28gm 7.5's for woodies?

[al4x]

bigger shot means you need to hit them with fewer pellets so it can improve your kill ratio if you shoot poorly and are getting birds on the edge of the pattern or the back end of them. Its impressive when you see someone bringing down really good birds with 7's on the game field we've even had guys who have swapped down to even as far as 4.10's and still knock down high pheasants with them. Its more a yank thing than here but sometimes you have to see it done to appreciate what is possible if you point in the right place

[wymberley]

Back on topic.........

 

...........28gm 7.5 for woodpigeon............NO !

 

....but that is just my preference, I eat a lot of them and don`t like to spit out lots of shot and even with the pictures of shot birds I feel that is too much shot in it for eating.

With 6`s I get just one or two in a bird apart from really close shots and another thing is I know that I can shoot longer range birds with far less chance of injuring/pricking them

Nailed!

Where have you been Henry, why didn't you say that 7 pages ago?

Cheers

[Lez325]

ps it was a joke use ing magnums my fav it my smith and westen 6 shot cap gun witch fire s darts can take a pigeon out at 95 yard flyin lol

 

 

Thats true I saw him shoot one

 

on a serious note I use 30 x No6 or 32 x No6 for woodies- never thought about lighter loads- even though there could be a cost saving, stick with what you know, makes sense to me & I knock them down using these cartridges and see no reason to change weights

 

Les

[henry d]

Nailed! My pleasure !

Where have you been Henry, why didn't you say that 7 pages ago? Out shooting, checking on some bucks and foraging, you ?

Cheers

[garygreengrass]

I tried them and found I was injuring and pricking a lot of them I know use 6 or 6 and half 32 gram with a lot better result.

[stevethevanman]

I have tried using these light loads when I started and found them hard to down pigeons, but then again there are many who sohot very well with them, and have the birds to prove it

 

Some I know even down pheasants with them, and not too badly

 

But I find it too hard to down them that way, and I generaly use 32g 61/2.

 

But I have now got some Victory Starlights to try so I will see how I get on

 

I think its personal preferance at the end of the day, some get on with them, some dont, they do kill well enough as its proved by the many people that can take birds with them

 

Steve

Edited July 28, 2010 by stevethevanman

[fortune82]

At the end of the day its horses for courses. Ive had some of my best days decoying with 28 gram 7 or 7.5. If I know the birds will be further out then I will use 32 gram 5 or 6. The 7.5 would probably still kill but the extra load gives more confidence.

 

The last 2 nights I have been flightlining and the birds have been well up due to very little wind. I used full and full choke and 42 gram no.3 which fethced them down brilliantly. No pricked birds and 17 for 24 shots. Wouldnt like to fire too many of these mind!!!!

Edited July 28, 2010 by fortune82

[Dekers]

The length of barrel makes absolutely no difference to the spread. How can it? It has no bearing on the spread at all. The choke is what governs that to a degree.

 

Just because you pattern one cartridge from a box and get a good one does it go hand in hand that the next cartridge will be the same?

 

There is just too many variables.

 

MC

 

You are more than confused and you appear to have ignored my original response (posted again below for you)...the length of the barrel makes a MASSIVE difference in the hypothetical example I listed where the quarry is a fixed distance!!, that is why I took it to extremes to explain...it is simple, lets not get involved in daft suggestions about each cartridge in a box being different or the temperature or wind changing from shot to shot, etc, etc, etc, everything is done on the assumption of like for like!

 

 

Forget choke for the purpose of this.....

 

It makes a very small difference (referring to the 28-30-32inch barrel lengths) but to understand it simply take it to the extreme...you have a 30 yard barrel, put the same cart down that as a 28" barrel and shoot 100% accurately at a target 31 yards away, which do you think is likely to do more damage?

 

Perhaps you would be kind enough to explain why...... The length of barrel makes absolutely no difference to the spread in my example!!

