Mice! Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 5 hours ago, Scully said: It’s up to shooting estates to diversify to cater for fluctuations in markets, many other industries have had to do it. That's the thing, how many estates are making very good money selling days, lots of days with lots of birds for which we're told there is no market? I don't understand there being no market, and don't people defend shooting by saying people enjoy the shooting and eat what they shoot? this topic was gone over plenty last year, personally I've eaten more game this season than ever but only a brace each time I've been beating. Thankfully it sounds like these birds had at least been breasted and then someone was avoiding further costs. Personally i think the big estates that are putting down thousands say 5 thousand plus birds should have to process a number of birds even if they are sold cheap or given away to the local community, this would help defend the future of game shooting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 I have seen large, sealed, plastic packs of pheasant breasts for sale in a butchers window. Obviously a market for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sako751sg Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 19 minutes ago, Mice! said: That's the thing, how many estates are making very good money selling days, lots of days with lots of birds for which we're told there is no market? I don't understand there being no market, and don't people defend shooting by saying people enjoy the shooting and eat what they shoot? this topic was gone over plenty last year, personally I've eaten more game this season than ever but only a brace each time I've been beating. Thankfully it sounds like these birds had at least been breasted and then someone was avoiding further costs. Personally i think the big estates that are putting down thousands say 5 thousand plus birds should have to process a number of birds even if they are sold cheap or given away to the local community, this would help defend the future of game shooting. Breasted pheasants and carcasses given back to nature. Nothing to see here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 Strangely enough there are similar pictures/incidents, that seem to appear annually around this time of year ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabel25 Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 They say there's no demand But it's been reported that game sales in supermarkets are up 16 to 20% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 Sorry, for got about this: http://www.countryside-alliance.org/high-standards-essential-to-protect-shooting/?utm_campaign=785926_Newsletter - 180119&utm_medium=dotmailer&utm_source=Countryside Alliance&dm_i=44G9,GUFA,1MITIG,1XMS8,1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perazzishot Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 (edited) This shoot has been processing it's own game for the last 10 years with every surplus bird debreasted and entering the food chain. BASC, CA and the Game Alliance have hung them out to dry. The Sabs have been filming illegally and covertly for 18 months to gather this information. Without even a call to the estate for their side of the story the people we all pay our money never defended the shoot or sort to intervene. The owner of the shoot ended up in hospital on Friday night due to the press and subsequent appalling lack of support from our governing bodies. As said above the disposal of carcasses is a grey area and he has had no contact from the Environment Agency, and to ensure going forward he is correct and proper he has arranged for bins at the estate. We really are in a awful state when our own bodies fail to look after it's own members and bow to the illegal activities of sabs and poor journalists! PS what do PW members do with their debreasted pigeon carcasses? Edited January 20, 2019 by Perazzishot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hambone Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 5 minutes ago, Perazzishot said: This shoot has been processing it's own game for the last 10 years with every surplus bird debreasted and entering the food chain. BASC, CA and the Game Alliance have hung them out to dry. The Sabs have been filming illegally and covertly for 18 months to gather this information. Without even a call to the estate for their side of the story the people we all pay our money never defended the shoot or sort to intervene. The owner of the shoot ended up in hospital on Friday night due to the press and subsequent appalling lack of support from our governing bodies. As said above the disposal of carcasses is a grey area and he has had no contact from the Environment Agency, and to ensure going forward he is correct and proper he has arranged for bins at the estate. We really are in a awful state when our own bodies fail to look after it's own members and bow to the illegal activities of sabs and poor journalists! PS what do PW members do with their debreasted pigeon carcasses? How dare you ask such a question 😂😂……. I hire in a JCB to dig mass graves for mine 😐 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 6 minutes ago, Perazzishot said: This shoot has been processing it's own game for the last 10 years with every surplus bird debreasted and entering the food chain. BASC, CA and the Game Alliance have hung them out to dry. The Sabs have been filming illegally and covertly for 18 months to gather this information. Without even a call to the estate for their side of the story the people we all pay our money never defended the shoot or sort to intervene. The owner of the shoot ended up in hospital on Friday night due to the press and subsequent appalling lack of support from our governing bodies. As said above the disposal of carcasses is a grey area and he has had no contact from the Environment Agency, and to ensure going forward he is correct and proper he has arranged for bins at the estate. We really are in a awful state when our own bodies fail to look after it's own members and bow to the illegal activities of sabs and poor journalists! PS what do PW members do with their debreasted pigeon carcasses? And there we have it; a very pertinent and relevant question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mice! Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 What didn't get cooked or frozen went in a bin bag, then wheelie bin, like most folk do I'd imagine? Didn't compost it as it would attract rats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShootingEgg Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 20 minutes ago, Scully said: And there we have it; a very pertinent and relevant question. Food waste bin or bait for the foxes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 Store in bins for collection by renderer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabel25 Posted January 20, 2019 Report Share Posted January 20, 2019 Is this any worse than all human food waste going into wheelie bins then into land fill This now is a massive bowl of contention where BOGOF and through it out into wheelie bins as it is out of date ( total waste of produce ) but seems to be accepted by the masses As stated most game enters the food chain and enjoyed by all How many of these anti's have ate and fed their kids on chicken nuggets, dippers, kievs kentucky fried chicken etc Where these chickens have been force fed in battery houses with poor light and higiene for 8 weeks then slaughtered for the mass markets which are totaly unhealthy to human consumption But is acceptable to the anti's but game that has roamed free for months fed on wheat and barley and maze and wild berry and seed is not acceptable As to the question above i breast a few birds and the carcassaes are placed in a hole in a wood with the intention to place a cam to see where they go as next morning when i take the dogs out there is nothing left not a feather But have seen sparrow hawks and kestels feeding on them in the past which i am quite happy to see especialy in hard winters Moto of the story Keep eating game and the anti's will join the dinosaurs" Extinct" eating **** Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rim Fire Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 Big estates do it all the time and when i say big i mean big not 5 or 6 thousand more like 20 plus thousand selling 3or4 hundred bird day shoots so what are they going to do with all them birds As shooters we are very blinkered when it come to the truth about what go on after you put your guns away and had your brace of birds as for a market for them unless you are country minded or it is on a shelf in one of the big supermarkets they wont have them. And for them to be on any shelf all sorts of criteria must be met can you imagine someone spitting out a lead shot or breaking a tooth all sorts of out cry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perazzishot Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Rim Fire said: Big estates do it all the time and when i say big i mean big not 5 or 6 thousand more like 20 plus thousand selling 3or4 hundred bird day shoots so what are they going to do with all them birds As shooters we are very blinkered when it come to the truth about what go on after you put your guns away and had your brace of birds as for a market for them unless you are country minded or it is on a shelf in one of the big supermarkets they wont have them. And for them to be on any shelf all sorts of criteria must be met can you imagine someone spitting out a lead shot or breaking a tooth all sorts of out cry Rim Fire You are wrong, I was at a shoot last week and they are paying 80p a bird to have them collected and trust me they throw your headline numbers out the window and shoot 6 days a week. I think in the current climate anyone deliberately burying or incinerating whole birds should rightly be held accountable. This is not the same a non story reported and fed to the public as some sort of rod against us while our member bodies stand around offering no protection or support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 13 hours ago, Mice! said: That's the thing, how many estates are making very good money selling days, lots of days with lots of birds for which we're told there is no market? I don't understand there being no market, and don't people defend shooting by saying people enjoy the shooting and eat what they shoot? this topic was gone over plenty last year, personally I've eaten more game this season than ever but only a brace each time I've been beating. Thankfully it sounds like these birds had at least been breasted and then someone was avoiding further costs. Personally i think the big estates that are putting down thousands say 5 thousand plus birds should have to process a number of birds even if they are sold cheap or given away to the local community, this would help defend the future of game shooting. It wouldn't have to be a big estate to release 5000 birds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotslad Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 Many biger estaes that will just be a pen 1 of the estates i go to has to show game dealer recipts as their accredited by someone (not sure who) and u have to show ur birds are all going into food chain as well as various other things (proper handlin gof ggame after shoot, roofed/mesh sided game cart and chiller, plus legal safe transport for beaters and guns etc) As someone has said it really is nothing to see here and just the same story regurgated again, i would imagine last time we'll see it this year only for it to reappear come August time. As i've said before game dealers have a lot to answer for, if ur energy supplier or petrol company was still charging the same for ir energy/petrol as they were 5+ years ago when 5 years ago they were paying 3 quid a brace and now there charging about 1-2 quid a brace to take away and end product is the same price?? No wonder game dealers are rubbing their hands, there just ripping the **** as they know the birds are being shot and shoots have relied on them for so long there is no other outlet. I've heard similar stoies with deer