Poor numbers

[getthegat]

Hi everyone,  so it's been a poor numbers season for me this year, not sure if it's been the heat and lack of rain or that farm equipment is getting more efficient. I had one really good day on laid barley when I achieved nearly 70 birds, a big number for me. Other days though have consistently given single figure outings. Apart from barley, my perms have had wheat and beans, plus I had a day on OSR with a mate. None of the fields other than the barley sites have been reworked, due to the rock hard severely cracked surfaces, hence there is still a lot of beans lying on the floor, which one would expect to attract the grey hoards, but no, all recon has delivered really small numbers of birds. Decoying has proved difficult and flight lines near impossible to track. On the plus side though, my shooting has improved. The day when I got 70 birds, for a bit over 100 shots, I realised that my favourite over under, weighing around 6lb 4oz and no rubber butt pad, firing 32grm shells took its toll on me, so I've switched back to my Franchi Affinity auto to use up the Pigeon Select cartridges and some 32grm 5s. With 1/4 choke I've had kills out to 55 and 60 yards (paces) and even one at around 75 yards. I know the likes of Crow and Digweed regularly drop them at those ranges, and I'm sure some of you keen eyed enthusiastic shooters on PW can as well, but for me it showed a change in my state of mind, coming out of depression and starting to build my confidence. My dog Soph has been diagnosed with bone degeneration due to being dropped or jumping from too high a height at a very young age and being left/dumped with breaks in her toes and ankles, unable to walk for 2 days and this has lead to ongoing issues that we are now coping and dealing with, so a few hours in the hide, just the two of us, with only an occasional retrieval required, has become very special and precious to us both.

[matone]

It`s been a different harvest time for many areas due to the drought making for a much earlier and quick harvest of everything.Pigeons really have been spoilt for choice and are  scattered around .Even when some decent amounts have congregated on a particular food source ,they soon change venue when shooting starts! Personally ,I would say there are more about on my own patch than the last few years,with a lot of young birds this last few weeks.

[Ultrastu]

This year for me has been excellent .and had I been out more often could have had even more birds .

I like to try different fields/times of the day  and use different guns and techniques.   I've managed some big bags with the airgun (50 + ) and even bigger with just the single. 410 .

The crops and farming practices in the valley I shoot has really gone in my favour this year (it doesn't always) . Hence the birds have just preferred to be where I can shoot .

You may find next year is different for you so  chin up .and plan your attack .

[Scully]

Despite the lack of numbers, it looks as though you’ve made a worthwhile discovery regarding your shooting, which is always uplifting. 
Franchi self loaders are superb guns, and I use Pigeon Select 30grm 6’s for all my decoying, whether I’m using an OU or self loader. 
It may be a bit disheartening at times when we set up and returns just aren’t there, but in my opinion it’s just being out there sometimes, just chilling in the bottom of a hedge.
Some don’t understand it, but I think the positives of just being out there ( even if it’s just beating ) and what it does for my mental well being are huge.
Well done, and good look to both you and your dog, in getting to where you want to be. 👍

[oowee]

Quiet moments in a hide. The expectation. Dog poised and a few moments of action before the dog runs to retrieve back to the quiet moments in the hide. It's a special time good for the soul.

[Deadeyealan]

56 minutes ago, oowee said:

Quiet moments in a hide. The expectation. Dog poised and a few moments of action before the dog runs to retrieve back to the quiet moments in the hide. It's a special time good for the soul.

So very true its not always about the shooting, I come home with 3 birds on a poor day and tell the wife I enjoyed my day.

[getthegat]

1 hour ago, Deadeyealan said:

So very true its not always about the shooting, I come home with 3 birds on a poor day and tell the wife I enjoyed my day.

Exactly my thoughts, I've never been into huge numbers, being in the countryside with a bit of action, away from people and the madness of modern life......perfect 

[mossy835]

i enjoy a nice day out, i dont care about big bags its just nice to be out, some go out to get as many as they can, i dont and never have.