Edited July 28, 2010 by Dekers

[fortune82]

MC

 

You are more than confused and you appear to have ignored my original respose (posted again below for you)...the length of the barrel makes a MASSIVE difference in the hypothetical example I listed where the quarry is a fixed distance!!, that is why I took it to extremes to explain...it is simple, lets not get involved in daft suggestions about each cartridge in a box being different or the temperature or wind changing from shot to shot, etc, etc, etc, everything is done on the assumption of like for like!

 

 

Forget choke for the purpose of this.....

 

It makes a very small difference but to understand it simply take it to the extreme...you have a 30 yard barrel, put the same cart down that as a 28" barrel and shoot 100% accurately at a target 31 yards away, which do you think is likely to do more damage?

 

Perhaps you would be kind enough to explain why...... The length of barrel makes absolutely no difference to the spread in my example!!

 

It all depends on wad type also.

 

A plastic wad and longer barrel will result in tighter patterns.

 

A fibre wad and longer barrel will result in more dispersed patterns as the pellets have more barrel wall abrasion.

[Dunkield]

A plastic wad and longer barrel will result in tighter patterns.

Measurably so, or just in theory?

I don't see spending an extra inch or two inside a barrel making much difference at 30 yards, say

[utectok]

MC

 

You are more than confused and you appear to have ignored my original response (posted again below for you)...the length of the barrel makes a MASSIVE difference in the hypothetical example I listed where the quarry is a fixed distance!!, that is why I took it to extremes to explain...it is simple, lets not get involved in daft suggestions about each cartridge in a box being different or the temperature or wind changing from shot to shot, etc, etc, etc, everything is done on the assumption of like for like!

 

 

Forget choke for the purpose of this.....

 

It makes a very small difference (referring to the 28-30-32inch barrel lengths) but to understand it simply take it to the extreme...you have a 30 yard barrel, put the same cart down that as a 28" barrel and shoot 100% accurately at a target 31 yards away, which do you think is likely to do more damage?

T

Perhaps you would be kind enough to explain why...... The length of barrel makes absolutely no difference to the spread in my example!!

Barrel lenght makes no diffrence to spread of shot just to the feel of the gun and perhaps slight increase in vilocity

[utectok]

Perhaps I should add that the target distance is measured from the point of exit of the shot from the barrels

Edited July 29, 2010 by utectok

[Catamong]

Barrel lenght makes no diffrence to spread of shot just to the feel of the gun and perhaps slight increase in vilocity

 

Yet more nonsense being talked here about "vilocity" whatever that is..?

 

Cat.

[Lez325]

Yet more nonsense being talked here about "vilocity" whatever that is..?

 

Cat.

 

 

Velocity maybe?

 

 

Les

[fortune82]

Measurably so, or just in theory?

I don't see spending an extra inch or two inside a barrel making much difference at 30 yards, say

 

Just in theory of course. I doubt there is any measurable difference between a 25 inch barrel and a 34 inch barrel.

[Cookiemonsterandmerlin.]

I like to think off this subject that there are two types of shooters.

 

The ones with little or no knowlegde of shooting 1000s of pigeons over 15/20 years who know very little about the diffrents between using 28 grams of 7.5s though 26 /28 inch barrels and 32 grams of 6s though 32 inch barrels.

 

The second is the shooters who have shot 1000s of pigeons over the years who know what there on about not somebody who shoots a few rounds a week .

 

Keep it up boys OTH

[Dekers]

MC

 

You are more than confused and you appear to have ignored my original response (posted again below for you)...the length of the barrel makes a MASSIVE difference in the hypothetical example I listed where the quarry is a fixed distance!!, that is why I took it to extremes to explain...it is simple, lets not get involved in daft suggestions about each cartridge in a box being different or the temperature or wind changing from shot to shot, etc, etc, etc, everything is done on the assumption of like for like!

 

 

Forget choke for the purpose of this.....

 

It makes a very small difference (referring to the 28-30-32inch barrel lengths) but to understand it simply take it to the extreme...you have a 30 yard barrel, put the same cart down that as a 28" barrel and shoot 100% accurately at a target 31 yards away, which do you think is likely to do more damage?

