Cartridge price drop

[bostonmick]

Yes you read it correct.been told by two dealers that some prices are coming down a little.

[Guest stevo]

Hallelujah !!!

 

Any ideas on who will be the first to try this new phenomenon Mick ?

[Rupert]

Sell your stockpile now while its high

[matone]

Perhaps sales have stalled after lots of people bought stocks pre increase ! Supply & demand will always dictate the market.

[Wilts#Dave]

Rather than go up £40 a thousand they'll go back to original price? Might be a start!

[figgy]

Perhaps they found when they contacted dealers, the dealers said no thanks I haven't sold the last lot yet no one wants them at the price they are. The large Manufacturers need to keep making and selling them. No good keeping stopping production due to poor sales.

 

Hope it's a trend that continues.

[8 shot]

Pigs might fly, In your dreams etc. etc. £5/1000 max. it's has all ready be said big companies have a stock pile they need to get rid of. Only short term keep up the pressure buy the cheapest. Happens with oil prices

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Watching with interest!

[bostonmick]

Any move downwards is welcome.be it £5 it is still the right way.and let's not forget the biggest profit made from cartridge sales is by our caring government with vat.but this will no doubt change when we are out of the eu.as it is in other countries outside of it.ie no vat

[johnnytheboy]

Perhaps sales have stalled after lots of people bought stocks pre increase ! Supply & demand will always dictate the market.

We were actually talking about this yesterday, with that price hike sales have bound to have dropped! I for one have been raking out all old cartridges and running the supply down before buying more and I'll bet a lot of folk are the same! There has to be a moves towards budget cartridges rather than the premium range as we now know that they perform just as well, if not better!

[Rupert]

We were actually talking about this yesterday, with that price hike sales have bound to have dropped! I for one have been raking out all old cartridges and running the supply down before buying more and I'll bet a lot of folk are the same! There has to be a moves towards budget cartridges rather than the premium range as we now know that they perform just as well, if not better!

In addition to this, as increases were well known before they arrived i bet a lot, like me bought strongly and are now shooting from stock.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

In addition to this, as increases were well known before they arrived i bet a lot, like me bought strongly and are now shooting from stock.

 

Yes, I stocked up a bit.

[johnnytheboy]

In addition to this, as increases were well known before they arrived i bet a lot, like me bought strongly and are now shooting from stock.

I was wishing I'd bought more I.e. a lorry load

[anser2]

Could because the pound is recovering slightly against the dollar from last June and that will effect the cost of lead and oil from which the cases and wads are made and cheaper transport.

Edited May 8, 2017 by anser2

[MattSoanes]

I was told today Kent velocity are coming down £10/1000.

[buze]

Now they just have to explain to us why 410's are more expensive than 12's -- surely the price of 'lead' ought to be a factor, right?

[walt1980]

.410 and pretty much anything other than 12 Bore is more expensive because of the amount of 12 that's produced compared to the others.

[buze]

.410 and pretty much anything other than 12 Bore is more expensive because of the amount of 12 that's produced compared to the others.

 

How does that work? because it's not like it's perishable or harder to make, and they are even actually quite small so the stockpile part isn't even a problem.

 

Seriously, there are things were there is an 'economy of scale' but I don't see diverting an idle machine to make the next 6 months stock of 410 is going to cost as much as the 12, *especially* when they just told us that the lead price was actually so much part of the price that they needed to raise the price of the carts by 20%...

 

I call BEEEPhit :-)

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Economy of scale!

[hitclays]

First to blink are Express with there English Sporter range,Down £11.50 / 1000 Trade

[Hamster]

 

How does that work? because it's not like it's perishable or harder to make, and they are even actually quite small so the stockpile part isn't even a problem.

 

Seriously, there are things were there is an 'economy of scale' but I don't see diverting an idle machine to make the next 6 months stock of 410 is going to cost as much as the 12, *especially* when they just told us that the lead price was actually so much part of the price that they needed to raise the price of the carts by 20%...

