Labour's new policy

[Mice!]

11 hours ago, clumber said:

Found this-

By BBC business editor Simon Jack

Many companies offer incentives and discounts to employees who wish to build a shareholding over time. That is not the same as taking 10% of the company away from its current owners to stick in a fund for the workers and the government's benefit, which seems to be what the shadow chancellor is proposing.

For a start, the workers will not be able to buy and sell the shares - so they won't really "own" them in a traditional sense. They will be eligible to receive dividends on the shares up to a value of £500 per worker per year. The government gets the rest.

The Labour Party reckons this will raise about £2bn a year. It could end up much more. Let's take just one company - bumper dividend-payer Shell. Ten percent of its £12bn annual dividend comes to £1.2bn.

If each of its 6,500 UK employees got £500 each (totalling £3.25m) that leaves £1.116bn for the government. That's just from one company - every year. 

that can't be right, it would mean the labour party were using workers to fleece companies out of money??

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Labour use Dianne Abbott to check their Mathematics!

[JJsDad]

2 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Labour use Dianne Abbott to check their Mathematics!

Good answer. I had almost forgoten that fiasco.

[JohnfromUK]

Labour have also said that they will double Council Tax on second homes.  Note that MPs claim full rebate on Council Tax on their second home, so will pay NO EXTRA.

Fair isn't it.  For the many, not the few,  For the general public, not the MP

Edited September 25, 2018 by JohnfromUK

[Vince Green]

1 hour ago, Mice! said:

that can't be right, it would mean the labour party were using workers to fleece companies out of money??

It is effectively partial Nationalisation by stealth. These Commies never change do they?

[Vince Green]

34 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

Labour have also said that they will double Council Tax on second homes.  

So just form a limited company or a trust, or put the second house in the wife's name. The thing about labour is they are so stupid its actually embarrassing.

But just to play Devils Advocate for a moment, how would that apply to rented out properties?

Or if I didn't tell them, how would one Council know whether I had a second property in another part of the country?.

Edited September 25, 2018 by Vince Green

[Gordon R]

Quote

Fair isn't it.  For the many, not the few,  For the general public, not the MP

Labour's new slogan - "For the many, not the Jew". They are an anti-Semitic disgrace.

[Vince Green]

34 minutes ago, Gordon R said:

Labour's new slogan - "For the many, not the Jew". They are an anti-Semitic disgrace.

I don't believe they are anti semitic as such, I do think they are anti American and America supports Israel. Corbyn and his cronies instinctively align with anyone that the rest of us would consider persona non gratis. That is because they delude themselves by thinking they have deeper insight into situations than us mere mortals could ever have.

A lot of left wing politics actually comes from people who believe they have a superior view of the world but when you break it down it just turns out to be our views reversed and criticised, because it makes them feel superior.to do so

[Gordon R]

Vince - rare occasion when we disagree - I think they are anti-Semitic.

[Mice!]

20 minutes ago, Gordon R said:

Vince - rare occasion when we disagree - I think they are anti-Semitic.

I certainly think those in charge are and i just don't get it at all.

[KB1]

49 minutes ago, Vince Green said:

I don't believe they are anti semitic as such, I do think they are anti American and America supports Israel. Corbyn and his cronies instinctively align with anyone that the rest of us would consider persona non gratis. That is because they delude themselves by thinking they have deeper insight into situations than us mere mortals could ever have.

A lot of left wing politics actually comes from people who believe they have a superior view of the world but when you break it down it just turns out to be our views reversed and criticised, because it makes them feel superior.to do so

In my lifetime, I dont think I would ever vote Labour, and certainly not the current shambles.  However, a number of my Jewish clients/aquaintances agree with your sentiments above, and furthermore, the Jewish community are divided on this issue, with some suggesting that Labour's code in fact enhances the IHRA document.  Sometimes, I think we are too easily sucked into the Media's hype in joining them on the rooftop shouting "Racist", "Anti-Semite" etc, without necessarily reading the smallprint.

[JohnfromUK]

Labour MP's Democracy policy: Laura Smith, the MP for Crewe and Nantwich, wants to bring the government down by general strike in the absence of a general election.

“Comrades, we must topple this cruel and callous Tory government as soon as we can. And if we can’t get a general election,” she told the crowd, “we should organise with our brothers and sisters in the trade unions to bring an end to this government with a general strike.”

If you don't get the government you want, bully the public into a new vote.  Shades of new referendum on Brexit where they didn't get what they wanted?

[Vince Green]

13 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

Labour MP's Democracy policy: Laura Smith, the MP for Crewe and Nantwich, wants to bring the government down by general strike in the absence of a general election.

“Comrades, we must topple this cruel and callous Tory government as soon as we can. And if we can’t get a general election,” she told the crowd, “we should organise with our brothers and sisters in the trade unions to bring an end to this government with a general strike.”

If you don't get the government you want, bully the public into a new vote.  Shades of new referendum on Brexit where they didn't get what they wanted?

That speech could have come from Arthur Scargill, nothing changes does it?

[JohnfromUK]

9 minutes ago, Vince Green said:

That speech could have come from Arthur Scargill, nothing changes does it?

If you don't do what we ask, we will strike and make you.  Democracy at work, Labour style. 

It was also noted in the article there were many other Labour MPs there including minor shadow appointments who applauded, and McDonnell had been on the same platform in the same meeting earlier, but tactfully left before that speech.

[Newbie to this]

27 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

Labour MP's Democracy policy: Laura Smith, the MP for Crewe and Nantwich, wants to bring the government down by general strike in the absence of a general election.