 

Perhaps you would be kind enough to explain why...... The length of barrel makes absolutely no difference to the spread in my example!!

 

 

Barrel lenght makes no diffrence to spread of shot just to the feel of the gun and perhaps slight increase in vilocity

 

:unsure:

Edited July 29, 2010 by Dekers

[Dekers]

Perhaps I should add that the target distance is measured from the point of exit of the shot from the barrels

 

 

Exactly so...the shorter the barrel the further you are away and the longer the barrel the closer you are to the target, it may be slight but it makes a difference to the spread at the arrival point if you shoot then standing in the same place! :unsure:

[ziplex]

Way too technical for me, but years back someone on here suggested using 28g 7.5's or similar in the first barrel and a heavier 30/32g 6 in the second.......makes perfect sense but better suited to o/u unders rather than semi's. Get the best of both worlds then :unsure:

[joknob]

Exactly so...the shorter the barrel the further you are away and the longer the barrel the closer you are to the target, it may be slight but it makes a difference to the spread at the arrival point if you shoot then standing in the same place! :unsure:

what a load of ****

[poontang]

Well, i'm no mathematician but i've been doing some number crunching

 

Using a 1/4 choke and at 40yards the spread is roughly 48"

 

Assuming a uniform rate of spread over this distance and using the calculator function on my 'phone i have deduced that for every 1" of spread the shot must travel 30".

 

Therefore for every inch of travel the shot spreads at a rate of 0.03333", so if you're using 28" barrels as opposed to 30" barrels you have an extra 0.06666" spread of shot at 40 yards.

 

Good luck if you can see the difference, though i suspect, like most things in shooting, it's all in the head. :unsure:

[utectok]

That's 1.5 mm at 40yrds! You guys must be good shots to notice that!!!

[Albertan_J]

Wow I was almost tempted to read some of this **** until I read peoples quotes on barrel length velocity blah blah blah blah.

[b682]

Interesting how did the old guns of the past ever kill a pigeon or game with cartridges going so much slower than they are today?

 

 

I Don't buy the story that cheaper parts/components are used in clay cartridges. Look at cheddite web site do they list two grades of cases or primers ?

 

No they do not they make quality cases and primers for the cartridge manufacture to decide on what they are going to use/put in the case.

 

Now the shot maker they seperate out the poor quality shot to sell for cheap cartridges I think not the price of lead is set by the LME they need to get the same price regardless so they can not offer two qualities of shot some round some not so round. They actual charge a fixed price to drop the shot last time I asked Locatelli it was 150 Euros per metric ton then you need to add transport costs and the LME lead price - and buy many tons.

 

Ok so powder - yes a fast powder is cheaper then a slow powder but only by a few euros.

 

Now the wad - plastic lots of manufactures price depends on quantity but again no two quality standards with rejects for clays.

Fibre wads only Diana in Italy now make them (excluding eley) again price depends on quantity and again no two quality standards.

 

 

So back to the cartridge

 

Now the manufacture makes a very small profit on clay cartridges but the quantity is vast eg 3million a month per manufacture.

 

They make a larger profit on pigeon cartridges by adding a little more or slower powder and a few grams more of shot - but the quantity is a lot less.

 

Then they get maximum profit for a short time - game season - make a few minor changes longer case head but price is high so during a short sales window profit is very good.

 

All this is good business, nice sexy boxes, emotive cartridge names etc but the product differs very little for each end application and certainly none of the component are made available to two quality standards, cheap for clays best for game - it is all down to the cartridge manufacture.

 

Quantity is king in this game - e.g. from cheddite website:-

 

This production allows CHEDDITE to be today the first European producer of empty cases and primers on a global market estimated at 1.3 Billon empty cases in Europe and about 4.5 billon shotgun cartridges worldwide.

[duck duster]

lets sum it up,those who shoot a clay load instead of a game load think they know more than cartridge manufacturers and those who need 32g of lead instead of 24 or 28g must be **** shots.