WHO

[AVB]

This article states that the U.K. is the second largest contributor to the World Health Organisation after the US which I find hard to believe. Google doesn’t shed much light on it. Anybody got any cast iron evidence of who pays what? 

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1269233/Trump-news-WHO-funding-uk-world-health-organisation-us-donald-trump?fbclid=IwAR2Ns4tHqAHv6RzMBPUNGqkI4Km6z-HgyD7Rt_vsDeGuKA42ZkgwfCh2So4

Edited April 15, 2020 by AVB
Added link

[Newbie to this]

I heard on LBC today that the Bill Gates foundation (or whatever it is called) was the second biggest contributor after the US, making it the biggest now.

 

[Newbie to this]

From this website https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/04/who-funds-world-health-organization-un-coronavirus-pandemic-covid-trump/

If you click on the graph on the website it opens the W.H.O. pdf document the screenshot is taken from.

 

[oldypigeonpopper]

hello, but what do the WHO actually do, all i see is interviews on Television

[Mungler]

China has been the elephant in the room for years - a truly dreadful regime on every level.

The WHO has just done what every other country has done and that is turn a blind eye or allowed to be manipulated by the regime.

I get the fact that as a country we can’t just talk to and do business with the ‘nice’ countries, but the excuses and shuffling round China has been quite nauseating. It’s now beyond nauseating, it’s just plain dangerous for the whole of humanity.

The media (which is stuffed full of the enlightened and educated left) constantly give China a free pass, however, the world has known since 1989 that China is not the socialist utopia it set out to be. 

Conversely, Trump (who happens to be the only leader prepared to stand up to China) comes on a visit to GB and the world and the media lose their heads and there’s protests in the street. When it comes to China we’re measuring pears in apples.

[Raja Clavata]

40 minutes ago, Mungler said:

China has been the elephant in the room for years - a truly dreadful regime on every level.

The WHO has just done what every other country has done and that is turn a blind eye or allowed to be manipulated by the regime.

I get the fact that as a country we can’t just talk to and do business with the ‘nice’ countries, but the excuses and shuffling round China has been quite nauseating. It’s now beyond nauseating, it’s just plain dangerous for the whole of humanity.

The media (which is stuffed full of the enlightened and educated left) constantly give China a free pass, however, the world has known since 1989 that China is not the socialist utopia it set out to be. 

Conversely, Trump (who happens to be the only leader prepared to stand up to China) comes on a visit to GB and the world and the media lose their heads and there’s protests in the street. When it comes to China we’re measuring pears in apples.

I had a similar opinion to this before I visited there in 2018 on business (Shanghai and Beijing), and came away with the feeling that the Western media distort our view of the domestic aspects of the country significantly. They clearly do do a lot of things internally quite well. Some of the ex-pats I know living there suggest but for the pollution it's as utopian as anywhere they have ever lived - obviously they are somewhat privileged though.

I also spent a week in Feb this year with a chic that walked the length of the Great Wall alone and unaided - she has nothing but praise for the country and the people she met / stayed with.

On the international stage I agree but if you look at the big three China have the least aggressive foreign policy of the lot, heaven forbid the Chinese throwing their weight around internationally like the Americans do. 

As for Trump, with the exception of Putin perhaps, isn't he the only world leader able to credibly stand up against China?

Regarding trade, I would happily never buy Chinese manufactured goods again. There is quite a movement gaining traction in mainland Europe to reduce the reliance on Chinese manufactured goods. We can follow suit here to some extent hopefully.

With respect to WHO, this is still unravelling, I know some senior medical / scientific authorities here in the UK are upset with their handling of the whole thing. It would probably be useful if, to some extent at least, the politics are separated from the public health aspects. Back to Trump, possibly felt the WHO weren't listening to him, they are now... 

[TRINITY]

1 hour ago, Mungler said:

China has been the elephant in the room for years - a truly dreadful regime on every level.

The WHO has just done what every other country has done and that is turn a blind eye or allowed to be manipulated by the regime.

