atf Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 https://www.songbird-survival.org.uk/news/sbs-submission-to-defras-general-licence-consultation?mc_cid=9c7cc4136d&mc_eid=1070f6677b&utm_campaign=9c7cc4136d-email_campaign_2019_05_15_10_36&utm_medium=email&utm_source=songbird+survival+mailing+list&utm_term=0_d2f73d13ed-9c7cc4136d-274118633 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 They make a good case for corvid control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 Real facts from real conservationists....a pleasant change from the ******** propaganda spouted by militant protectionists with an anti shooting agenda! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancer425 Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 Thats the big difference you see people who genuinely care about conservation , not just anti gun anti hunting tree huggers who are more about personal agendas than real world issues surrounding our countryside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 And there you go; a really impressive and professional piece of work. I have a friend in town ( farmers wife ) who is a paid up contributor to SBS, and she is most definitely not a fan of the RSPB. Good work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 1 hour ago, Scully said: And there you go; a really impressive and professional piece of work. I have a friend in town ( farmers wife ) who is a paid up contributor to SBS, and she is most definitely not a fan of the RSPB. Good work. Exactly what we need. Unbiased sensible response to a national issue. Very good work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 10 minutes ago, oowee said: Exactly what we need. Unbiased sensible response to a national issue. Very good work. Yes. 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuartyboy Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 I hope all who read this thread join up the Songbird Survival charity. £20 a year for membership. They talk a lot of sense and more members they have, the more influence they have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 Published by people who know the country side . Very well written . Being an avid country man a charity worth supporting . harnser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJsDad Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 (edited) That`s a well written and factual submission, that totally flies in the face of the fake stuff Packham & co pushed out. Have`nt seen anything from RSPB. Be interesting to see what side of the fence they intend to take on the subject ? Edited May 16, 2019 by JJsDad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancer425 Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 (edited) Join here, i am in. https://app.donorfy.com/donate/LB259MBBD3/JoinUs Edited May 16, 2019 by lancer425 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 Just looked through the RSPB web site for an update. Not a lot but this is interesting. MartinHarper 1 May 2019 Like everyone, I was surprised by Natural England’s decision to revoke the General Licence at such short notice after the legal proceedings by Wild Justice. The following media and online frenzy has thrown up so much misinformation and inaccuracies that it is hard for those not immersed in this stuff to really know what’s going on. As you probably know, the RSPB uses the general licence. We are upfront and open about our use of lethal vertebrate control and we are the only organisation or estate (as far as I’m aware) that publishes annual figures (see here). We are also very clear when and why we sometimes feel it necessary to carry out this work. Making the decision to employ legal, lethal methods of predator control is never easy. In fact, it’s a practice we go to great lengths to avoid until we can see no other viable conservation alternatives and when the need is sufficiently great. So, what do I think about the current events? I see this is a positive step in the right direction (albeit imperfectly executed). We have been calling for greater clarity and have had concerns about the robustness of the licencing process for some time. Indeed, there is an argument that the entire General Licensing system is incapable of compliance with international law. But, setting that aside for the moment the RSPB has always been clear that licensing can work but that we need an open and transparent system in which everyone can have confidence, and one that is appropriately followed, monitored and enforced. What does that mean? Well, licences should only be issued when there is no other option, and when non-lethal alternatives have been exhausted. And that is how we have used them. Natural England has now stated that if we need to carry out lethal control in the future, we will need to apply for individual licences. Given that we shall be seeking to meet conservation objectives and that our case will be underpinned by scientific evidence led science, I hope that we should be able to secure the necessary licenses. One final point. The debate over the perceived rights and wrongs of the situation has descended from anger and outrage into bullying, abuse and credible death threats. Nowhere has this been more apparent than in the treatment of Chris Packham. The RSPB is proud to have Chris as one of its Vice Presidents. He’s a genuinely nice guy, trying to do what is best for nature. He’s incredibly knowledgeable and passionate and is one of the UK’s foremost spokespeople on wildlife. I’m sure that if there were more people like him, then our nature would be better off. We don’t always agree on every aspect of nature conservation (and clearly his honorary role with our charity does not prevent him speaking his mind), but I could never fault his commitment nor his motives. That’s why I’m appalled at the abuse that Chris has received. I know that social media can be deeply simplistic and polarising allowing anonymous attacks to be seen as a new norm. But I find this deeply unsettling. It is completely unacceptable and has no place in a modern society. People may be rattled by what has happened but that does not excuse them from lashing out seeing Chris as a scapegoat because of his views. Someone once told me that our body of law is a reflection of what society wants today. The legal challenge of the General Licence was not an attempt to change the law, rather ensure that it was upheld. Yet, as society changes and as pressures on the natural world grow, we should expect the laws of the land to change. Society is clearly changing and it is why we need to be successful in campaigning to secure new legal targets to drive nature’s recovery and to tackle climate change. The RSPB is lucky to have Chris Packham as our Vice President alongside us in this endeavour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 1 hour ago, stuartyboy said: I hope all who read this thread join up the Songbird Survival charity. £20 a year for membership. They talk a lot of sense and more members they have, the more influence they have. Well balanced submission, lets hope it carries some weight with DEFRA and any new GL. that’s a very good idea, they seem to-be more realistic on the effects of corvids on song/small birds and the need to control corvid numbers, they are likely to have more influence in any future challenges from WJ as they seem to base their argument on ongoing field studies, also as far as joe public are concerned it looks better coming from a non-shooting org. think I might just join for £20. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 Obviously to the RSPB 'Chris' can do no wrong! And every allegation he makes is, incontrovertibly true! He is "incredibly knowledgable" he thinks the decline in Lapwings is down to shooting!!.........So this must be true?? He is a committed climate change warrior........who travels the world by airplane, for his own financial gain, leaving a massive individual carbon footprint?.......more like a climate change hypocrite! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mick miller Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 me too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twenty Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 And me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twenty Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 Just Joined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 4 hours ago, stuartyboy said: I hope all who read this thread join up the Songbird Survival charity. £20 a year for membership. They talk a lot of sense and more members they have, the more influence they have. Agreed and joined Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuartyboy Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 7 minutes ago, islandgun said: Agreed and joined Good stuff. The welcome pack is worth the money alone! 👍 37 minutes ago, twenty said: Just Joined. 👍 3 hours ago, mick miller said: me too. 👍 3 hours ago, old'un said: think I might just join for £20. 👍 And a big 👍 to anyone else who has joined up. A charity like this, with the right numbers behind it, can help to sway public opinion while doing a lot of good for our song birds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 https://community.rspb.org.uk/ourwork/b/martinharper/posts/the-conservationist-39-s-dilemma-an-update-on-the-science-policy-and Reading the RSPB list of veterbrate animals killed by them, they failed to mention, the extermination of probably the last remaining colony of the now super rare/extinct black rat from Britain. i.e from the Shiant islands, near me in the outer Hebrides https://ww2.rspb.org.uk/our-work/conservation/shiantisles/work/index.aspx Also the 2000 Mink we killed partly funded by RSPB.. are they worried that the packams of this world wont approve? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted May 16, 2019 Report Share Posted May 16, 2019 Just received this EMail . looks good ! songbirdsurvival@gmail.com <songbirdsurvival@gmail.com> To:stephen 16 May at 21:12 Dear stephen Thank you for joining SongBird Survival! We are delighted to welcome you as a member. You will receive our regular emails which will update you on the research and monitoring work that we are currently involved in with independent organisations. Our latest research project with the University of Exeter is well underway. This collaborative project will work with cat owners to understand cat predation of wildlife, and identify potential solutions to this issue. In the last year, we have been working to find out more about the behaviour of magpies and how it affects songbirds. Our longest-running research project, examining the effect of agri-environment schemes on farmland bird populations in East Anglia, continues to provide an invaluable picture of long-term population trends. Since 2003, farmland bird counts have shown a steady decline in bird populations at this site, in spite of countryside stewardship measures aimed at encouraging them. This research shows the importance of our continued efforts to identify the real drivers behind songbird declines. If you would be able to help us by putting out leaflets or holding a fundraising event then please do contact us in the office and we will discuss any ideas you have and how we can work together with you. We also invite our members to contribute articles and letters for our newsletters and website. Please keep in touch and if you have any concerns or worries about the way you see songbirds and other small birds reacting to the undoubted pressures, particularly of predation, do contact us with your views. SongBird Survival believes in ‘Management for Balance’ and in this way our countryside and gardens will always need help and positive management. Kind regards Alison SealAdministration AssistantSongBird SurvivalPO Box 311 DissP22 1WW Office: 01379 641715 dawn-chorus@songbird-survival.org.ukwww.songbird-survival.org.uk SongBird Survival. A Company limited by Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twenty Posted May 17, 2019 Report Share Posted May 17, 2019 14 hours ago, old'un said: Well balanced submission, lets hope it carries some weight with DEFRA and any new GL. that’s a very good idea, they seem to-be more realistic on the effects of corvids on song/small birds and the need to control corvid numbers, they are likely to have more influence in any future challenges from WJ as they seem to base their argument on ongoing field studies, also as far as joe public are concerned it looks better coming from a non-shooting org. think I might just join for £20. They have carried out some excellent research projects in the past, these can be found on the sbs website. Well worth the membership fee, if only for the ' sbs-submission to DEFRA-general licence' consultation report. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted May 17, 2019 Report Share Posted May 17, 2019 1 hour ago, twenty said: They have carried out some excellent research projects in the past, these can be found on the sbs website. Well worth the membership fee, if only for the ' sbs-submission to DEFRA-general licence' consultation report. Yes I agree they are an org we should support, their reports/studies do not shy away from naming the other culprits that effect “song birds” these are the type of people/org you need on your side, their views/reports will have more clout when it comes to putting the control of corvids forward to the general public. I hope more people join as SBS reports/studies are something to wave in the face of WJ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted May 18, 2019 Report Share Posted May 18, 2019 I have also joined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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