £35 spray a parking sensor, how much is a can of paint these days? No that is not including labour.

 

 

Im right at this moment looking at an estimate to paint a Mercedes E class door.

£550 + vat for paint and materials .

Thats not labour , or parts ,just paint,for a new door.

Is that a realistic figure for paint ? No ,it isnt.

So ,I would be happy with £35 for a parking sensor

 

BTW ,Ive been painting cars for nearly 35 years now,the last 25 my own operation,and I can paint that door,and fade out down the side ,using top quality paints for less than £100.

And people wonder why car insurance costs so much.

Edited March 10, 2017 by Rewulf

[Vince Green]

You should not have to pay for a diagnostic on a car that is covered by warranty surely ?

 

That would be my take on it, in fact you should not be charged for diagnostics full stop if they subsequently do the work warranty or not. Its their job to tell you whats wrong.

 

I have only ever had one big warrant claim in my life and that was haggled over for ages before they would agree to it. That was very clearly their fault, the timing chain failed and wrecked the top of the engine.

Edited March 10, 2017 by Vince Green

[markm]

Update.

 

Even though they claimed to have fixed the problem by changing the exhaust sensor and parking sensor, the fault has reappeared on the dash after driving 20 miles this morning.

[Rewulf]

Update.

 

Even though they claimed to have fixed the problem by changing the exhaust sensor and parking sensor, the fault has reappeared on the dash after driving 20 miles this morning.

 

Quite how the parking sensors,affects the headlight directional gizmo Im not sure,nothing would surprise me with the electronic complexity of modern cars.

Anyone with a suspicious mind might think some of these components are designed to fail...

[Davyo]

Sod the reverse sensor,get a new set colour coded to your bumper off the bay for £12.00, came in metallic black,fitted a set on my C3 picasso they work a treat.

Edited March 10, 2017 by Davyo

[Wymondley]

That would be my take on it, in fact you should not be charged for diagnostics full stop if they subsequently do the work warranty or not. Its their job to tell you whats wrong.

 

.

By that logic you shouldn't need to pay the vet for, x rays, blood tests or even a consultation.

When you visit the garage you are buying someones time.

 

 

Update.

 

Even though they claimed to have fixed the problem by changing the exhaust sensor and parking sensor, the fault has reappeared on the dash after driving 20 miles this morning.

That's not good, although with the nature of the fault I'm not surprised.

 

 

 

Quite how the parking sensors,affects the headlight directional gizmo Im not sure,nothing would surprise me with the electronic complexity of modern cars.

Anyone with a suspicious mind might think some of these components are designed to fail...

Because modern vehicles have so much electronics they have to use CAN and LIN networks (Google them) to run them.

To put it really simply, it's a bit like your old Christmas tree lights, when one bulb went, they all went out.

 

Designed to fail? It's called being built to a price.

Edited March 10, 2017 by Wymondley

[Rewulf]

By that logic you shouldn't need to pay the vet for, x rays, blood tests or even a consultation.

When you visit the garage you are buying someones time.

 

 

 

Eh ? do pets have a warranty ?

 

 

Designed to fail? It's called being built to a price.

 

Everything is built to a price.

But cars ,used to be a finite item due to body rot ,or engine wear.

Now days its down to electronic failures,because rotting bodies give a brand a bad rep.

Engine failures make the fleet operators think twice too.

When £100 can buy you a mobile phone with twice the computing power of your average cars ECU ,and rarely fails.

It makes me wonder if this is the new way of making people buy new,and you know as well as I ,people need to keep buying new cars,or there is no motor trade.

[Wymondley]

 

Eh ? do pets have a warranty ?

 

 

Everything is built to a price.

But cars ,used to be a finite item due to body rot ,or engine wear.

Now days its down to electronic failures,because rotting bodies give a brand a bad rep.

Engine failures make the fleet operators think twice too.

When £100 can buy you a mobile phone with twice the computing power of your average cars ECU ,and rarely fails.

It makes me wonder if this is the new way of making people buy new,and you know as well as I ,people need to keep buying new cars,or there is no motor trade.

No, unfortunately pets don't have a warranty, the point was, you have to pay for diagnostics (time) to find the cause of the problem not just the final treatment.

 

Electrical faults, especially when they are intermittent can take hours of testing to track down.

 

I think you underestimate, as most people do, just how complicated a modern vehicle is.

Your smart phone may, just, have more processor than the average ECU, but then there's more than one ECU on a vehicle.

 

ECUs as hardware are, like phones, pretty reliable, it's the software that's often the problem.

I'd say most faults are caused by peripherals anyway, sensors and actuators and the wiring between them.

 

Yes, I agree, it's all about keeping people buying, or as is more often the case now "renting".

[Rewulf]

No, unfortunately pets don't have a warranty, the point was, you have to pay for diagnostics (time) to find the cause of the problem not just the final treatment.

The point is ,its 2 different things,the car has a warranty,the pet does not.

 

Electrical faults, especially when they are intermittent can take hours of testing to track down.

I am well aware of that,one reason why I dont get involved with them.

 

I think you underestimate, as most people do, just how complicated a modern vehicle is.

Your smart phone may, just, have more processor than the average ECU, but then there's more than one ECU on a vehicle.

I work on 'modern' cars every day ,and I am well aware of whats inside an ECU ,the components look like the innards of a PC ,circa 1995,and the ECU is often placed in a position to maximise water ingress.

God knows ,Ive had enough repaired/replaced.

 

ECUs as hardware are, like phones, pretty reliable, it's the software that's often the problem.

I'd say most faults are caused by peripherals anyway, sensors and actuators and the wiring between them.

So like I said,poor design or deliberate poor design ?

 

Yes, I agree, it's all about keeping people buying, or as is more often the case now "renting".

Agreed

 

What you fail to mention is statutory rights ,as a consumer,buying from a dealer ,at retail price,you are covered by them.

Words like 'merchantable quality' or 'reasonable wear'

The fact the car has a warranty that does, or not cover the failure issue,is immaterial ,if the milage is low and has been properly maintained.

His rights as a consumer,buying from a reputable main dealer should be respected.

And to be honest ,if the dealer had any sense they would have waived the diagnostic charge as a gesture of goodwill ,you know maybe in the hope he might shop there again ?

A question to the OP ,how would you rate the service you have received at this particular Vauxhall dealership?

[edge007]

You should not have to pay for a diagnostic on a car that is covered by warranty surely ?

Id get serious with them,all of those faults are covered under its warranty,so tell them to get them fixed.

You are covered under some EU law ,due to its mileage anyway,basically ,stuff should not fail after 40000 miles ,otherwise its not fit for purpose.

Try the ,'Im going to hire a car until youved fixed it FOC ,then Im going to bill you for car hire'