Brexit - merged threads

[pinfireman]

21 hours ago, Jaymo said:

Well I did say it’s same source and so like the rest of the regurgitated stories that are quoted , probably questionable.

 

OK, Prove it,s unreliable! Go on, PROVE IT!

On 17/12/2018 at 13:29, oowee said:

Was it not the Brexiteers saying the EU had as much / more to loose than the Uk from bexit? Yet the EU have not been falling over themselves to acquiesce to our ill thought through demands. Their own economic assesment suggests impact is negligable. 

Do you not think we should have a look again at the tea leaves. It is a collective view of 27 states that drives the thought and decision making process. Without the states there is no EU. 

The EU Parliament is just window dressing, the Commission make all the decisions, and the "states" (I,m glad you did not call them countries) rubber stamp them! As most of them are on the receiving end of EU subsidies, what can you expect! And the Commission is at the beck and call of German & French industry! Themain reason you like the EU, it has a built in socialist majority!

[pinfireman]

On 17/12/2018 at 18:28, Jaymo said:

In May 2009, The Observer reported a Foreign Press Association speech given by Farage in which he had said that over his period as a Member of the European Parliament he had received a total of £2 million of taxpayers' money in staff, travel, and other expenses.^[54] In response, Farage said that in future all UKIP MEPs would provide monthly expense details.^[54]

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jan/12/nigel-farage-eu-salary-docked-claim-misspent-public-funds

man of the people ?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/16/nigel-farage-skint-ukip-4m-townhouse

Of course I’m being contradictory by quoting wiki and journo sources- I do take back my claim of dodgy loan, seem to remember a story of using funds for a campaign office to renovate the farmhouse in Kent? But can’t see the reference 

The Observer? There,s an unbiased newspaper,    I don,t think!

On 17/12/2018 at 18:28, Jaymo said:

In May 2009, The Observer reported a Foreign Press Association speech given by Farage in which he had said that over his period as a Member of the European Parliament he had received a total of £2 million of taxpayers' money in staff, travel, and other expenses.^[54] In response, Farage said that in future all UKIP MEPs would provide monthly expense details.^[54]

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jan/12/nigel-farage-eu-salary-docked-claim-misspent-public-funds

man of the people ?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/16/nigel-farage-skint-ukip-4m-townhouse

Of course I’m being contradictory by quoting wiki and journo sources- I do take back my claim of dodgy loan, seem to remember a story of using funds for a campaign office to renovate the farmhouse in Kent? But can’t see the reference 

"We believe there should be reforms in the EEC which would benefit all 
the members. If these were not achieved, our policy is to preserve the 
ultimate option of withdrawing Britain. That option would not, this 
time, need a referendum, as it did before." On Labour policy regarding the EEC (8 January 1986).

"The House of Lords must go - not be reformed, not be replaced, not be 
reborn in some nominated life-after-death patronage paradise, just 
closed down, abolished, finished."Tribune (November 19, 1976).

Neil Gordon Kinnock, Baron Kinnock,

A man of principle

 Here,s an oxymoron...a Labour politician with principles...makes Farage look like a saint!

 

[pinfireman]

21 hours ago, Vince Green said:

Tony Who? 

Exactly!

7 hours ago, oowee said:

Noooo let me back in pls Food here is carp too. Not looking fwd to christmas dinner.

 

Their criteria is anything they want it to be at a time that suits you too sir. A bit like the manifesto. Whatever we have to promise to get your vote. Starmer for PM i say.👍

Starmer? He,s Martin Borman to Corbyn,s Madolf!

[pinfireman]

5 hours ago, Rewulf said:

TUSK CLAIMS EU CREDIT FOR WHAT IT DID NOT DO.

Seems politicans in Europe are capable of talking more nonsense than ours

Donald Tusk looks remarkably like his grandfather who was an SS officer in World war Two, and who thus mixed with some of the most vile people ever to live in Europe.
He tells Brexiteers to "consider your ethics." As if the EU itself is ethical and those who oppose it, are not.

