Illegal immigration

[treetree]

Henry d - Genuine question: How many should the UK take. At what point would you say " no more"?

[AVB]

3 minutes ago, henry d said:

Matters not, they are in Europe, there choice where to stay, and as said and linked, the major influences are kindred, and ability to speak English.

 

I’ll take that as you admitting you were wrong then. 

[mel b3]

2 hours ago, treetree said:

From the terrible dangers they face in.... France?

At a guess I would say that most of those migrant camps are pretty dangerous places , they're dangerous because they're full of their own kind.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

37 minutes ago, henry d said:

Matters not, they are in Europe, there choice where to stay, and as said and linked, the major influences are kindred, and ability to speak English.

Not their choice at all Henry D.

[SpringDon]

1 hour ago, henry d said:

 

Proof please?

Here's another perspective

I sort of agree with  that. However, the current system of “if you survive long enough to make it here” asylum applications just feeds people smuggling and desperate boat attempts.

There should be more legal ways to apply for asylum, either in the camps or at some point on the route. The only way should be the legal way; chancing it should be a quick way to the back of the queue.

[bwana]

No proof but say 90 % of those who are caught claim asylum,and 90% of these are landed after a stay in taxpayer funded accomodation with allowances,these,another 90 % being say 20 - 30 year old male singles are then off to join their ethnic mates in our urban areas,producing ghettoes where we fear to tread.Refugees ? No,economic migrants,at a time when our own  livelihoods are under great strain.Priti -Man Up !

[Gordon R]

As someone has asked - the pertinent question - just where do you draw the line? Another million, another ten million? At the point you accept any limit, you join those who think we already have enough or even too many.

henry d - I clearly read and digest a whole lot faster than you. Do not judge me by your slower standard.

 

Edited August 20, 2020 by Gordon R

[chesterse]

It’s got to be stopped hasn’t anyone noticed this little country is full up. The only was to do it is change whatever is making this country so attractive to make it unattractive.

[Scully]

I don’t mind at all those who seek to come here legally, but illegally I mind very much indeed. 

[JohnfromUK]

1 hour ago, chesterse said:

hasn’t anyone noticed this little country is full up

This /\. 

1 hour ago, chesterse said:

The only was to do it is change whatever is making this country so attractive

That is more difficult; Free NHS, generous benefits system, priority housing, free legal aid, LOTS of immigrant help groups, all religions supported, etc.  Where to start is the big problem.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Just now, JohnfromUK said:

This /\. 

That is more difficult; Free NHS, generous benefits system, priority housing, free legal aid, LOTS of immigrant help groups, all religions supported, etc.  Where to start is the big problem.

Or just get rid of our liberal inviting set up and send them back.

[JohnfromUK]

Just now, TIGHTCHOKE said:

just get rid of our liberal inviting set up

OK

1 minute ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

and send them back

to where?

[TIGHTCHOKE]

France, if that is where they have come from.

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

France, if that is where they have come from.

They may not accept them

 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

But they should and they should return them to the country that they entered France from.

[JohnfromUK]

Just now, TIGHTCHOKE said:

But they should and they should return them to the country that they entered France from.

I know it is obvious they must have come from France, but the French will deny they were ever there.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

1 minute ago, JohnfromUK said:

I know it is obvious they must have come from France, but the French will deny they were ever there.

And there in lies the problem.

If every country turned them back instead of helping them transit across their country it would stop the problem, but they just move them on in our direction.

[JohnfromUK]

If you have ever dealt with French 'officialdom' you will know tat they only see what they want to see.  If they don't want to see, they shrug their shoulders and pretend they don't understand.  They are the most difficult and obstinate of people when things don't go to their plan.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

All of which I accept, but it has to stop before we have no more room.

 

As Scully said, "legal applications for asylum from legal victims is one thing," economic refugees paying criminals to get them on a boat heading to our shores is not acceptable.

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

All of which I accept, but it has to stop before we have no more room.

 

As Scully said, "legal applications for asylum from legal victims is one thing," economic refugees paying criminals to get them on a boat heading to our shores is not acceptable.

Short of having the Royal Navy sitting just outside French waters and turning everything leaving back - I don't know how we can do it ......... and since the Navy now largely consists of two VAST aircraft carriers that are largely useless - it is not well placed for simple channel based tasks.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

I do not for a minute think it will be easy.

But something has to change, we have taken enough genuine claimants, we should not be taking any more.

[Fuddster]

Radio 2 news announced the HO has secured 4000 hotel rooms for refugees this week-how can that be right?

f.

[JohnfromUK]

Just now, TIGHTCHOKE said:

I do not for a minute think it will be easy.

