F1.

[Hamster]

Vettel needed further punishment than 10 seconds,he thought Hamilton was going for it and didnt as leader was his choice,but Vettel rammed him by mistake and in his fury then used his car to attack Hamiltons,what the ####

Think Hamilton has matured over last few years and he needed to.

Vestappen is the one to watch.

 

I agree on all points, the trouble with Vettel is pretty much what the trouble was with Schumi, they both operate at 110% commitment level with a zombi like attitude to wins, going back on team/team mate agreements is not an issue (remember Webber), Schumi parked his car in the middle of the road when he spun in quali because his mind works that way, they make split second decisions (which are always focused on their immediate self advantage) Schumi also rammed Damon off when he spun under race pressure but that time it worked out, when he in later years rammed Jacques Villenuve it didn't work out, nor when he tried to push Ruben into the wall.

 

Vettel was smelling a win, he was frustrated being behind Lewis, he made an error and damaged his car, in the time it takes you and I to think *** just happened he analysed the situation, decided the best defence was attack, had to lay blame on Lewis having brake tested him, went alongside and in a moment of rage swiped Lewis's car .

 

Schumi did it with Coulthard, remember when he rammed him in the rain going too fast he didn't need to lap Coulthard, he could have waited for less spray but instead of admitting being a plonker he strode into McLaren's garage and tried to physically hit Coulthard. You win races by finishing in front of everyone in the slowest pace possible not fastest, fastest will bite back.

[ditchman]

 

I agree on all points, the trouble with Vettel is pretty much what the trouble was with Schumi, they both operate at 110% commitment level with a zombi like attitude to wins, going back on team/team mate agreements is not an issue (remember Webber), Schumi parked his car in the middle of the road when he spun in quali because his mind works that way, they make split second decisions (which are always focused on their immediate self advantage) Schumi also rammed Damon off when he spun under race pressure but that time it worked out, when he in later years rammed Jacques Villenuve it didn't work out, nor when he tried to push Ruben into the wall.

 

Vettel was smelling a win, he was frustrated being behind Lewis, he made an error and damaged his car, in the time it takes you and I to think *** just happened he analysed the situation, decided the best defence was attack, had to lay blame on Lewis having brake tested him, went alongside and in a moment of rage swiped Lewis's car .

 

Schumi did it with Coulthard, remember when he rammed him in the rain going too fast he didn't need to lap Coulthard, he could have waited for less spray but instead of admitting being a plonker he strode into McLaren's garage and tried to physically hit Coulthard. You win races by finishing in front of everyone in the slowest pace possible not fastest, fastest will bite back.

 

 

agree with all that...........i could not stand schumaker...thought he was a **** of the highest order...............think hamilton has matured....i ...(like others) are waiting to see how vestappen pans out.........and bottas is a bore..........

 

shame webber isnt about....he was a good abassador for his country and the sport... Alonso needs a decent car........i hope he gets it before it is too late

[Dunkield]

 

Jumped into a very good McLaren, then bailed at the right time then into another good car which rapidly became an all winning car,

 

 

He would have played a major part in that.

I don't think any of the current line up of drivers are gods, but he has undeniable talent - its just the overhead it comes with that must be really annoying for his employers

[Twistedsanity]

Sorry but that's just rubbish.

Are you aware that even in FIA GT racing before each race they perform the "balance of performance" where a Porsche and ferrari.loving driver takes everyone's cars round the track and then by means of adding weight(ballast) and putting tiny little air restrictors in the intakes cripples everything else so the ferraris and Porsche can keep up and the nice folks who have paid a kings ransom.for their glorified fiat's and vw's loose face? Did you not realise that tg was all scripted? Even bernie admitted that it was fixed by powers that were beyond his control! FIA actually stands for Ferrari International Assistance :-) , I have been round Silverstone in a FIA gt3 scuderia as a member of the press on a test day and the roadgoing stock corvette Z06 we went there in with Road tyres on was faster in the straights and braking later in the corners, it's all fixed