He also appears to claim that the EU can take credit for what Europe is today. No so. It's the nations that have made themselves what they are, thanks to being liberated by mainly Great Britain, the United States and Russia in World War 2.

And thanks to NATO during the Cold War whose principle backers are Britain and the US,

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1059903/brexit-news-donald-tusk-eu-news-latest?fbclid=IwAR0UGE_SUEmbrBUmL5EagTUHYbvqTMJUk9QCvlOgmVoVAuOI9JLg3lGtQ5Y

CORRECT!

[pinfireman]

And here,s a belter............!

"

The Remain Campaign’s Director of Communications Tom Baldwin has written a real sob story for the Spectator in response to an article which pointed out a major error their recent report attacking the ‘Norway Plus’ option. Baldwin goes full holier-than-thou as he insists:

“We are determined to be an evidence-based campaign and will continue to contest claims for forms of Brexit that are clearly untrue…

“Everyone should owe it to the public to engage in that debate in a way that upholds the very highest standards of rigour and truthfulness.”

This is coming from a campaign that:

• Claimed for months that it was only interested in securing a “soft Brexit”, not stopping Brexit altogether.
• Campaigned heavily for the UK to remain in the Single Market and Customs Union – only to now launch a full-frontal attack on that ‘Norway Plus’ option.
• Was humiliated on national television for a flagrantly misleading video purporting to show Leave campaigners arguing in favour of the single market.
• Said it was closing down but kept its entire email database in a questionable interpretation of data protection laws.
• Are largely the same people who ran the Remain campaign with its vast array of discredited scare stories about the effects of voting to Leave.
• Complained about Vote Leave “micro-targeting” on Facebook but has sent almost as many micro-targeted ads on Facebook in the last two and a half months as Vote Leave did in the entire campaign.
• Are still under investigation by the Information Commissioner about data irregularities involving the Lib Dems.
• Claims to be about giving ordinary people a say but is in fact a vast, well-funded corporate lobbying operation with dozens of full-time staff whose only goal is stopping Brexit, not boosting democracy.

The “People’s Vote” campaign have no interest in what people have or haven’t voted for, they simply want to stop Brexit by whatever means that are available to them, desperate for a second chance to atone for losing a campaign that was massively stacked in their favour in the first place. They are free to campaign for what they like but trying to take the moral high ground like this really is shameless…

•  
•  

[Rewulf]

37 minutes ago, pinfireman said:

And here,s a belter............!

"

The Remain Campaign’s Director of Communications Tom Baldwin has written a real sob story for the Spectator in response to an article which pointed out a major error their recent report attacking the ‘Norway Plus’ option. Baldwin goes full holier-than-thou as he insists:

“We are determined to be an evidence-based campaign and will continue to contest claims for forms of Brexit that are clearly untrue…

“Everyone should owe it to the public to engage in that debate in a way that upholds the very highest standards of rigour and truthfulness.”

This is coming from a campaign that:

• Claimed for months that it was only interested in securing a “soft Brexit”, not stopping Brexit altogether.
• Campaigned heavily for the UK to remain in the Single Market and Customs Union – only to now launch a full-frontal attack on that ‘Norway Plus’ option.
• Was humiliated on national television for a flagrantly misleading video purporting to show Leave campaigners arguing in favour of the single market.
• Said it was closing down but kept its entire email database in a questionable interpretation of data protection laws.
• Are largely the same people who ran the Remain campaign with its vast array of discredited scare stories about the effects of voting to Leave.
• Complained about Vote Leave “micro-targeting” on Facebook but has sent almost as many micro-targeted ads on Facebook in the last two and a half months as Vote Leave did in the entire campaign.
• Are still under investigation by the Information Commissioner about data irregularities involving the Lib Dems.
• Claims to be about giving ordinary people a say but is in fact a vast, well-funded corporate lobbying operation with dozens of full-time staff whose only goal is stopping Brexit, not boosting democracy.