and english dealers refusing deer with warbles which is quite common in red deer at this time of year The only way shoots can create their own market is having local co-opertatives of big and small shoots in an area processing the game and selling it, they can work of far smaller profit marigns. Possibly a few bigger factories up and down country dealing with any surplus and turning it into ready meals/pies etc If the price was right folk will buy/eat it, but the price of it the now its not surprising not many folk buy it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Rim Fire said: Big estates do it all the time and when i say big i mean big not 5 or 6 thousand more like 20 plus thousand selling 3or4 hundred bird day shoots so what are they going to do with all them birds As shooters we are very blinkered when it come to the truth about what go on after you put your guns away and had your brace of birds as for a market for them unless you are country minded or it is on a shelf in one of the big supermarkets they wont have them. And for them to be on any shelf all sorts of criteria must be met can you imagine someone spitting out a lead shot or breaking a tooth all sorts of out cry Again, you can’t just throw out sweeping generalisations like that without proof. Why do people insist on doing this, particularly shooters; it makes us no better than the antis. If it is true then it needs dealing with, but you can’t just throw out statements like that without being prepared to back it up. So where have you got this info’ from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcMaxus Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) I got the email from BASC this morning. Really gets on my wick things like this, undermines all the good work that goes on. Here is what I don't understand. Why on gods earth would you allow the thing to be filmed? You have to be a special kind of pillock to allow something like that. It makes no sense. It's like me rocking up to a funeral and whipping my phone out, you wouldn't do it. Common bloody sense. The process in itself I've no issue with, it's logical and will feed all sorts of wildlife as an easy meal, especially in the winter months. The pillock who allowed this to be filmed needs repremanding as does the shoot, that's for sure. Makes us all look bad. With regard to pigeon and other carcass, I know a fella who has ferrets that takes them, a falconry near by takes them too. Or we leave them on the permissions to bait fox. Edited January 21, 2019 by MarcMaxus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotslad Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 They haven't allowed this to be fillmed, read back throu this thread 1 poster seems to know the estate. It could also be set up or fake? Nowadys with modern cameras or stealth cams its never been easier to catch prople out (not that the estate are doing anything wrong) even from distance. I couldn't get the clip to play so not sure how they filmed it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perazzishot Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) I've spoken to the shoot owner at length since this broke, the SABs have released various other clips from the game farm over the 18 months of illegal filming but with no issues, this breasted out bird was the only thing they got any traction with in the media. I can also say that I know of another estate who hired a specialist company to there estate and upon the entire estate they found 57 illegal cameras, some actually at the gamekeepers houses. All 57 were collected and given to the police to date no-one has come forward to collect them. We are all potential victims to these type of covert operations and as such we should be standing together as it could be any one of us next time who fall into a grey area and your governing body are just going to turn their back on you! Edited January 21, 2019 by Perazzishot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotslad Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 Fair play to u Perazzi for speaking up and putting the right story out there. I just wish basc/ca had someone like u to stick up for shoots when they're is no wrong doinginstead of apologising and wiping hands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShootingEgg Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 1 hour ago, scotslad said: Fair play to u Perazzi for speaking up and putting the right story out there. I just wish basc/ca had someone like u to stick up for shoots when they're is no wrong doinginstead of apologising and wiping hands I'd like of seen BASC speaking with the game farm and getting the correct story, not just saying dumping is bad, we all know this... But if that was prepared carcass being removed then the birds have been put into food chain so its not at all how it was portrayed in the media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) I’ve just read Glensers letter in response to the Times piece, and indeed BASC have distanced themselves to the extent they have reported the shoot. Have the CA done likewise? Edited to say, the CA have condemned the practise, as have BASC, which is fair enough. Does anyone know which anti organisation was behind this? Edited January 21, 2019 by Scully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcMaxus Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 2 hours ago, scotslad said: They haven't allowed this to be fillmed, read back throu this thread 1 poster seems to know the estate. It could also be set up or fake? Nowadys with modern cameras or stealth cams its never been easier to catch prople out (not that the estate are doing anything wrong) even from distance. I couldn't get the clip to play so not sure how they filmed it I agree i dont think there is any wrong doing. Having looked back at the footage, it does appear to be a covert camera set up to specifically catch this. That being said I take back my comment, doesn't appear they would have known filming was taking place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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