I get the fact that as a country we can’t just talk to and do business with the ‘nice’ countries, but the excuses and shuffling round China has been quite nauseating. It’s now beyond nauseating, it’s just plain dangerous for the whole of humanity.

The media (which is stuffed full of the enlightened and educated left) constantly give China a free pass, however, the world has known since 1989 that China is not the socialist utopia it set out to be. 

Conversely, Trump (who happens to be the only leader prepared to stand up to China) comes on a visit to GB and the world and the media lose their heads and there’s protests in the street. When it comes to China we’re measuring pears in apples.

Bang on !!!!! 

Also look at high and mighty France and some of the other eu free loaders. 

WHO now , NATO tomorrow ?

[Raja Clavata]

https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-china-cdc-exclusiv/exclusive-u-s-axed-cdc-expert-job-in-china-months-before-virus-outbreak-idUKKBN21910S

 

[12gauge82]

2 hours ago, Raja Clavata said:

I had a similar opinion to this before I visited there in 2018 on business (Shanghai and Beijing), and came away with the feeling that the Western media distort our view of the domestic aspects of the country significantly. They clearly do do a lot of things internally quite well. Some of the ex-pats I know living there suggest but for the pollution it's as utopian as anywhere they have ever lived - obviously they are somewhat privileged though.

I also spent a week in Feb this year with a chic that walked the length of the Great Wall alone and unaided - she has nothing but praise for the country and the people she met / stayed with.

On the international stage I agree but if you look at the big three China have the least aggressive foreign policy of the lot, heaven forbid the Chinese throwing their weight around internationally like the Americans do. 

As for Trump, with the exception of Putin perhaps, isn't he the only world leader able to credibly stand up against China?

Regarding trade, I would happily never buy Chinese manufactured goods again. There is quite a movement gaining traction in mainland Europe to reduce the reliance on Chinese manufactured goods. We can follow suit here to some extent hopefully.

With respect to WHO, this is still unravelling, I know some senior medical / scientific authorities here in the UK are upset with their handling of the whole thing. It would probably be useful if, to some extent at least, the politics are separated from the public health aspects. Back to Trump, possibly felt the WHO weren't listening to him, they are now... 

Least aggressive foreign policy! They're building manmade islands and claiming the sea around them, totally against international law and threatening anyone who breaches chinas made up rules!

[Raja Clavata]

Just now, 12gauge82 said:

Least aggressive foreign policy! They're building manmade islands and claiming the sea around them, totally against international law and threatening anyone who breaches chinas made up rules!

Yes pretty shoddy behaviour in the South China Sea, is it really any worse than the Yanks or Russia though?

[Danger-Mouse]

4 hours ago, Raja Clavata said:

I had a similar opinion to this before I visited there in 2018 on business (Shanghai and Beijing), and came away with the feeling that the Western media distort our view of the domestic aspects of the country significantly. They clearly do do a lot of things internally quite well.

 

Yeah, organ harvesting from Falun Gong practitioners if reports are to be believed.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jun/17/china-is-harvesting-organs-from-detainees-uk-tribunal-concludes

[Raja Clavata]

52 minutes ago, Mr_Nobody said:

Yeah, organ harvesting from Falun Gong practitioners if reports are to be believed.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jun/17/china-is-harvesting-organs-from-detainees-uk-tribunal-concludes

Yes I'd seen that and it's truly abhorrent. I'm not pro China or supporting them but was just trying to put across a balanced view. 

China needs to be held accountable for this pandemic, as do the WHO and ultimately our own government too, if it is later proven that they have acted in negligence.

I'm just not for these knee jerk unilateral objects of hatred and I don't see how it serves anyones agenda in the long run. Let's face it we seem to have a culture whereby we need to hate at least someone or something, not so long ago it was the EU, North Korea, Saudi Arabia, Iran and so on...

Three months ago nobody on here seemed to have much of an axe to grind with China.

Like Mungler stated, we can't afford to pick and choose who with do business with but we can try and should hit China where it hurts, economically.

[Retsdon]

2 hours ago, Raja Clavata said:

but we can try and should hit China where it hurts, economically.

Who's 'we'? Just curious.

