Pc Andrew Harper

[The Heron]

I have just read that the appeal to increase the jail terms of those three that caused his death has been rejected, sadly it says it all about this country 

[Newbie to this]

Yes, sad news, but not surprising!

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, The Heron said:

I have just read that the appeal to increase the jail terms of those three that caused his death has been rejected, sadly it says it all about this country 

Did you expect a different decision then ? 

[JohnfromUK]

1 hour ago, Newbie to this said:

Yes, sad news, but not surprising!

Exactly.

[clangerman]

until prison is hard labour with bread and water it’s a waste of time they will sit watching tv phoning their mates getting stoned only hardship will be picking from the menu this has saved giving them a longer holiday at our expense 

[The Heron]

57 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Did you expect a different decision then ? 

Rather nievely in the Circumstances yes 

[Scully]

Hopefully there’ll be a little bit of ‘ pay back ‘ sometime in the future, after release. 🙂

[Westley]

As if to add insult to injury, yet another Officer has been injured on a Supermarket car park. It is believed that it will take some 12 months for him to recover from his injuries. The Offender has been given a 6 1/2 year sentence, sounds reasonable in the current 'slap on wrist' climate, UNTIL you then read that FIVE YEARS of that sentence will be served 'On Licence'  ??   WHEN will we give our Police Officers the support and protection that they deserve   ??

[Rob85]

10 minutes ago, Westley said:

As if to add insult to injury, yet another Officer has been injured on a Supermarket car park. It is believed that it will take some 12 months for him to recover from his injuries. The Offender has been given a 6 1/2 year sentence, sounds reasonable in the current 'slap on wrist' climate, UNTIL you then read that FIVE YEARS of that sentence will be served 'On Licence'  ??   WHEN will we give our Police Officers the support and protection that they deserve   ??

When they begin to routinely arm them in the same fashion as the police in northern ireland. I don't see any reason why they all do not have a sidearm when you consider the threats from lunatics with knives and guns. Let alone driving at them with a car.

A good few years ago a few miles from my house some clown decided to try and run over a police officer to escape a road block that was set up to stop his stolen car. He drove at the officer, went to mount a pavement which would have resulted in quite a few civilian casualties, he received a couple in the chest and I didn't survive long enough to be arrested

[Westley]

Just now, Rob85 said:

When they begin to routinely arm them in the same fashion as the police in northern ireland. I don't see any reason why they all do not have a sidearm when you consider the threats from lunatics with knives and guns. Let alone driving at them with a car.

A good few years ago a few miles from my house some clown decided to try and run over a police officer to escape a road block that was set up to stop his stolen car. He drove at the officer, went to mount a pavement which would have resulted in quite a few civilian casualties, he received a couple in the chest and I didn't survive long enough to be arrested

Having 'been there and done that' I hope that day never comes and so do most currently serving Police Officers.  It is the Courts that MUST be held to account for the paltry sentences being handed out for assaults on Police Officers. It should be a minimum of 10 years for ANY assault on members of the 999 Services.

[Walker570]

As I read it the appeal was withdrawn before a decison could be made.

I'm with Westley on the subject of arming officers.  Sufficient sentences to fit the crime should be the norm and to start with MINIMUM sentences should be set not MAXIMUM.  Get five years you should do five not out in two with a tag.  

[clangerman]

watching the local police liaison officer twitching on the end of a taser on local news would have been even more embarrassing watching the police shoot him so let’s not arm them plus criminals using guns will soar had a chap shot three times two days ago didn’t even make it farther than the local news 

[Scully]

23 minutes ago, Westley said:

Having 'been there and done that' I hope that day never comes and so do most currently serving Police Officers.  It is the Courts that MUST be held to account for the paltry sentences being handed out for assaults on Police Officers. It should be a minimum of 10 years for ANY assault on members of the 999 Services.

The drawback with heavier sentences as you suggest, ‘such as 10 years for ANY assault on members of the 999 services’, ( which I agree with actually ) it’s still too late for the person who is assaulted. 
It’s all well and good sentencing someone to life imprisonment for murder, it’s of no comfort or recompense to the victim. 
Is it not much more desirable to afford someone the choice of a means with which to protect themselves in the first place? 