[Scully]

Are you aware that even in FIA GT racing before each race they perform the "balance of performance" where a Porsche and ferrari.loving driver takes everyone's cars round the track and then by means of adding weight(ballast) and putting tiny little air restrictors in the intakes cripples everything else so the ferraris and Porsche can keep up and the nice folks who have paid a kings ransom.for their glorified fiat's and vw's loose face? Did you not realise that tg was all scripted? Even bernie admitted that it was fixed by powers that were beyond his control! FIA actually stands for Ferrari International Assistance :-) , I have been round Silverstone in a FIA gt3 scuderia as a member of the press on a test day and the roadgoing stock corvette Z06 we went there in with Road tyres on was faster in the straights and braking later in the corners, it's all fixed

I don't care if you've driven Donald Trumps golf buggy; you're still talking sphericals.

There may be tampering of many descriptions but none of it is 'fixed' in the manner in which the term implies.

There are far too many possible scenarios for the outcome of a race to be forecast with certainty.

[Me matt]

Are you aware that even in FIA GT racing before each race they perform the "balance of performance"

Are you aware that is also the format for BTCC- they even have a reverse grid rule for the third race of the day?

 

Altgough why your comparing one racing series to another to justify your incorect comment eludes me....

[vampire]

Vettel needed further punishment than 10 seconds,he thought Hamilton was going for it and didnt as leader was his choice,but Vettel rammed him by mistake and in his fury then used his car to attack Hamiltons,what the ####

Think Hamilton has matured over last few years and he needed to.

Vestappen is the one to watch.

 

 

 

I agree on all points, the trouble with Vettel is pretty much what the trouble was with Schumi, they both operate at 110% commitment level with a zombi like attitude to wins, going back on team/team mate agreements is not an issue (remember Webber), Schumi parked his car in the middle of the road when he spun in quali because his mind works that way, they make split second decisions (which are always focused on their immediate self advantage) Schumi also rammed Damon off when he spun under race pressure but that time it worked out, when he in later years rammed Jacques Villenuve it didn't work out, nor when he tried to push Ruben into the wall.

 

Vettel was smelling a win, he was frustrated being behind Lewis, he made an error and damaged his car, in the time it takes you and I to think *** just happened he analysed the situation, decided the best defence was attack, had to lay blame on Lewis having brake tested him, went alongside and in a moment of rage swiped Lewis's car .

 

Schumi did it with Coulthard, remember when he rammed him in the rain going too fast he didn't need to lap Coulthard, he could have waited for less spray but instead of admitting being a plonker he strode into McLaren's garage and tried to physically hit Coulthard. You win races by finishing in front of everyone in the slowest pace possible not fastest, fastest will bite back.

Every thing he said

 

 

 

agree with all that...........i could not stand schumaker...thought he was a **** of the highest order...............think hamilton has matured....i ...(like others) are waiting to see how vestappen pans out.........and bottas is a bore..........

 

shame webber isnt about....he was a good abassador for his country and the sport... Alonso needs a decent car........i hope he gets it before it is too late

And him

 

I don't care if you've driven Donald Trumps golf buggy; you're still talking sphericals.

There may be tampering of many descriptions but none of it is 'fixed' in the manner in which the term implies.

There are far too many possible scenarios for the outcome of a race to be forecast with certainty.

I wouldn't say it was fixed,say scripted like wrestling but it is a business so money and the red car speaks

[Scully]

[quote name="vampire" post="3279411" timestamp="1498581002

 

I wouldn't say it was fixed,say scripted like wrestling but it is a business so money and the red car speaks

Wrestling is fixed to the extent the winner is known ( to those involved ) beforehand.

F1 isn't.

[ShootingEgg]

 

 

I wouldn't say it was fixed,say scripted like wrestling but it is a business so money and the red car speaks

The red cars have always been favoured. A bit like fergie time in football.