[getthegat]

1 hour ago, mossy835 said:

i enjoy a nice day out, i dont care about big bags its just nice to be out, some go out to get as many as they can, i dont and never have.

Well said that man🙂

[marsh man]

Wouldn't it be boring if you could go out and shoot a big bag without trying ? , everyone have a different idea of what is a big bag and we all had to start off somewhere , if anyone is into pigeon shooting they would all like to get at least one big bag , if pigeons are hard to come by in there area and who would normally go home with less than double figures then if they dropped onto one good day of say 40 / 50 then they have hit the jackpot , then on the other hand if you are into pigeon country then everyone would like to get the ton at least once , although I no longer go out with the intention of getting a big bag I do try and get what I can in the duration I am there , lately before the rain came we did have a lot of Pigeons still on the stubble's due to the ground being to hard to start cultivating , so I would set myself a limit of 20 , or what time I set myself to finish came first .

I accept it is nice to get out and there is lot more to pigeon shooting than just shooting pigeons , now I get as much enjoyment keeping a eye on what is going on than the actual shooting , anyone who is not interested in what is going on the countryside wont be a long term pigeon shooter . 

[getthegat]

5 minutes ago, marsh man said:

Wouldn't it be boring if you could go out and shoot a big bag without trying ? , everyone have a different idea of what is a big bag and we all had to start off somewhere , if anyone is into pigeon shooting they would all like to get at least one big bag , if pigeons are hard to come by in there area and who would normally go home with less than double figures then if they dropped onto one good day of say 40 / 50 then they have hit the jackpot , then on the other hand if you are into pigeon country then everyone would like to get the ton at least once , although I no longer go out with the intention of getting a big bag I do try and get what I can in the duration I am there , lately before the rain came we did have a lot of Pigeons still on the stubble's due to the ground being to hard to start cultivating , so I would set myself a limit of 20 , or what time I set myself to finish came first .

I accept it is nice to get out and there is lot more to pigeon shooting than just shooting pigeons , now I get as much enjoyment keeping a eye on what is going on than the actual shooting , anyone who is not interested in what is going on the countryside wont be a long term pigeon shooter . 

Thanks for your words, my post was more of an observation than a complaint, for me 20 or 30 is a great outing and enjoying the countryside, while we still can is really important. 

[marsh man]

4 minutes ago, getthegat said:

Thanks for your words, my post was more of an observation than a complaint, for me 20 or 30 is a great outing and enjoying the countryside, while we still can is really important. 

I know you wasn't complaining and I certainly wasn't having a dig at you , I enjoyed your post and really felt sorry for your dog , touch wood I have never suffered from any form of depression and that could be that over the years I have spent a large part of my life in the countryside and I can honestly say that I never tire from being in the country , wild fowling was my passion for well over a half century and I have spent many days and nights in often inclement  weather , when I got home in the early morning , very often wet and cold I would be looking forward in doing the same the following night , now I have got all the time I want I still spend day after day going for walks and just enjoying the surroundings , yes I do have ups and downs but I never let the downs get out of hand.

Hope you stay well and your dog keep active for a good few years to come . 

[clangerman]

numbers continue to decline here fourth year in a row now resigned to taking what I can get so long as i shoot a few for the dog 

Edited September 12, 2022 by clangerman

[getthegat]

Thanks everyone for the kind words and encouragement, it looks like we will just have to accept what we can get and afterall it is about crop protection so if the numbers aren't there then the crops should need less protection. Countryside is a great healer and once in it, I struggle to Kee to a packing up time, wanting just a few more minutes for maybe one more bird. We're moving house shortly, from an upstairs maisonette with 2 flights of stairs to a bungalow, this has mainly been driven by Sophs leg issues (quite something when your dog decides you need to move😄) its all about adapting. Cheers again. Stay safe. Keep your powder dry 🙂

[Lsto]

Nice write up. The farm I shoot is part of a club so unfortunately for me loads of  people have constant access to it which means it's regularly pressured. Many times I have popped there after work and set up for a few hours only to not fire a single round. A double figure bag is a rarity but regardless I try to enjoy a few hours of peace alone with the world. Life these days is chaotic and it's the little things in life that make all the difference. I don't get out half as much as I like so I savour it when I do. I enjoyed the write up, its always interesting to get that little snapshot into another shooters world.  Well done and keep them coming.