The “People’s Vote” campaign have no interest in what people have or haven’t voted for, they simply want to stop Brexit by whatever means that are available to them, desperate for a second chance to atone for losing a campaign that was massively stacked in their favour in the first place. They are free to campaign for what they like but trying to take the moral high ground like this really is shameless…

•  
•  

Who do you think funds people's vote ?

Who funded Gina Miller ?

Who keeps pointing fingers at leave UK , citing foreign money being involved, when people's vote is directly funded by foreign investment itself ?

Bunch of lying hypocrites, and corrupt ones at that.

[Jaymo]

2 hours ago, pinfireman said:

OK, Prove it,s unreliable! Go on, PROVE IT!

The EU Parliament is just window dressing, the Commission make all the decisions, and the "states" (I,m glad you did not call them countries) rubber stamp them! As most of them are on the receiving end of EU subsidies, what can you expect! And the Commission is at the beck and call of German & French industry! Themain reason you like the EU, it has a built in socialist majority!

Prove otherwise !!!! By the length and depth of most of your postings you seem to have a bit of spare time on your hands!!!!

[Vince Green]

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

Who do you think funds people's vote ?

Who funded Gina Miller ?

Who keeps pointing fingers at leave UK , citing foreign money being involved, when people's vote is directly funded by foreign investment itself ?

Bunch of lying hypocrites, and corrupt ones at that.

YEP! and we all know why too

[pinfireman]

3 hours ago, Rewulf said:

Who do you think funds people's vote ?

Who funded Gina Miller ?

Who keeps pointing fingers at leave UK , citing foreign money being involved, when people's vote is directly funded by foreign investment itself ?

Bunch of lying hypocrites, and corrupt ones at that.

George Soros, for one!

2 hours ago, Jaymo said:

Prove otherwise !!!! By the length and depth of most of your postings you seem to have a bit of spare time on your hands!!!!

Haha! The old," answer a question with a question" routine.........you must be a politician! So let,s go back to the start....Prove it! If you can.....which I doubt!

[TIGHTCHOKE]

100 days to go!

[pinfireman]

Whilst most of the media is focused on Tory infighting and Corbyn’s incoherent and contradictory strategy the People’s Vote crowd are escaping attention. It will be no surprise when Guido tells you there is lots of infighting there too…

The main split is between those Labour MPs like Chris Leslie and Angela Smith who want to use it as reason for walking away from the Labour Party and setting up new party and those who want to try and win McDonnell and Corbyn over to the cause as the best way of getting a second referendum and stopping Brexit. They all despise Tom Baldwin who serves effectively at the pleasure of Alastair Campbell, who along with Blair is the real overlord of the whole thing. The Blairites are very definitely pulling the strings.

Baldwin is obsessed with polls and many on the campaign suspect he got the multi-millionaire Julian Dunkerton, who co-founded the Superdry fashion label, to make the weird precondition of his £1 million donation that it all be spent on polling. Good for YouGov’s profits, with the result that the campaign has an overload of pointless polls telling them nothing really new, which they can’t even turn into stories now the media narrative is all about the shenanigans in parliament.

Some Labour MPs think Baldwin and Campbell are trying to make it all about them and cutting them out. Chuka is especially irked so now sends out his own press releases implying they are from the official People’s Vote – though they are definitely not.

Money is a sensitive subject, because the People’s Vote campaign is at war with Best for Britain, who refused to join the remain coalition. Best for Britain are funded by Soros so have cash but are politically clueless and “p*ssing it up the wall” on Facebook according to People’s Vote insiders.

Every time Best for Britain get attacked in The Telegraph Soros writes another cheque. This infuriates the People’s Vote campaign who consider Best for Britain to be amateurs and political novices – the Lib Dem B-team and third sector campaigners.