15 minutes ago, clangerman said:

watching the local police liaison officer twitching on the end of a taser on local news would have been even more embarrassing watching the police shoot him so let’s not arm them plus criminals using guns will soar had a chap shot three times two days ago didn’t even make it farther than the local news 

Criminals are already using guns, as you’ve just pointed out in your post above. 
When do we decide enough is enough? 

[clangerman]

10 minutes ago, Scully said:

The drawback with heavier sentences as you suggest, ‘such as 10 years for ANY assault on members of the 999 services’, ( which I agree with actually ) it’s still too late for the person who is assaulted. 
It’s all well and good sentencing someone to life imprisonment for murder, it’s of no comfort or recompense to the victim. 
Is it not much more desirable to afford someone the choice of a means with which to protect themselves in the first place? 

Criminals are already using guns, as you’ve just pointed out in your post above. 
When do we decide enough is enough? 

same time as they stop shooting the wrong people far far to quick to tazer people let alone shoot them takes the right mind set to hang fire a lot armed now don’t even have it 

[Scully]

3 minutes ago, clangerman said:

same time as they stop shooting the wrong people far far to quick to tazer people let alone shoot them takes the right mind set to hang fire a lot armed now don’t even have it 

We’re talking about protecting yourself and others from assault.
I’m not sure in these circumstances how you would shoot or tazer the wrong person; surely the person who is assaulting you or being an immediate threat would be obvious enough? 

[clangerman]

Just now, Scully said:

We’re talking about protecting yourself and others from assault.
I’m not sure in these circumstances how you would shoot or tazer the wrong person; surely the person who is assaulting you or being an immediate threat would be obvious enough? 

tell that to the chap full of rounds sat on the tube minding his own business something wrong with the training just from body language you can tell when it’s about to kick of proper financial punishment is the way to really hurt criminals 

[Scully]

5 minutes ago, clangerman said:

tell that to the chap full of rounds sat on the tube minding his own business something wrong with the training just from body language you can tell when it’s about to kick of proper financial punishment is the way to really hurt criminals 

As usual you’ve totally missed or ignored the point.
We are talking about defending yourself or others from immediate threat. 

 

[clangerman]

6 minutes ago, Scully said:

As usual you’ve totally missed or ignored the point.
We are talking about defending yourself or others from immediate threat. 

 

quite aware of the point WHEN you are able to recognise a immediate threat fine but many cannot and that’s the problem have to leave it there pups ripped a cable out 

[Scully]

I give up, I really do. 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

[Westley]

21 hours ago, Scully said:

The drawback with heavier sentences as you suggest, ‘such as 10 years for ANY assault on members of the 999 services’, ( which I agree with actually ) it’s still too late for the person who is assaulted. 
It’s all well and good sentencing someone to life imprisonment for murder, it’s of no comfort or recompense to the victim. 
Is it not much more desirable to afford someone the choice of a means with which to protect themselves in the first place? 

Criminals are already using guns, as you’ve just pointed out in your post above. 
When do we decide enough is enough? 

I do NOT agree that it is "Too late for the Person who has been assaulted", I suspect that the victim would get a degree of satisfaction seeing the Offender getting 10 years, as opposed to bloody Community Service or a suspended sentence. WHY do you think so many Offenders will plead 'Not Guilty' to Murder but will plead 'Guilty' to Manslaughter  ?  It is ALL down to the length of sentence and some smart a****d  brief plea bargaining.  Going back to the OP, I think that Officers Family would have been far happier seeing the Offenders going down for Life  !

[Scully]

17 minutes ago, Westley said:

I do NOT agree that it is "Too late for the Person who has been assaulted", I suspect that the victim would get a degree of satisfaction seeing the Offender getting 10 years, as opposed to bloody Community Service or a suspended sentence. WHY do you think so many Offenders will plead 'Not Guilty' to Murder but will plead 'Guilty' to Manslaughter  ?  It is ALL down to the length of sentence and some smart a****d  brief plea bargaining.  Going back to the OP, I think that Officers Family would have been far happier seeing the Offenders going down for Life  !

