Chris Bb Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 I bought a semi auto shotgun yesterday from a well known RFD. I have to say their service was excellent and the price was fair. I got the gun home and stripped it down for a "look see" and found it was filthy! I haven't a clue when it was last cleaned, there was carbon everywhere, and the choke, whilst free, had rust on its screw area. I dropped the trigger mechanism out and think I found mouse droppings! After an hour of cleaning it now looks good and today shot well, cycling most 21g cartridges, so I'm not complaining. But, shouldn't dealers at least clean such guns before selling them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billytheghillie Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 come on, name and shame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Galore! Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 do they heck as like, as long as it works they'll just wipe it over and stick it on the shelf. mind you mouse fudge is a bit extreme... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruno22rf Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 A full service would be added to the cost so you pays your money.... I like to save money when buying a gun but then get pleasure adding value by servicing them myself-you also get to know the gun better and, sooner or later, you would have stripped and cleaned her anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walt1980 Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 Comes down to time and how much profit is in the gun I spose, you can't spend 2 hours cleaning a gun which your only gonna be making £50 on! A check over, make sure it works, a clean and hopefully out the door!! Times are hard for dealers, balance of service and costs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2meterpeter Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 a lot of guns can be on the shelves as S O R , placed on the dealers books by a customer just to sell for them this is where the dealer will only make a small profit for just selling it . so nothing is done to it just put on show to sell , if the seller has cleaned it , bonus if not it is what it is , i have seen this many times , always best to service it your self when you get it then you get peace of mind , the only way to get a good clean gun from the start is to buy new , Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonny thomas Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 Agree with above for a quick turn around and small profit this is to be expected the wise old craftsman that see as a gunsmith still has to turn a profit However my brother phoned another quite famous rfd in somerset too look at a quite expensive gun and was told "its mint" so to the fat mobile he toddles gets there (from bristol) and in his words "its a ******g mess" really dirty dusty and rust in the barrels Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Al Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 I once bought a really dirty Miroku as it seemed a good gun for relatively little. I took it home, gave it a really good clean and was then horrified to find extensive pitting in the chambers. I was straight on the phone and fortunately the dealer gave me a full refund, although he assured me it was still in proof and was fine to use. I have never been tempted to buy a dirty gun since. Condition is everything - the day you buy is the day you sell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loriusgarrulus Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 I bought a secondhand 410 a while ago. The inside of the barrels were so dirty I couldn't check them. I got the shop to clean it while I waited so I could look at it properly. Its a nice little gun and I did buy it once I could see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveyTed Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 Surely it's shortsighted of the dealer not to inspect and clean the gun. He's responsible for any faults you find after purchase apart from cosmetic. Having said that I purchase a used gun and on inspection in daylight found two small cracks in the stock not noticeable in the artificial shop light. Credit to Essex Gun, he immediately gave me a refund. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunman Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 A lot of dealers wouldn't know how to strip and clean a gun .Just because they hold an RFD does not mean they know much about the workings or indeed much about guns except how to sell them ! I speak from long experience of silly enquiries and doing jobs that really any one with half a brain could do in 5 minutes . Happy to hear that your purchase was successful [eventually] and you have not ben sold a junker . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RossEM Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 I have a bit of an axe to grind on this subject, having had bad experiences both with guns I've bought, guns my friends have bought, and at work with guns we've consigned for auction. At work we see a lot of guns that haven't been looked after, but thankfully we have a very reliable RFD and gunsmith who checks each one thoroughly. My own feeling is that there's no reason that RFDs should clean guns before they're put on sale, BUT, in my opinion guns should be in working condition or at least the RFD should be transparent in his guns being 'sold as seen.' Personally speaking, if I was in business as an RFD I would strip, clean and thoroughly check the barrels, stock and action of every gun I had up for sale, and add the cost to the price of the gun. It's the right thing to do for the customer. Agreed with Gunman, not all RFDs are gunsmiths as such. I know one that doesn't have the means to check bore measurements - more fool them, because if it's discovered that they've sold an out of proof gun, they're in a lot of trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
