Newbie to this Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, grrclark said: That is pure deflection. While he should still be called to account for his actions as a public representative he was not a key part of the government team to actually put the rules in place. Other than being an MP he is just a punter like the rest of us. Pot have you meet the kettle. Trying to deflect, using that he is just a lowly MP, well the other one is just a lowly civil servant. And if one is wrong, so are the others. Edited May 26, 2020 by Newbie to this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 19 minutes ago, Spoon said: Ignoring the whataboutism here (but seriously, knock it off), do you have a source for him doing this? Three pages deep in to 4 different google searches threw up nothing other than he was admitted to Manchester hospital, unless I'm misreading things. Turning Point UK is not a source anyone should trust, but my searches don't even throw up fringe sites or forums that I'd expect to see in relation to something like this. And those are never usually hard to find. No I do not have a credible source for it. But you have answered it yourself, 21 minutes ago, Spoon said: other than he was admitted to Manchester hospital How was he admitted into a Manchester hospital when he was in London. Maybe someone added 2 and 2 together and got 5, maybe they didn't. Doesn't change the fact that Cummings broke no laws. And if he did have a hand in their writing, then surley he knows more about them than the witch hunt reporters. My post is about pointing out the hypocrisy in our media, Tony Lloyd was not the only Labour MP etc. to breach the lockdown guidance, yet they seem to get a free pass, as do the horde of reporters outside Cummings' London home. It's farcical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoon Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 Just now, Newbie to this said: How was he admitted into a Manchester hospital when he was in London. Maybe someone added 2 and 2 together and got 5, maybe they didn't. This is my point tho, I can't find anything from anyone saying he was in London and ended up in Manchester - not even from people who would be shouting this sort of stuff from the rooftops. I'm not saying I couldn't find this in the Guardian but the Mail is claiming it, I mean I can't find anything using the first 4 different keyword searches of even the obvious fringe media and organisations that would be talking about it. That doesn't mean that my Google-fu is perfect, but it does surprise me. 3 minutes ago, Newbie to this said: No I do not have a credible source for it. Then it seems odd to be using it to make any kind of point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 Just now, Spoon said: This is my point tho, I can't find anything from anyone saying he was in London and ended up in Manchester - not even from people who would be shouting this sort of stuff from the rooftops. I'm not saying I couldn't find this in the Guardian but the Mail is claiming it, I mean I can't find anything using the first 4 different keyword searches of even the obvious fringe media and organisations that would be talking about it. That doesn't mean that my Google-fu is perfect, but it does surprise me. Then it seems odd to be using it to make any kind of point. Maybe I shouldn't have used Lloyd, maybe I sould have pick one of the other Labour MPs etc. getting a free pass by our biased witch hunt media. It's hypocrisy on the part of our media organisations. If Cummings had broke the Law, I would be amongst the first calling for him to go. But from what I can tell he hasn't. This story should have gone no further than the police are happy he acted within the Law. So why the witch hunt on Cummings but not the Labour lot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoon Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Newbie to this said: Maybe I shouldn't have used Lloyd, maybe I sould have pick one of the other Labour MPs etc. getting a free pass by our biased witch hunt media. Got a source? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancer425 Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 4 hours ago, ditchman said: both media's are having a field day winding things up..............................that Kay Burley is just a nasty mouthed hag...a dirty piece of work.......it is appalling the way she talks to people the cummings thing will only go away when the media can no longer suck anymore pus out of it............then they will find something else to miss report and twist into a story the whole covid-19 thing has now turned into a political bun fight That kay Burley is a horrible person, her and that morgan . I have no time for them at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 Just now, Spoon said: Got a source? I would do if the media started the same sort of witch hunt against them, as they did Cummings 3 minutes ago, Spoon said: Got a source? But just for you here's one https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/tahir-ali-birmingham-lockdown-funeral-social-distancing-a4406676.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retsdon Posted May 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 "During that press conference on Monday, Dominic Cummings claimed that he had been worried about a pandemic for some time and that last year he had written about the possible threat of coronaviruses and the urgent need for planning.However, Jens Wiechers, a data scientist, put Cummings’ blogpost mentioning coronaviruses through the Wayback Machine – a digital archive – and found that the relevant paragraphs had been added on 14 April – the day Cummings returned to work after the trip to Durham." https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/may/26/dominic-cummings-faces-questions-over-claim-he-warned-last-year-of-virus-threat Why am I not surprised. I had a feeling that most of it was just a story. He told it well though. But I suppose when you deal constantly in a world of untruths it must be hard to keep track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty Ruler Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 7 minutes ago, Newbie to this said: Maybe I shouldn't have used Lloyd, maybe I sould have pick one of the other Labour MPs etc. getting a free pass by our biased witch hunt media. Try Vaughn Gething, Kevan Jones or Tahir Ali. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 6 minutes ago, Retsdon said: "During that press conference on Monday, Dominic Cummings claimed that he had been worried about a pandemic for some time and that last year he had written about the possible threat of coronaviruses and the urgent need for planning.However, Jens Wiechers, a data scientist, put Cummings’ blogpost mentioning coronaviruses through the Wayback Machine – a digital archive – and found that the relevant paragraphs had been added on 14 April – the day Cummings returned to work after the trip to Durham." https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/may/26/dominic-cummings-faces-questions-over-claim-he-warned-last-year-of-virus-threat Why am I not surprised. I had a feeling that most of it was just a story. He told it well though. But I suppose when you deal constantly in a world of untruths it must be hard to keep track. Unreal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVB Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 45 minutes ago, mel b3 said: kinnock jr was a knob as well. speaking as joe average , the common sense option was never offered to me , i was told by the government , and its scientific advisors , the things that i had to do , i followed these instructions to the letter , not slavishly , or because im too thick to think for myself , i did it because i thought that i was doing the right thing for my country , and the people in it . for me , doing the right thing (in every part of my life ) is very much a matter of integrity , no matter how much it may cost me personally . Yes you were doing the right thing in your mind. As was Cummings in his mind, Kinnock in his mind and me in mine. The guideline/laws/rules call them what you want were vague and had an element of discretion in them (call them ‘get outs’ if you want). You interpreted them one way, Cummings/Kinnock/myself differently. It doesn’t mean either of us were doing anything wrong or illegal just differently to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 7 minutes ago, AVB said: Yes you were doing the right thing in your mind. As was Cummings in his mind, Kinnock in his mind and me in mine. The guideline/laws/rules call them what you want were vague and had an element of discretion in them (call them ‘get outs’ if you want). You interpreted them one way, Cummings/Kinnock/myself differently. It doesn’t mean either of us were doing anything wrong or illegal just differently to you. nope , i did what was right for my country , and for the greater good , you , cummings , kinnock , did what made you happy , and are trying to justify it by saying i didnt read the rules properly. yes the guidelines were pretty cack , but the message was clear enough , stay at home , stay at home , stay at home , stay at home , stay at home. i was one of the relatively lucky ones (depending on your perspective) , i was able to get out and work every day , but how must those poor people be feeling that locked the door and didnt leave the house for two months , knowing that cummings not only travelled hundreds of miles (that part is forgivable) , but then took his mrs and kid for a jolly , and the attitude of dc and bj is just rubbing salt into the very open wounds. i have to duck out now , politics really isnt my thing at all , ill just end up doing a burnley dave . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 hour ago, Mighty Ruler said: Try Vaughn Gething, Kevan Jones or Tahir Ali. Let's not forget Cressida **** who also breached the lockdown guidance. Not only did she breach them, but her actions encourage other to do the same, in front of her very eyes, which she chose to ignore. Where's her media witch hunt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 This thread has run it's course for me too, it's been interesting in parts. Time will tell what the impact of this will be. For myself I think BoJo is spineless and he has demonstrated that in spades, I believe we will start to see that reflected in his electoral satisfaction ratings and polling intentions of the public too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 who needs a witch hunt when cummings ADMITTED driving when he claims his eyesight WAS defective obviously he’s above the law AND the rules witch! witch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 13 minutes ago, clangerman said: who needs a witch hunt when cummings ADMITTED driving when he claims his eyesight WAS defective obviously he’s above the law AND the rules witch! witch! That is simply not true. He did not say his eyesight was defective when he drove. What he said was that he wanted to try relatively short run before embarking on a long journey back to London because his eyesight had been affected when he was ill. He was no longer ill when he planned to return to London. If you have ever had sight issues (and from your post I guess you haven't) a big risk is your eyes getting tired. I would not do a very long journey with (for example) a new prescription of glass lenses until I was reasonably sure that they would not make my eyes tired (it can take time to get used to a new prescription). To do a local journey with another driver who can take over if there are issues seems perfectly sensible. FAR better than embarking on a long journey - and finding part way through that journey that you are getting eyesight problems, or headaches from tired eyes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRINITY Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 GUYS for what it's worth, I have been talking to someone in the Tory party this afternoon and learnt quite a few facts about this incident that I was not aware of. The media have known about this for weeks but have held back to cause maximum damage. Cummings is a side issue to cause maximum damage to the government. More stuff is coming and it's all down to stopping Brexit. For instance, I did not know,and it's never been mentioned the little boy is autistic . I have an autistic boy in my family and I can assure you they are very difficult to care for. Getting child care would have been a nightmare, in all fairness to Cummings he has not used that to defend his actions. More stuff has gone on that opened my eyes into the whole background of the affair, so watch this space. For those who are brexiteers, let's hope the Tories can close ranks and hold on to the point of no Brexit return at the end of June, with or without a deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 minute ago, TRINITY said: For instance, I did not know,and it's never been mentioned the little boy is autistic In fact that has been mentioned - and someone (a campaigner on autism issues who is an English teacher called Pete Wharmby who 'tweeted "Seems the next stage in the Cummings defence is to invoke the 4 year old son being autistic. Don't know what the truth is but it's not good, invoking autism (which affects thousands and thousands of kids in the UK) for this behaviour. It did not get widespread press coverage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRINITY Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 18 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: In fact that has been mentioned - and someone (a campaigner on autism issues who is an English teacher called Pete Wharmby who 'tweeted "Seems the next stage in the Cummings defence is to invoke the 4 year old son being autistic. Don't know what the truth is but it's not good, invoking autism (which affects thousands and thousands of kids in the UK) for this behaviour. It did not get widespread press coverage. Puts a different slant on it to me, I know from experience how difficult they are. In fact I am surprised all the press outside the home dosn,t effect the kid. If that was my grandson something like that going on outside the house would cause him serious stress and anxiety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retsdon Posted May 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 Really, the question that none of the press asked was what he would have done if he hadn't had a family with a farm and a holiday cottage to go to. Presumably he would have had to get childcare in London. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crosswaters Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 Take away this thread topic and replace it with Brexit because its all about this ,the remoaners moaning constantly its nowt to do with what DC has done its all about the hate these people have for the government and advisors The media add fuel to the hatred by there disgraceful and disgusting actions and should be brought to answer for there lying reporting . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 5 minutes ago, TRINITY said: Puts a different slant on it to me, I know from experience how difficult they are. In fact I am surprised all the press outside the home dosn,t effect the kid. If that was my grandson something like that going on outside the house would cause him serious stress and anxiety. I suspect that may have had a bearing on the decisions he made. 3 minutes ago, Retsdon said: what he would have done if he hadn't had a family with a farm and a holiday cottage to go to. What he might have done if things had been different is even less relevant than what he did. We cannot possibly know what other options or resources he might (or might not) have had available. It was posted quite clearly that his son had autism ......... but none of the usual gutter press actually included that information, which as TRINITY says probably had a significant influence on his thinking ......... but thats what you get from the press - the version they want you to read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRINITY Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 7 minutes ago, Retsdon said: Really, the question that none of the press asked was what he would have done if he hadn't had a family with a farm and a holiday cottage to go to. Presumably he would have had to get childcare in London. Have you had first hand experience with an autistic child.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRINITY Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 4 minutes ago, crosswaters said: Take away this thread topic and replace it with Brexit because its all about this ,the remoaners moaning constantly its nowt to do with what DC has done its all about the hate these people have for the government and advisors The media add fuel to the hatred by there disgraceful and disgusting actions and should be brought to answer for there lying reporting . Bang on there. From what I hear, some senior Whitehall officials were very naughty. Cummings had done a bunk to Durham, boris in hospital and as they say, when the cats away. On his return from Durham, Cummings discovered their little tricks and it really up set them. They want rid and are doing everything they can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retsdon Posted May 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 minute ago, JohnfromUK said: We cannot possibly know what other options or resources he might (or might not) have had available. To be honest, he could have driven to Caithness and back for all I care personally. But, he apparently made use of what was in effect an emergency provision in the guidelines/rules whatever they are. So did he NEED to drive to Durham or was it just his favoured choice? And to know that, you'd have to know the alternatives. And it's very relevant because immediate need is what underpins the exemption that he used to justify his trip. This isn't going to go away though. It seems now there are some quite major differences between the account that Cummings gave yesterday and one his wife published in the Spectator. Plus there are the casual lies about the stuff that he said he'd written last year which were in fact later revisions. Etc, etc, etc, It's a drip, drip, drip of small revelations that erode his credibility. One of the rules pertaining to SPADs is that they must maintain the trust of those with whom they work. So if someone in his position gets repeatedly exposed as an habitual dissembler it will eventually become impossible to maintain the fiction that he can fulfull the requirements of his task. And he can't front it out like an elected politician who only has to answer to the electorate. It will be interesting to see how this thing plays out. 16 minutes ago, TRINITY said: some senior Whitehall officials were very naughty. Cummings had done a bunk to Durham, boris in hospital and as they say, when the cats away. On his return from Durham, Cummings discovered their little tricks And? https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/special-advisers-code-of-conduct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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