I completely agree that the families would be far happier with a life sentence, but it is too late and of no comfort to the victim if they are left with life changing injuries or dead. 
Would you rather your son or daughter be allowed the means with which to defend themselves ( regardless of whether they are members of the emergency services or not ) or would you be content that a life sentence is mandatory should either of them be murdered because the law dictates they have no choice but to be a victim? Now do you understand what I’m getting at? 
There are criminals and scum out there quite prepared to use lethal means, it is time like was met with like. 

[Westley]

5 minutes ago, Scully said:

I completely agree that the families would be far happier with a life sentence, but it is too late and of no comfort to the victim if they are left with life changing injuries or dead. 
Would you rather your son or daughter be allowed the means with which to defend themselves ( regardless of whether they are members of the emergency services or not ) or would you be content that a life sentence is mandatory should either of them be murdered because the law dictates they have no choice but to be a victim? Now do you understand what I’m getting at? 
There are criminals and scum out there quite prepared to use lethal means, it is time like was met with like. 

In my day there were far less assaults on Police Officers because we were able to 'defend ourselves'. Knowing this and what they could expect if they chose that route, few really wanted to fight. Today with CCTV and mobile phones everywhere, the hands of the Police are well and truly tied. IF you know you are going to get smacked legs for attacking emergency services, or even walk away without charge, of course you will  'have a go'. One Sergeant summed it up by saying "We are the first people that some of these kids meet who say NO to them" I think that summed it up perfectly.

We could always follow the American example too  !       

[Scully]

3 minutes ago, Westley said:

In my day there were far less assaults on Police Officers because we were able to 'defend ourselves'. Knowing this and what they could expect if they chose that route, few really wanted to fight. Today with CCTV and mobile phones everywhere, the hands of the Police are well and truly tied. IF you know you are going to get smacked legs for attacking emergency services, or even walk away without charge, of course you will  'have a go'. One Sergeant summed it up by saying "We are the first people that some of these kids meet who say NO to them" I think that summed it up perfectly.

We could always follow the American example too  !       

You didn’t answer the question, but then again I knew you wouldn’t. 
In your day ( whenever that was ) you weren’t allowed or even capable of defending yourself anymore than you are today; in fact even less so as I’m assuming tasers weren’t around. 
Coppers were getting shot even then, and they still are, so nothing has changed at all in that respect.
Meanwhile, civilians are being attacked in what seems like ever increasing frequencies, and there’s no one to defend them. It’s a scandalous situation to be in. 

[Saltings]

those pieces of **** dragged him for miles until death knew what they were doing      should hang    

scully  put yourself in his wifes position  or a family member in this scenario  a son or daughter father  grandmother      then spit your ****    turning the other cheek only goes so far    sometimes you have to slap a  ferral they think twice before doing again         if done early enough a law abiding citizen   for life       you might change your stance  if mugged   house robbed  parents or grandparents robbed  mrs carjacked kids robbed afraid to go to collage or uni   in fear  i mean fear          you are a snowflake and       i dont care for your rebuttal  suffered it a few times for not being able to make myself understood  or wright properly        a bully          stand toe to to with me and call me out you will be on you will be on your ****             when young guardi or police come round you got a slap from mother or father for doing wrong            not getting caught   the difference    now shout innocent my child wouldnt  do that from infant class in school  mrs nearly got sacked because some ones little angle said pushed to one side  thankfully cctv lying little bitch with a mother shown the cctv everyone wrong  gives the little ******** the right to be teflon  parents are to blame     scully whats your answer as every one is wrong how would you address feral drug dealing  pimping girls at 15 teen or younger  hooked by lowlifes sell your punany  for drugs    car theft     car jackings      robing grandma for her pension  scum              scully   how would you solve this problem of chime  whats your answar be nice they will be nice back while they spit on your face   officers mates       we have nothing 20yrs ago we cracked sculls go home they went home no dramas            and i dont care if you wright or explain better than me  whats the way forward  by you