[getthegat]

1 hour ago, Lsto said:

Nice write up. The farm I shoot is part of a club so unfortunately for me loads of  people have constant access to it which means it's regularly pressured. Many times I have popped there after work and set up for a few hours only to not fire a single round. A double figure bag is a rarity but regardless I try to enjoy a few hours of peace alone with the world. Life these days is chaotic and it's the little things in life that make all the difference. I don't get out half as much as I like so I savour it when I do. I enjoyed the write up, its always interesting to get that little snapshot into another shooters world.  Well done and keep them coming.

Nice 👍

[Wilts#Dave]

Seems to have been plenty about in my area this summer, after a lean spring. So much to do with cropping though, one farm grew 150 odd acres of peas which the pigeons found and stayed on. Another couple grew rape where they haven’t been the last few years and had some good bags on the stubble…..this year neither may be grown or in good fields and the shooting could drop right off next year. For me / in my area the crops and where they’re grown is key in the numbers we shoot.
How big an area do you cover? 
I find it changes year on year as to which farms I shoot the most pigeons on…..one year will be great and the following year might be terrible for numbers but better somewhere else. 
It’s a funny old game, but I’m as addicted now as I was when I started going with the old man 30 odd years ago. 
If I had unlimited time and access to all the ground I found pigeons on I could be a lot busier, alas most of us have restrictions as to where and when we shoot! 

[marsh man]

1 hour ago, Wilts#Dave said:

Seems to have been plenty about in my area this summer, after a lean spring. So much to do with cropping though, one farm grew 150 odd acres of peas which the pigeons found and stayed on. Another couple grew rape where they haven’t been the last few years and had some good bags on the stubble…..this year neither may be grown or in good fields and the shooting could drop right off next year. For me / in my area the crops and where they’re grown is key in the numbers we shoot.
How big an area do you cover? 
I find it changes year on year as to which farms I shoot the most pigeons on…..one year will be great and the following year might be terrible for numbers but better somewhere else. 
It’s a funny old game, but I’m as addicted now as I was when I started going with the old man 30 odd years ago. 
If I had unlimited time and access to all the ground I found pigeons on I could be a lot busier, alas most of us have restrictions as to where and when we shoot! 

One thing I have noticed this Summer is not so much of the lack of birds but more of a case of lack of shooters .

Even though I have got the time I haven't looked for any shooting for several years now and when I moved I gave up a lot as it would had cost a fortune on fuel to keep an eye on then , not only that , a subject we have pulled about a lot is getting rid of the shot birds , I now limit myself what I shoot and will only shoot an amount I can move on .

Going by what I see around the countryside I am not the only one , since the harvest we have had good numbers of Pigeons , and like your perm they have been hitting our seed Peas a lot and to be honest the amount of Pea seed left after the combine finished you would have thought there was no way the Pigeons could clear them up , but when I looked yesterday they are finally thinning it out .

I have passed fields of Wheat stubble since the harvest finished with a lot of Pigeons feeding and not a sign of anyone shooting , these are left day after day and you can now drive along the B road and they are well within gunshot and don't bother to stop feeding let alone fly away .

So if all these fields hold Pigeons and no one is going after them you cannot expect them to clear off and go elsewhere while they have got a good supply of food and they can eat it in peace as they are unlikely to be moved on by the land owner while they are not doing a lot of harm .

[Wilts#Dave]

1 hour ago, marsh man said:

One thing I have noticed this Summer is not so much of the lack of birds but more of a case of lack of shooters .

Even though I have got the time I haven't looked for any shooting for several years now and when I moved I gave up a lot as it would had cost a fortune on fuel to keep an eye on then , not only that , a subject we have pulled about a lot is getting rid of the shot birds , I now limit myself what I shoot and will only shoot an amount I can move on .