[12gauge82]

7 hours ago, Raja Clavata said:

Yes pretty shoddy behaviour in the South China Sea, is it really any worse than the Yanks or Russia though?

Your right of course, the west is far from blameless.

[Raja Clavata]

3 hours ago, Retsdon said:

Who's 'we'? Just curious.

To be honest I was referring to the abstract collective but we, the British, definitely should revoke the Huawei 5G deal, although I thought that prior to the whole pandemic gig.
In terms of building a manufacturing capability to offset reliance of goods from China, even with the best will in the world, there’s very little we can do in the UK alone I fear.

[Jim Neal]

43 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said:

In terms of building a manufacturing capability to offset reliance of goods from China, even with the best will in the world, there’s very little we can do in the UK alone I fear.

Even if it were attainable (over which I share your doubts), possibly the UK and rest of Europe have backed ourselves into a corner on this matter?  We have set out some very stringent policies/targets regarding the reduction of pollution and other matters associated to environmental issues, to be actuated over what is a relatively short timescale.  Many other countries worldwide (e.g. China, USA) apparently still don't give a hoot about the pollution they're belching out.

Industry, manufacturing.... they are activities synonymous with energy consumption and pollution.  Our current environmental commitments and policies would surely have to be disregarded if we tried to become much more self-reliant in this field.

Theoretically, yes we could have a second Industrial Revolution, but what would be the "new smog"?

It would be interesting to compare public opinion polls on the environmental impacts of a massive increase in UK industry, one pre- and the other post-COVID19 (if they existed or could be done).

[Mice!]

8 hours ago, Jim Neal said:

Industry, manufacturing.... they are activities synonymous with energy consumption and pollution.  Our current environmental commitments and policies would surely have to be disregarded if we tried to become much more self-reliant in this field.

The problem is we could never compete with china on cost alone, when it comes to cost the cheapest always wins in mass production,  and that's without even looking at the environmental factors.

But the 5G deal should certainly be looked at again. 

[Raja Clavata]

8 hours ago, Jim Neal said:

Even if it were attainable (over which I share your doubts), possibly the UK and rest of Europe have backed ourselves into a corner on this matter?  We have set out some very stringent policies/targets regarding the reduction of pollution and other matters associated to environmental issues, to be actuated over what is a relatively short timescale.  Many other countries worldwide (e.g. China, USA) apparently still don't give a hoot about the pollution they're belching out.

Industry, manufacturing.... they are activities synonymous with energy consumption and pollution.  Our current environmental commitments and policies would surely have to be disregarded if we tried to become much more self-reliant in this field.

Theoretically, yes we could have a second Industrial Revolution, but what would be the "new smog"?

It would be interesting to compare public opinion polls on the environmental impacts of a massive increase in UK industry, one pre- and the other post-COVID19 (if they existed or could be done).

Good point. Whilst I wouldn't suggest it was necessarily a conscious policy of the West to do so, moving a significant proportion of manufacturing and industry East does somewhat provide an opportunity to offload the pollution and energy consumption problem. 

Then there is the issue of waste, up until recently China was consuming up to 45% of world waste but that has stopped - presumably we found someone / somewhere else to offload it to.

If you consider the amount of waste we "produce" as a largely net consumer economy then the mind boggles at the prospect of the volume of waste we'd produce even getting anywhere near parity between net consumption and production.

Personally I believe, first and foremost, the focus right now should be reaching a conclusion on Coronavirus, establishing beyond all reasonable doubt what the cause of the outbreak was, put measures in place to reduce the risk of repeats etc. Put pressure on China to admit it has a problem, take ownership of it and demonstrate it has dealt with it.

Later on it will be interesting to see if the EU and others really do want take back some control of manufacturing, starting with priorities like certain medicines and other items only available from China currently.

Regarding the live food markets - these exist throughout the world so certainly not solely an issue for China.

Lastly on pollution clearly there are contributions from multiple sources with industry being the significant one but I do know that fossil fuel powered motorcycles and scooters are banned in Shanghai for example.

[SpringDon]

16 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said:

Good point. Whilst I wouldn't suggest it was necessarily a conscious policy of the West to do so, moving a significant proportion of manufacturing and industry East does somewhat provide an opportunity to offload the pollution and energy consumption problem. 