[Savhmr]

 

Statistically titles decided in the last race stand at 43% which falls a little short of "never see champion until the very last race".

 

I have been immensely enjoying myself reading expert commentary everywhere who seemingly know how F1 car telemetry works with photo's showing he brake tested Vettel (since categorically proved otherwise). I would be interested in hearing from some of these experts as to how you can "fix" wins or losses for that matter when the main element in the car is the driver who more often than not look as though they're about to burst into tears when they come second.

 

I have never liked Vettel and have said he needed to prove himself outside of RedBull which practically gifted him 4 titles, he has time and again proved he has the need to win at all costs which for me is ugly (never took to Schumi for similar reasons) BUT I will come out and admit that when all is said and done he is a fast driver and deserving of his Ferrari seat. Even factoring in the fact he is beating a worn out Kimi he has shown some great pace and results. Still think he's a ****.

 

 

I agree. It isn't the first, or even the second time that Vettel has deliberately and blatantly driven into someone (he even did it to one of his previous team mates) and puts me in mind of Schumacker who often wanted the win by any means, fair or fowl. I don't give a damn how talented a driver is. When they show bad sport and dangerous driving, they need taking off the track and disqualifying...no right of appeal.

 

It was Hamilton's prerogative to control the pace, and having watched countless replays of the incident, he didn't brake test, but simply didn't accelerate from the apex as expected and Vettel's throttle was on a hair trigger with a heavy right boot as he didn't want Hamilton to get the jump on him. What made him angry wasn't Hamilton I reckon, but the fact that he caught himself out and took it out on Hamilton. From Hamilton's perspective, it was a canny move in some ways as he was clearly playing head games with Vettel and he showed his professionalism by staying cool, unlike the temperamental German.

 

I don't especially like Hamilton, but I do respect him, and despite the naysayers (best car blah blah bleeding blah), has proved himself time and time again as one of the best racers and one of the most talented. He can pull surprises out of the hat when least expected and always drives with determination and a will to win. Bit of a playboy and too much in love with himself, but lets face it, to be a good, no great, racing driver, there's always a huge sense of ego and self belief involved.

 

I thought it was a cracking race, but Vettel ought to have been disqualified. The disgrace was that he wasn't.

Edited June 27, 2017 by Savhmr

[ShootingEgg]

 

I thought it was a cracking race, but Vettel ought to have been disqualified. The disgrace was that he wasn't.

Cant argue with this.

[shaun4860]

 

 

I agree. It isn't the first, or even the second time that Vettel has deliberately and blatantly driven into someone (he even did it to one of his previous team mates) and puts me in mind of Schumacker who often wanted the win by any means, fair or fowl. I don't give a damn how talented a driver is. When they show bad sport and dangerous driving, they need taking off the track and disqualifying...no right of appeal.

 

Hamilton also has history in driving team mates off the track......Tried to take Button off in the epic Canadian race, also ran Rosberg off track at a race I forget the location,

 

Someone said earlier that Hamilton had matured?......almost laughable.....in the Baku race he was telling the team to tell Bottas to slow down to slow Vettel down......me me me where Hamilton is concerned,

 

Remember the "They pick on me cos I is black" comment?.....nobody picks on you son regardless of your colour,

 

Austria a couple of years ago, by his own admission he was really tired during the race as he had got up at daft O'clock because he wanted to go to a film set, I think it was a Speilberg film.....How professional

 

As you can see I don't like hamilton, not a team player......over rated by many.....

 

 

[chrisjpainter]

Hamilton also has history in driving team mates off the track......Tried to take Button off in the epic Canadian race, also ran Rosberg off track at a race I forget the location,

 

Someone said earlier that Hamilton had matured?......almost laughable.....in the Baku race he was telling the team to tell Bottas to slow down to slow Vettel down......me me me where Hamilton is concerned,

 

Remember the "They pick on me cos I is black" comment?.....nobody picks on you son regardless of your colour,

 

Austria a couple of years ago, by his own admission he was really tired during the race as he had got up at daft O'clock because he wanted to go to a film set, I think it was a Speilberg film.....How professional

 

As you can see I don't like hamilton, not a team player......over rated by many.....

