Refusal to attend Court.

[Westley]

In Merseyside we appear to be going through a spate of Defendants refusing to attend the Crown Court during their trial. A second high profile trial has just finished and like a  previous similar trial, the Defendant refused to attend Court. How can that possibly be allowed to happen  ?  It shows nothing but contempt for the families of the innocent victims. The Defendant should be dragged before the Judge, in chains if needs be. They are on trial and should not be allowed a choice of whether to bother to turn up or not.  Don't turn up then you are guilty, saves the cost of the trial.

[Genghis]

I think the ones not turning up are the ones obviously guilty. I doubt there’s any innocent people doing this.

[old man]

1 hour ago, Westley said:

In Merseyside we appear to be going through a spate of Defendants refusing to attend the Crown Court during their trial. A second high profile trial has just finished and like a  previous similar trial, the Defendant refused to attend Court. How can that possibly be allowed to happen  ?  It shows nothing but contempt for the families of the innocent victims. The Defendant should be dragged before the Judge, in chains if needs be. They are on trial and should not be allowed a choice of whether to bother to turn up or not.  Don't turn up then you are guilty, saves the cost of the trial.

Maybe shows the current state of the judiciary?

[Scully]

I doubt many defendants have the guts to face the families of victims, which may be one reason. 

[JohnfromUK]

When I did jury service (many years ago) one trial on which we were supposed to be a jury had to be cancelled due to people (a witness I think?) failing to attend having been formally summoned (which I presume means you have to attend).  The judge called the jury in and explained that this was not acceptable - wasting his, the courts and the 'jurors in waiting' as we were called time, and a lot of public money.  He ordered the Police (who had searched for the witness and found they had gone on 'holiday' overseas) to arrest the witness on a charge of contempt of court on their return.

He made it clear to us as 'jury in waiting' that failing to attend a summons was not a trivial offence due to the time and cost wasted and should (and in his court would) result in a contempt charge.

[enfieldspares]

The answer is simple, but would need a change in the law. That unless, at sentencing, the person is present in court then mitigation cannot be considered when sentence is passed. However as far as those that have to deal with getting the person into the dock and all of that they are no doubt "truly thankful". 

[Vince Green]

It's quite possible, given the chaos in the judicial system, that the defendants and witnesses never received the letter telling them to attend court

 

[Rim Fire]

It's simple why the .,? Would appear  will it change the sentence  no so in other words its a finger to the establishment 

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, Vince Green said:

It's quite possible, given the chaos in the judicial system, that the defendants and witnesses never received the letter telling them to attend court

 

I think when I was summonsed (Jury Service) it was a registered/recorded delivery letter.  I also think you had to reply to confirm your eligibility.

[Lloyd90]

1 hour ago, JohnfromUK said:

When I did jury service (many years ago) one trial on which we were supposed to be a jury had to be cancelled due to people (a witness I think?) failing to attend having been formally summoned (which I presume means you have to attend).  The judge called the jury in and explained that this was not acceptable - wasting his, the courts and the 'jurors in waiting' as we were called time, and a lot of public money.  He ordered the Police (who had searched for the witness and found they had gone on 'holiday' overseas) to arrest the witness on a charge of contempt of court on their return.

He made it clear to us as 'jury in waiting' that failing to attend a summons was not a trivial offence due to the time and cost wasted and should (and in his court would) result in a contempt charge.

 

It's all good and well if the courts weren't so unreasonable. 

A friend a colleague got a mail from a judge asking her to attend court of a Friday, she received the message on the Wednesday evening that same week.

She had a holiday booked that was not refundable, could not cancel and she had saves for all year to take her 2 kids on. She went on the holiday.

When the judge complained she sent a sharp reply saying if the court had their act together she would of been given reasonable notice or agreed a suitable date they could attend. 

 

[Bigbob]

When i did jury duty the one witness for the prosecution when asked every question said i cant remember  , we got taken out and brought back in while the judge talked to him he started doing it again he got put in the cells and we got sent home 

At work we caught bike thieves with a pool car when attending court they plead not guilty till they see who turns up then change there plea your left sitting for hours then told you can go home 

[JohnfromUK]

2 minutes ago, Lloyd90 said:

given reasonable notice or agreed a suitable date they could attend. 

 

I can't remember how much notice I had (Jury Service) except that it was quite long.  There were various reasons as well where you could ask to be rescheduled.  I quote;

You might be able to change the date of your jury service to another date within the next 12 months. You’ll need a good reason, for example:

• you’re having an operation
• you’re sitting an exam
• your employer will not give you time off work
• you have a holiday booked
• you’re a new parent

You can only ask to change the date once.

[Lloyd90]

1 minute ago, JohnfromUK said:

I can't remember how much notice I had (Jury Service) except that it was quite long.  There were various reasons as well where you could ask to be rescheduled.  I quote;

You might be able to change the date of your jury service to another date within the next 12 months. You’ll need a good reason, for example:

• you’re having an operation
• you’re sitting an exam
• your employer will not give you time off work
• you have a holiday booked
• you’re a new parent

You can only ask to change the date once.

 

She was asked to attend as a witness rather an as jury. 

[Bigbob]

That's one thing i don't miss about working in the security industry the court appearances where the lawyers tried to make you look stupid though you really where only there to back up the cctv which where downloaded and given to the police so Christ knows where they went as they where never produced in court . and being short on every shift as two guys out a shift would be in court 

[Bigbob]

I remember during the first spell of covid the university was empty apart from us security  , they didn't want us to enter the buildings just sit in the vehicles to show a deterrent to the thieves as the shops where shut they couldn't steal stuff to sell for there fix , They stole all the hire bikes you had to phone up to book them and the company would remotely unlock it and the back lights flashed to show which one in the rack was your hire , Then they bought them all back when they found out the company had trackers in the frames 

Them the usually stole all the high quality bikes out the bike sheds Two youth cycled in on a bike pair of bolt cutters out and cycle a bike each  out one of the gardeners cottages at the entrance to the campus was empty they where storing the stolen bikes in the garage selling them on ebay and only picking them up after they sold them or parts off them , So if the police searched there house there was nothing there 

Theres no fly's on them they know all the tricks 

[Westley]

22 minutes ago, Bigbob said:

That's one thing i don't miss about working in the security industry the court appearances where the lawyers tried to make you look stupid though you really where only there to back up the cctv which where downloaded and given to the police so Christ knows where they went as they where never produced in court . and being short on every shift as two guys out a shift would be in court 

That is the reason none of the Supermarkets pursue prosecutions, if they get the goods back. Too many staff members spending too many hours sitting around Courtrooms, only to have the Offender get some suspended paltry sentence. Not worth the hassle, but good for the Crime figures  !

[Scully]

1 hour ago, Lloyd90 said:

 

It's all good and well if the courts weren't so unreasonable. 

A friend a colleague got a mail from a judge asking her to attend court of a Friday, she received the message on the Wednesday evening that same week.

She had a holiday booked that was not refundable, could not cancel and she had saves for all year to take her 2 kids on. She went on the holiday.

When the judge complained she sent a sharp reply saying if the court had their act together she would of been given reasonable notice or agreed a suitable date they could attend. 

 

This. My ex was summoned and duly attended despite being rotated to work. 
In total I think she attended five times on the train through to Carlisle and never saw the inside of the court room. She was paid a pittance which didn’t even cover her train fare let alone her time off work.