But something has to change, we have taken enough genuine claimants, we should not be taking any more.

I entirely agree - I am a regular proponent of putting up the "FULL" signs in various threads on these forums.  It does not go down well with all here in these forums - let alone the wider population!

However - how it is to be achieved is way above my pay grade (as a retiree).  I favour a tough line - but there are far too many liberal lefties about for that to happen.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Indeed there are, something has to be done though.

[Rewulf]

From the Spectator.

 

Home Secretary Priti Patel visited the port of Dover last week to gee up the beleaguered Border Force and offer words of encouragement to the British people. 'It is our mission and objective to break this route up,' she told her personal cameraman and tightly-controlled media team. Priti hot footed it out of the docks as soon as the PR stunt was over. Job done for another day. More fake promises of stronger borders by a Conservative party who seem unable to control anything, let alone a porous expanse of water separating England from France.

The reality is we all know what’s going on. Not from the mainstream media who eagerly line the dock side waiting for exhausted looking women and children being brought off the boats. We all know the reality from alternative media and independent reporters that have filled the void.

I’ve covered the migrant crisis for more than five years and worked on the ground in more than eight countries. I’ve visited dozens of refugee camps and illegal migrant encampments. I’ve spent hundreds of hours with refugees and migrants listening to their stories and trying to make sense of this crisis. The picture I see in the news does not reflect my experience and that of many others.

Over my time on the refugee trail, I’ve noticed that the majority of people making the journey to Europe are males between the age of 18-35. In fact I’d estimate up to 85 per cent of the migrant influx is comprised of young men. I always found it difficult to turn on the TV and see women clutching their infants and fathers weeping as they landed on the shores of Greece. Difficult because of the humanitarian empathy that wells up within us all, but also difficult because it’s not a reality I’m seeing on the ground.

Migrants in the Calais 'jungle'

What I found over five years across the Balkans and Europe is not what’s written about in the papers, it’s not the stuff that wins journalism awards. It’s the painful reality that the refugee crisis is more complex than we are led to believe. 'Everyone who needs asylum should be given a safe place,' a leftist volunteer once told me. That’s true and it’s a nice notion to live life by, however the reality is starkly different.

What I’ve witnessed over the years is people, who by their own admission are not refugees, taking advantage of European gullibility and generosity. In 2015, when Merkel declared anyone who came will be welcomed in Germany, the door was truly opened. A green light lit up across the Middle East, Africa and other more far-flung parts of the world. With the aid of Google and volunteer organisations people knew exactly what type of persecution, sexual persuasion, religious or ethnic identity would secure them a ticket into Europe.

I don’t mean to be flippant on the subject of fraudulent asylum claims but it seems all too common. In warehouse refugee camps I’ve witnessed men from Egypt studying maps of Damascus to fabricate their identity. I’ve seen North Africans all claim to be Syrians and coincidently all from Damascus.

Migrants in Belgrade heading for a new life in Europe

Around a fire on the Serbian-Croatian border I’ve shared cigarettes and fruit with middle class, metropolitan Iranians who are taking their chances on reaching Europe. 'We will say we are Christians and suffer problems because of that. I have had friends who say they’re gay and it worked. The funny thing was when he arrived in Berlin they housed him with other gay refugees.'

Countless stories that don’t fit the narrative pushed on the evening telly fall by the way side. Violence, drugs, alcohol, disease and criminality are the bleak reality I saw on Europe’s borders. I shared the hardship to an extent to understand what truly drives people to pack up everything and come to Europe.

Thousands and thousands of genuine refugees suffer in the Balkan barbed wire. More lie restless in stifling, overcrowded camps waiting for their turn to continue onwards to Europe. In the West, we know all of this yet we neglect to have the difficult conversations that are vital moving forwards.

How do we protect public health with an influx of uncontrolled migration? How do we address the elephant in the room: integration? What about family reunification? The numbers are vast! If Germany has six million new arrivals then how many more will come if their families are allowed to join them? How will Europe cope with all these people?

The British public are alarmed by what they see in Dover. Not out of a knee jerk, racist reaction but out of a genuine sense of concern. People have the right to ask questions: Where are these people going to live? What about the school placements? The doctor’s surgeries? The opportunities to work in an already crumbling economy?

The reality is we all know what we are hearing about the refugee crisis is not the full picture. It’s not as clear cut as the London bubble would have us believe. Across the world, there are hundreds of millions who would qualify for EU asylum. The question we are all going to have to ask is how much is enough? How many people can the West really take?

Edward Crawford is a freelance photojournalist and videographer