 

 

True

[AVB]

Hamilton also has history in driving team mates off the track......Tried to take Button off in the epic Canadian race, also ran Rosberg off track at a race I forget the location,

 

Someone said earlier that Hamilton had matured?......almost laughable.....in the Baku race he was telling the team to tell Bottas to slow down to slow Vettel down......me me me where Hamilton is concerned,

 

Remember the "They pick on me cos I is black" comment?.....nobody picks on you son regardless of your colour,

 

Austria a couple of years ago, by his own admission he was really tired during the race as he had got up at daft O'clock because he wanted to go to a film set, I think it was a Speilberg film.....How professional

 

As you can see I don't like hamilton, not a team player......over rated by many.....

 

 

What rubbish. The vast majority of F1 drivers, past and present, say that Hamilton is one of the top drivers ever.

 

And his request to the team in Baku was "if Bottas isn't fighting anybody for a place then get him to slow down and back Vettel up". Which is totally sensible.

 

What top F1 driver is a team player? I believe that to be a champion you have to be single minded.

[Savhmr]

Exacterly.

[Hamster]

If you're going to criticise drivers for asking team mates to slow people then Michael was the peerless number 1, he actually had it written into his contracts. F1 is insanely expensive and sponsors expect results, it is invariably the Teams themselves that would do everything to ensure one of their drivers win (that alone blows the myth on fixing) so getting one to move out of the way or indeed to slow others down is par for the course, I have never personally seen anything wrong in that, not even when Schumi practiced it.

[sako751sg]

Hamilton also has history in driving team mates off the track......Tried to take Button off in the epic Canadian race, also ran Rosberg off track at a race I forget the location,

 

Someone said earlier that Hamilton had matured?......almost laughable.....in the Baku race he was telling the team to tell Bottas to slow down to slow Vettel down......me me me where Hamilton is concerned,

 

Remember the "They pick on me cos I is black" comment?.....nobody picks on you son regardless of your colour,

 

Austria a couple of years ago, by his own admission he was really tired during the race as he had got up at daft O'clock because he wanted to go to a film set, I think it was a Speilberg film.....How professional

 

As you can see I don't like hamilton, not a team player......over rated by many.....

 

 

 

Absolutely.

After what Hamilton did to Rosberg in the final race of last season no team mate should trust him again,period.

[AVB]

 

Absolutely.

After what Hamilton did to Rosberg in the final race of last season no team mate should trust him again,period.

 

 

The majority of drivers would have done the same. No divers trust their team mate anymore than they trust any other driver. Too much at stake. Team orders may dictate specific actions towards your teammate but that's about it. As a race driver your closest rival is always your team mate. He has the same car as you, access to the same facilities etc. Beat him and you have proven that you are the better driver.

[Savhmr]

 

Absolutely.

After what Hamilton did to Rosberg in the final race of last season no team mate should trust him again,period.

 

Seriously?

 

I think that if a tit-for-tat approach was taken here, Rosberg by far was the more unsporting team mate in their tenure together, and openly gloated at bad luck experienced by Hamilton, even when it wasn't him causing the "bad luck"!

 

We can all probably pick out events where most drivers have over-stepped the mark, but lets not forget that adrenaline runs high along with emotions, and there's a world of difference between a racing incident, especially where two drivers are going at it like hammer and tongs, than in any deliberate attempt to knock someone off the track or deliberately crash into them.

 

The OP was about Vettel, and distractions to one side, the man should have been disqualified. It was the most disgusting display of dangerous driving and unprofessionalism in a racing driver than I've seen in over 40 years of F1 racing. Some role model.