Even Best for Britain co-founder Gina Miller quit the organisation to set up her own group ‘End the Chaos.’ This seems to double as a personal Gina Miller photography and publicity campaign, pouring resources into taking pictures of her standing on cliffs and on roads, staring into the middle distance. End the chaos indeed…

[JohnfromUK]

4 minutes ago, pinfireman said:

Money is a sensitive subject, because the People’s Vote campaign is at war with Best for Britain

Blair is not short of funds (he is a VERY rich man - as you so often find in those on 'retired Labour' list), but he is GREEDY in the extreme and will expect others to cough up any funds needed - and if he can personally benefit by taking high fees for anything he does/writes/speaks at.  Mandleson is similar, and Unuma has plenty of money, but expensive tastes in fine dining/wines. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2304227/Internet-secrets-jetrosexual-Chuka-Umunna-party-loving-MP-hailed-Labours-Obama.html

[pinfireman]

Guido would like to thank the Belgians for putting our domestic political crisis into perspective. The Belgian Prime Minister Charles Michel resigned last night as his government collapsed after he signed the controversial UN migration pact that his coalition partners opposed. Will they beat their 2011 record of going 589 days without an elected government?

The largest party in the coalition, the centre-right Flemish secessionist N-VA stopped supporting the Government, and after Michel attempted to stay in power with a “coalition of good will”, the opposition proposed a no confidence motion and he resigned. At least the UK still has a Government… of sor

1 minute ago, JohnfromUK said:

Blair is not short of funds (he is a VERY rich man - as you so often find in those on 'retired Labour' list), but he is GREEDY in the extreme and will expect others to cough up any funds needed - and if he can personally benefit by taking high fees for anything he does/writes/speaks at.  Mandleson is similar, and Unuma has plenty of money, but expensive tastes in fine dining/wines. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2304227/Internet-secrets-jetrosexual-Chuka-Umunna-party-loving-MP-hailed-Labours-Obama.html

Champagne socialists! Give them a sniff of the money, and they are like pigs at a trough!

[wymberley]

Been avoiding this because it's not my thing and the whole situation is pathetic. If we're seeing the best coherent level of debate that our politicians are able to rise to then it's no wonder the country is in a mess. To top that, unless another trough can be found to replace the existing one, those (all - those already having their snout in and the remainder who have not yet managed it but wish to be able to) politicians will do their utmost to ensure we go nowhere in real terms - certainly not far enough to prevent them enjoying the perks that they currently enjoy. And now to top it off if we didn't already know, we have the evidence broadcast far and wide that as suspected they're the biggest bunch of lying touregs on the planet. Not only is that true, it's equally valid to say that they haven't even got the nous to stop digging when the whole world and their grannies have just witnessed the error of their ways and instead get up on their hind legs and lie through their teeth. It is of no consequence as to which political persuasion they subscribe to as it makes not one jot of difference as they're all from the same cloth.

"I didn't say, 'stupid woman'." Ye gods! We all saw you, you stupid man.

[Dave-G]

25 minutes ago, wymberley said:

"I didn't say, 'stupid woman'." Ye gods! We all saw you, you stupid man.

Haha, I suspect he'd have to resign if he admits it so will continue to lie about it even in the face of any proof. I see the ugli thing that nobody would admit to humping backed him up.

[Retsdon]

https://ec.europa.eu/info/publications/communication-19-december-2018-preparing-withdrawal-united-kingdom-european-union-30-march-2019-implementing-commissions-contingency-action-plan_en

While in the UK, it's all 'he said/she said' soap opera stuff, the EU today informed interested parties what will happen in the event of a no deal Brexit. It rather seems that they will allow what suits them for as long as it suits them. 

In short, the EU will decide the rules and the UK will have to like it or lump it. It rather looks like this isn't going to work out quite like people hoped it would...

Edited December 19, 2018 by Retsdon

[Scully]

3 minutes ago, Retsdon said:

https://ec.europa.eu/info/publications/communication-19-december-2018-preparing-withdrawal-united-kingdom-european-union-30-march-2019-implementing-commissions-contingency-action-plan_en

The EU informs interested parties what will happen in the event of a no deal Brexit. It rather seems that they will allow what suits them for as long as it suits them. 

In short, the EU will decide the rules and the UK will have to like it or lump it. It rather looks like this isn't going to work out quite like people hoped it would...