39TDS Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 (edited) I bought a rifle off a very well known gun dealer who is also a very well known gunsmith. His own exact words to me were "it is a lovely little gun, I have put a few rounds through it myself and it is quite accurate" I got it home and out of the first ten rounds it failed to fire on 6 of them and failed to eject on 8. No freakin way had he put any rounds through it! It was a 150 mile drive for me to collect the gun, I fixed it myself rather than do another 300 mile trip. He might well have tricked me but wasn't much magic about it. Edited March 27, 2015 by 39TDS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bewsher500 Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 i would imagine if dealers spent time and resources cleaning every *** trade in that comes in they would lose money!! I bought a .222 that had a bolt that was FULL with red grease! barrel was so filthy you could barely see the rifling part of the fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett1985 Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 in realistic terms, cleaning a O/U or SXS doesnt take very long... but when you have 20 to do, it becomes a bit of a task. it would be, imho, beneficial to at least make sure the barrells are clean so that the buyer can at least see that. in fairness though, i did buy an O/U from someone once that had spotless bores and felt nice and tight, upon getting it home and stripping it i found about half a tub of red grease and some shim stock wedged in to the hinge pin reccess. after removing it all the gun was loose as a camborne girl on saturday night... partly my own fault so the lesson was learnt to 1. never buy a gun in a rush and 2. always completely strip it down before handing over the money... there is some real chancers in this world! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amazed Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Wasn't there a chap on here not too long back that picked up a 410 from a dealer that had no extractor in place ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett1985 Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Wasn't there a chap on here not too long back that picked up a 410 from a dealer that had no extractor in place ? i believe there was... says alot really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 (edited) The cost of a shotgun service is in the realms of £65, be it that price includes a profit margin. A full strip and clean from £125 upwards. Why would one expect a competitively priced gun to have been serviced at a cost which would no doubt exceed the entire profit on the sale. Pay top dollar and expect the gun to have been serviced or buy cheap and service it yourself...............simple. Me thinks some buyers expect the unreasonable. Edited March 28, 2015 by CharlieT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Bb Posted March 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 The cost of a shotgun service is in the realms of £65, be it that price includes a profit margin. A full strip and clean from £125 upwards. Why would one expect a competitively priced gun to have been serviced at a cost which would no doubt exceed the entire profit on the sale. Pay top dollar and expect the gun to have been serviced or buy cheap and service it yourself...............simple. Me thinks some buyers expect the unreasonable. I wasn't asking for a full service, merely a clean gun. Come on, it's Thursday afternoon, the shop's empty, the phone isn't ringing, why not just clean a gun or two? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr mutley Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 Makes me feel better with my time as an armourer. anything dirty the user would be back to clean, anything rusty would be them getting a fine. Not my choosing that's the rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesP Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 If the bores are dirty, or even greasy from preservative, you stand no chance of assessing them for pitting etc. It is perfectly reasonable to ask a shop to run a rod through so you can examine them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 Any dealer that has dirty guns on his shelves needs avoiding.as for commission sales most charge between 10 and 20% so they are making a decent amount and give no warranty .these cowboys need to go out of business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 The cost of a shotgun service is in the realms of £65, be it that price includes a profit margin. A full strip and clean from £125 upwards. Why would one expect a competitively priced gun to have been serviced at a cost which would no doubt exceed the entire profit on the sale. Pay top dollar and expect the gun to have been serviced or buy cheap and service it yourself...............simple. Me thinks some buyers expect the unreasonable. The cost of the activity is only applicable if they are giving up paid work in order to clean the gun for sale instead. Assume that they are at work anyway, if they are not engaged in any other fee paying work then it is a sunk cost, so running a mop through the barrels and a general wipe down is not onerous and adds no additional cost to the product. I see it as just taking pride in the service the shop offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett1985 Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 Any dealer that has dirty guns on his shelves needs avoiding.as for commission sales most charge between 10 and 20% so they are making a decent amount and give no warranty .these cowboys need to go out of business. The cost of the activity is only applicable if they are giving up paid work in order to clean the gun for sale instead. Assume that they are at work anyway, if they are not engaged in any other fee paying work then it is a sunk cost, so running a mop through the barrels and a general wipe down is not onerous and adds no additional cost to the product. I see it as just taking pride in the service the shop offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruno22rf Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 (edited) The used Guns at my local dealer (gun & country) are about as clean as they can be-I've even seen the owner wiping them over after I have picked one up just to look at it, but he is not a Gunsmith so I would expect any servicing or repairs that need doing to be added to the price. Edited March 31, 2015 by bruno22rf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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