“Comrades, we must topple this cruel and callous Tory government as soon as we can. And if we can’t get a general election,” she told the crowd, “we should organise with our brothers and sisters in the trade unions to bring an end to this government with a general strike.”

If you don't get the government you want, bully the public into a new vote.  Shades of new referendum on Brexit where they didn't get what they wanted?

That'll be a new one, the workers going out on strike because the students can't get what they want.

[henry d]

Things are changing radically anyway, social enterprises, workers buying out the owners, (most) people don`t sit still and allow things to happen to them especially in these times when wages have moved little and the future is uncertain. Check out Novograf for one.

[JohnfromUK]

I encourage employee shareholding (I have been an employee shareholder in two of my employers), and no problem with employee representation on management (though I believe many employees may be 'out of their depth' at board level as they have neither the training or experience to back up that role).  But that is not what Labour are proposing.

The 'employee' shares would not be owned or held by the employee.  Nor would the employee hold the right to vote as per a normal shareholder.  In fact the employee would not really be a 'shareholder' at all.  The shares (up to 10% of the company) would be held by the Government (supposedly on the employees behalf).  Dividends would be paid, the amount paid to the employee being limited to a maximum of £500 annually.  The balance would be pocketed by the Government.  In larger multinational companies this would be BIG money.  It has been suggested (BBC analysis, not Diane Abbott's figures) that for Shell OIl alone, this works as follows;

"Let's take just one company - bumper dividend-payer Shell. Ten percent of its £12bn annual dividend comes to £1.2bn.

If each of its 6,500 UK employees got £500 each (totalling £3.25m) that leaves £1.116bn for the government. That's just from one company - every year."

This is simply back door partial nationalisation without compensation and a new tax dressed up as employee shareholders.  In plain terms - THEFT by the state. 

So - we may have located Labour's magic money tree!

[Gordon R]

John - it is a stealth tax, which they trumpet as a triumph for the workers.

KB1 - I too have Jewish friends, who view the current Labour crowd as anti-Semitic. It is not something I have read, seen in the media etc. etc., I have made my own mind up. Why Corbyn will not address the issue says it all. He says the problem is solved. Delusional.

[spandit]

I'd be considerably better off under a Labour government.

I wouldn't be able to spend any money on guns or cars and when every shop on the high street goes out of business, I wouldn't be able to buy any clothes either.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

5 minutes ago, spandit said:

I'd be considerably better off under a Labour government.

I wouldn't be able to spend any money on guns or cars and when every shop on the high street goes out of business, I wouldn't be able to buy any clothes either.

Jeremy's Utopia!

[Rewulf]

2 hours ago, JohnfromUK said:

If you don't do what we ask, we will strike and make you.  Democracy at work, Labour style. 

It was also noted in the article there were many other Labour MPs there including minor shadow appointments who applauded, and McDonnell had been on the same platform in the same meeting earlier, but tactfully left before that speech.

Doesnt sound like democracy to me.
Sounds like an minority organisation of unwilling rabble, holding an elected government to ransom.

[Gordon R]

Rewulf - on the money.

[Vince Green]

38 minutes ago, Gordon R said:

John - it is a stealth tax, which they trumpet as a triumph for the workers.

KB1 - I too have Jewish friends, who view the current Labour crowd as anti-Semitic. It is not something I have read, seen in the media etc. etc., I have made my own mind up. Why Corbyn will not address the issue says it all. He says the problem is solved. Delusional.

I live in a very Jewish neighbourhood, there is a big Synagogue more or less at the end of the road and another half dozen within a three mile radius. I can't imagine many, if any, of my Jewish neighbours would have ever been typical labour voters. There lies the problem I think,  they have not got, and haven't had for many years, the support of the Jewish community and for Corbyn and his cronies anyone who is not on their side is the enemy.

Labour has for many years garnered support by patronising minorities and pretending to support them, not because they really cared, but just to get their votes. Its no coincidence that many Labour seats are in high immigrant constituencies.

Clearly that hasn't worked in the case of the Jewish community who saw through them 

Edited September 26, 2018 by Vince Green

[Scully]

25 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Doesnt sound like democracy to me.
Sounds like an minority organisation of unwilling rabble, holding an elected government to ransom.

This. The thing that has become apparent since Corbyn became leader, is the return of the old style Labour thesis of policies based on a burning and bitter resentment of what they perceive to be the upper classes. It colours everything they utter and seeps from every embittered pore. 

[Rewulf]

10 minutes ago, Vince Green said:

I live in a very Jewish neighbourhood, there is a big Synagogue more or less at the end of the road and another half dozen within a three mile radius. I can't imagine many, if any, of my Jewish neighbours would have ever been typical labour voters. There lies the problem I think,  they have not got, and haven't had for many years, the support of the Jewish community and for Corbyn and his cronies anyone who is not on their side is the enemy.

Labour has for many years garnered support by patronising minorities and pretending to support them, not because they really cared, but just to get their votes. Its no coincidence that many Labour seats are in high immigrant constituencies.

Clearly that hasn't worked in the case of the Jewish community who saw through them 

Im not sure its the case of seeing through them.
The entire Jewish mentality and culture is to work hard and better oneself , family and friends - classic capitalism.
But with labours roots planted irrevocably in communism, this doesnt fly for them.

And, as you say, many of labours minority supporters are from regions that havnt fared too well from Israels hands, or are religiously opposed to Judaism.
To labour its a numbers game, keep 100,000 Jews happy , or annoy 1,000,000 Muslims ?