Edited June 28, 2017 by Savhmr

[sako751sg]

 

Seriously?

 

I think that if a tit-for-tat approach was taken here, Rosberg by far was the more unsporting team mate in their tenure together, and openly gloated at bad luck experienced by Hamilton, even when it wasn't him causing the "bad luck"!

 

We can all probably pick out events where most drivers have over-stepped the mark, but lets not forget that adrenaline runs high along with emotions, and there's a world of difference between a racing incident, especially where two drivers are going at it like hammer and tongs, than in any deliberate attempt to knock someone off the track or deliberately crash into them.

 

The OP was about Vettel, and distractions to one side, the man should have been disqualified. It was the most disgusting display of dangerous driving and unprofessionalism in a racing driver than I've seen in over 40 years of F1 racing. Some role model.

 

You must take the blinkers off.

If thats the most disgusting and dangerous driving you have seen in 40 years you DKSA F1.

[Pistol p]

Just goes to show F1 is doing fine again. It's got a bunch of duffers on a forum, who've never taken part in an F1 race, talking about it.

Bad publicity is better that no publicity.

[shaun4860]

 

The OP was about Vettel, and distractions to one side, the man should have been disqualified. It was the most disgusting display of dangerous driving and unprofessionalism in a racing driver than I've seen in over 40 years of F1 racing. Some role model.

You don't remember Senna deliberately taking Prost out then to take the world title in Suzuka in 1990? ( By his own admission)

 

You don't remember Schumacher trying to take Villeneuve at Jerez in 1997?

 

Also Schumacher deliberately taking Hill out in Australia 1997 again to win the title?

 

It's always gone on but whenever Hamilton is involved he is always innocent....

 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Shaun

 

The sun shines out of Lewis's butt!

[AVB]

You don't remember Senna deliberately taking Prost out then to take the world title in Suzuka in 1990? ( By his own admission)

 

You don't remember Schumacher trying to take Villeneuve at Jerez in 1997?

 

Also Schumacher deliberately taking Hill out in Australia 1997 again to win the title?

 

It's always gone on but whenever Hamilton is involved he is always innocent....

 

Hamilton isn't alway innocent but in this case I can't see how any sensible person can't see that he was. Haters will always hate is suppose.

[Savhmr]

You don't remember Senna deliberately taking Prost out then to take the world title in Suzuka in 1990? ( By his own admission)

 

You don't remember Schumacher trying to take Villeneuve at Jerez in 1997?

 

Also Schumacher deliberately taking Hill out in Australia 1997 again to win the title?

 

It's always gone on but whenever Hamilton is involved he is always innocent....

 

 

Yes, I do remember those, but I've never seen such a blatantly obvious display of anger behind the wheel as Vettels.

 

All the previous incidents mentioned were un-sporting (and I include Hamilton in this) but I have never seen such a blatantly bad tempered display of unprofessionalism which is I guess the point.

 

I don't understand all the Hamilton bashing here. I'm not his biggest fan, as I think he's a bit of an over-paid prima-donna but he is arguably one of the most talented drivers in F1 at the minute, along with the unfortunate Alonso, Vettel and more precocious talent of Verstappen. There's not a lot to chose between any at the top, but one thing I cannot abide is outward unprofessional displays of bad temper. I don't mind and even understand high octane emotion in adrenaline fuelled sports. I'll say it again, Vettel is a bad tempered, green eyed, unprofessional tw*t who should have been disqualified. He's renowned for his potty-mouthed rants when things aren't going his way and to take things out on the lead driver the way that he did ought to have black flagged him. We're not talking about anyone else, just him. It's not about tit-for-tat, it's about that particular race. Every race has to be judged on its merits and that one left a bad taste in the mouth of anyone who likes to see fair play. It could be someone else next time, but this time, it was 100% Vettel.

Edited June 29, 2017 by Savhmr