I stopped caring what the EU thinks or wants quite some time ago. Just leave, what can they do? 

[Retsdon]

1 minute ago, Scully said:

I stopped caring what the EU thinks or wants quite some time ago. Just leave, what can they do? 

Why not try opening and reading the link? It's pretty dense stuff, but the questions and answers PDF seems to cover the basics.

[pinfireman]

The latest global FDI figures have blown apart the regular Remainer refrain that Brexit “uncertainty” is causing anxious businesses to hold back investment in the UK. According to the most recent UNCTAD figures, far from languishing near the bottom of the table, the UK is currently ranked second best in the world, with $65.5 billion of FDI coming into the UK in the first half of 2018 alone, just behind China on $70.2 billion.

The Netherlands lags behind the UK in fourth place with $44.8 billion, while Spain is the only other EU country to make the top ten in eighth with $29.8 billion. Not one of the other 25 EU member states has even managed to secure one third as much FDI as the UK…................................Despite Brexit! 

18 minutes ago, Retsdon said:

https://ec.europa.eu/info/publications/communication-19-december-2018-preparing-withdrawal-united-kingdom-european-union-30-march-2019-implementing-commissions-contingency-action-plan_en

While in the UK, it's all 'he said/she said' soap opera stuff, the EU today informed interested parties what will happen in the event of a no deal Brexit. It rather seems that they will allow what suits them for as long as it suits them. 

In short, the EU will decide the rules and the UK will have to like it or lump it. It rather looks like this isn't going to work out quite like people hoped it would...

More Project Fear.............

7 minutes ago, Retsdon said:

Why not try opening and reading the link? It's pretty dense stuff, but the questions and answers PDF seems to cover the basics.

An EU publication.....so it must be true????

Edited December 19, 2018 by pinfireman
spelling

[Retsdon]

22 minutes ago, pinfireman said:

The latest global FDI figures have blown apart the regular Remainer refrain that Brexit “uncertainty” is causing anxious businesses to hold back investment in the UK. According to the most recent UNCTAD figures, far from languishing near the bottom of the table, the UK is currently ranked second best in the world, with $65.5 billion of FDI coming into the UK in the first half of 2018 alone, just behind China on $70.2 billion.

The Netherlands lags behind the UK in fourth place with $44.8 billion, while Spain is the only other EU country to make the top ten in eighth with $29.8 billion. Not one of the other 25 EU member states has even managed to secure one third as much FDI as the UK…................................Despite Brexit! 

More Project Fear.............

An EU publication.....so it must be true????

https://unctad.org/en/Pages/DIAE/World Investment Report/Country-Fact-Sheets.aspx

Not sure where the $65 billion figure comes from?  Direct investment flows - inward $15090 and outward $99614 is what I can see in the chart above. Or perhaps the report above is out of date?

[Scully]

42 minutes ago, Retsdon said:

Why not try opening and reading the link? It's pretty dense stuff, but the questions and answers PDF seems to cover the basics.

Because I'm really not that interested. 

[Dave-G]

Would now be a good time to post this?The author of this puts up a good story - with links.

 

[Retsdon]

10 minutes ago, Scully said:

Because I'm really not that interested. 

Well, you did ask 'What can they do?'!!! 🤔

[Scully]

1 minute ago, Retsdon said:

Well, you did ask 'What can they do?'!!! 🤔

It’s rhetorical; I simply don’t care what they think they can do to us. 

We should just leave...not pay a penny;  call their bluff and just leave. What are they going to do, declare war on us!? 😂 

[TriBsa]

On 14/12/2018 at 18:05, Paul223 said:

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/229963

When Paul223 posted this 5 days ago, there were 82,000 signatures. Now there are over 251,000. Don't expect this to be debated anytime soon though. It now shows " Waiting for 4 days for a debate date" which seems to be getting extended, as it was 1 day on Monday.

Still, every bit of pressure helps and it shows that many people are not being cowed by Project Fear or May's lies.