Then there is the issue of waste, up until recently China was consuming up to 45% of world waste but that has stopped - presumably we found someone / somewhere else to offload it to.

If you consider the amount of waste we "produce" as a largely net consumer economy then the mind boggles at the prospect of the volume of waste we'd produce even getting anywhere near parity between net consumption and production.

Personally I believe, first and foremost, the focus right now should be reaching a conclusion on Coronavirus, establishing beyond all reasonable doubt what the cause of the outbreak was, put measures in place to reduce the risk of repeats etc. Put pressure on China to admit it has a problem, take ownership of it and demonstrate it has dealt with it.

Later on it will be interesting to see if the EU and others really do want take back some control of manufacturing, starting with priorities like certain medicines and other items only available from China currently.

Regarding the live food markets - these exist throughout the world so certainly not solely an issue for China.

Lastly on pollution clearly there are contributions from multiple sources with industry being the significant one but I do know that fossil fuel powered motorcycles and scooters are banned in Shanghai for example.

Apart from focusing on the conclusion of the current corona virus problem, I disagree with all of that. And even the resolution of the current outbreak is just a deferment since viruses are in a constant of flux and another outbreak is inevitable.

With regard to the rest, the western world’s standard of living is dependant on China and some other Asian countries. The affordable goods we buy are underpinned by the export of our inflation to the developing world. Our environmental standards, and to a lesser extent, our employment protections are dependant on the lower standards in place in China.

Large scale manufacturing cannot be brought back to the eu without a reduction in living standards.

[Raja Clavata]

9 minutes ago, SpringDon said:

Apart from focusing on the conclusion of the current corona virus problem, I disagree with all of that. And even the resolution of the current outbreak is just a deferment since viruses are in a constant of flux and another outbreak is inevitable.

With regard to the rest, the western world’s standard of living is dependant on China and some other Asian countries. The affordable goods we buy are underpinned by the export of our inflation to the developing world. Our environmental standards, and to a lesser extent, our employment protections are dependant on the lower standards in place in China.

Large scale manufacturing cannot be brought back to the eu without a reduction in living standards.

You've previously stated I spout garbage, so fair enough, but are you sure this is not one area we do actually agree on? Since I agree with what you've written above I'm not rightly sure what you disagree with what I stated.

Do you not agree there are live food markets throughout the world?

Do you not agree that all motorbikes and scooters in Shangahi are electric? 

[Jaymo]

20 hours ago, 12gauge82 said:

Least aggressive foreign policy! They're building manmade islands and claiming the sea around them, totally against international law and threatening anyone who breaches chinas made up rules!

Reclaiming Land! The Dutch have been doing that for centuries and still are.

[SpringDon]

10 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said:

You've previously stated I spout garbage, so fair enough, but are you sure this is not one area we do actually agree on? Since I agree with what you've written above I'm not rightly sure what you disagree with what I stated.

Do you not agree there are live food markets throughout the world?

Do you not agree that all motorbikes and scooters in Shangahi are electric? 

I’m not sure when disagreement became an accusation of spouting garbage, but that’s polarisation for you. I suppose we'll have to agree on mutual garbage spouting.

[Raja Clavata]

Just now, SpringDon said:

I’m not sure when disagreement became an accusation of spouting garbage, but that’s polarisation for you. I suppose we'll have to agree on mutual garbage spouting.

Your opening statement was you disagreed with what I said then appeared to reinforce what I said. I'm still unclear what it is you disagreed with.

[SpringDon]

1 hour ago, Raja Clavata said:

Your opening statement was you disagreed with what I said then appeared to reinforce what I said. I'm still unclear what it is you disagreed with.

I don’t agree with it wasn’t a conscious policy of the west to move manufacturing to China or that it will be interesting for the eu to move it back. It will be catastrophic for some.

It seems to me that you are an angry alpha type and I see no reason to continue to enable that behaviour.

[Raja Clavata]

Suits me. I'll refrain from passing comment on my assessment of your type. All the best.