 

I call BEEEPhit :-)

 

On the money again buze , I can see it being very slightly more complex and fiddly loading .410 shells but the arguments given for the huge extra costs are bs methinks. If stopping machines and retooling was really such a big deal then someone would have simply set up on his own with just a single machine doing nothing but .410 shells every single day and cleaned up, no brainer.

[neutron619]

 

On the money again buze , I can see it being very slightly more complex and fiddly loading .410 shells but the arguments given for the huge extra costs are bs methinks. If stopping machines and retooling was really such a big deal then someone would have simply set up on his own with just a single machine doing nothing but .410 shells every single day and cleaned up, no brainer.

 

I'd be interested to hear George's take on this. I suspect there's a regular re-tuning required after every 100k, 1M cartridges or whatever to make sure everything's still within spec. We can accept a few deformities on our home loads, but would you really be happy paying £9 for a box of game shells that had collapsed crimps or bulged cases?

 

Whether re-tooling is hard work or not (and the problem is, it costs wages, whereas just leaving the machines running costs power and space but little else), it's just because (sadly, perhaps) the small gauges are a niche market.

 

The lady at Stutleys near Royston was kind enough to let me wander round their cartridge "cage" for 10 mins the other day to see what they had. If they had fewer than 50 brands of 12 gauge cartridges, I'd be surprised. On the other hand, they had 3 or possibly 4 brands for .410, and that's including variations in load / shot size. (Helpfully, two of them were of interest.)

 

Demand: low. Supply: low. Price: high.

 

Simples.

Edited May 9, 2017 by neutron619

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Simples!

[Rewulf]

 

I'd be interested to hear George's take on this. I suspect there's a regular re-tuning required after every 100k, 1M cartridges or whatever to make sure everything's still within spec. We can accept a few deformities on our home loads, but would you really be happy paying £9 for a box of game shells that had collapsed crimps or bulged cases?

 

Whether re-tooling is hard work or not (and the problem is, it costs wages, whereas just leaving the machines running costs power and space but little else), it's just because (sadly, perhaps) the small gauges are a niche market.

 

The lady at Stutleys near Royston was kind enough to let me wander round their cartridge "cage" for 10 mins the other day to see what they had. If they had fewer than 50 brands of 12 gauge cartridges, I'd be surprised. On the other hand, they had 3 or possibly 4 brands for .410, and that's including variations in load / shot size. (Helpfully, two of them were of interest.)

 

Demand: low. Supply: low. Price: high.

 

Simples.

 

Or is it price high = demand low ?

Ive often thought about a getting a moderated .410 for the kids to practice with, but the price of carts puts me right off.

[neutron619]

 

Or is it price high = demand low ?

Ive often thought about a getting a moderated .410 for the kids to practice with, but the price of carts puts me right off.

 

I think they're a specialist product.

 

Compare the number of threads asking the question "will a 30g cartridge be better than a 28g cartridge?" with respect to 12 gauge that get asked round here (answer: just shoot the damned gun!) with the number about .410 / 28ga cartridges and also the level of detail involved in the discussion. I realize my own input probably doesn't help keep the latter threads straightforward, but it tends to be a small handful of shooters asking much more difficult questions than the average "28g or 30g" thread. That's an indication - to me at least - that it's somewhat niche.

 

Given that, the manufacturers know that they can charge a premium - particularly on .410 and 28 gauge - because there's no affordable way to reload those gauges. I pay what I have to, to get the load I want. One day, I'll reload (because it's fun), but in the absence of a Lee press or other cheap equivalent, you're looking at a £300-400 step cost for a MEC and kit to get started. If I use a .410 for mooching around on a Sunday afternoon and shoot an average of 5 shells at £8/box per outing, 3 times per month, that's about 6 years' worth of cartridges. If they charge £10/box, it's still nearly 5 years. I also get a commercial, consistent product, rather than a potentially crappy hand load.

 

If we were all using four boxes a fortnight for clay shooting, they'd be a lot cheaper because people wouldn't pay that premium. A cheap reloading press would exist. The market would be bigger and prices would fall from competition. Outside of a few serious skeet shooters though, I doubt many of us are churning through that many shells.