Going by what I see around the countryside I am not the only one , since the harvest we have had good numbers of Pigeons , and like your perm they have been hitting our seed Peas a lot and to be honest the amount of Pea seed left after the combine finished you would have thought there was no way the Pigeons could clear them up , but when I looked yesterday they are finally thinning it out .

I have passed fields of Wheat stubble since the harvest finished with a lot of Pigeons feeding and not a sign of anyone shooting , these are left day after day and you can now drive along the B road and they are well within gunshot and don't bother to stop feeding let alone fly away .

So if all these fields hold Pigeons and no one is going after them you cannot expect them to clear off and go elsewhere while they have got a good supply of food and they can eat it in peace as they are unlikely to be moved on by the land owner while they are not doing a lot of harm .

We haven’t got sole access to any land, but like you aren’t inundated with other shooters. There are several older  retired chaps from the farm shoot who frequent the peas when they’re grown on the one particular but don’t shoot many really and can’t quite work out how I shoot what I do. They spend more time looking at them to be honest and I don’t think they’d know what to do if they shot a big bag!
They aren’t as keen as I am though,  although we did have a guide operate in the area at one point who was a bit of a nuisance. 

As you say getting rid of the numbers puts off Dad from bothering to go on his own much these days, so tends to leave it to me (he’s always with me though). I’ve had a good few hundred plus days over the summer, but much less overall than last year. 
I’m guessing you could have shot more than you have, does that frustrate you at all? 
 

[yickdaz]

3 hours ago, Wilts#Dave said:

Seems to have been plenty about in my area this summer, after a lean spring. So much to do with cropping though, one farm grew 150 odd acres of peas which the pigeons found and stayed on. Another couple grew rape where they haven’t been the last few years and had some good bags on the stubble…..this year neither may be grown or in good fields and the shooting could drop right off next year. For me / in my area the crops and where they’re grown is key in the numbers we shoot.
How big an area do you cover? 
I find it changes year on year as to which farms I shoot the most pigeons on…..one year will be great and the following year might be terrible for numbers but better somewhere else. 
It’s a funny old game, but I’m as addicted now as I was when I started going with the old man 30 odd years ago. 
If I had unlimited time and access to all the ground I found pigeons on I could be a lot busier, alas most of us have restrictions as to where and when we shoot! 

thats exactly how it is with us i make a note each year of the bag numbers in certain areas and there;s a definite pattern to each area they come good one year and bad the next you get to know which area will be good or not each year saves a lot of driving and fuel

[marsh man]

13 minutes ago, Wilts#Dave said:

We haven’t got sole access to any land, but like you aren’t inundated with other shooters. There are several older  retired chaps from the farm shoot who frequent the peas when they’re grown on the one particular but don’t shoot many really and can’t quite work out how I shoot what I do. They spend more time looking at them to be honest and I don’t think they’d know what to do if they shot a big bag!
They aren’t as keen as I am though,  although we did have a guide operate in the area at one point who was a bit of a nuisance. 

As you say getting rid of the numbers puts off Dad from bothering to go on his own much these days, so tends to leave it to me (he’s always with me though). I’ve had a good few hundred plus days over the summer, but much less overall than last year. 
I’m guessing you could have shot more than you have, does that frustrate you at all? 
 

I dare say when I was younger it was like a drug , I just couldn't get enough , we had a lot of land and wasn't that worried about other shooters , if the odd time someone else was there we just moved on to the next farm , it got to the stage where if we saw someone else on more than once we would let them have it to themselves as we wern't that keen watching a field then someone else turn up the day before we intended to shoot the field , in time we built up a lot of land where we were more or less the sole shooters , I know it happen but I find it hard to believe that members cant find perms,  if you are keen enough then you would go out of your way to find Pigeon shooting , maybe our area is less populated than most areas and a fair bit of it is not shot over , but like your land and Daz it do change from year to year , although when you get to know the area you do start to know where to look and where the main crops will be , one of the reasons you need a lot of land to shoot a lot of Pigeons , and not forgetting a lot of time as well .

Could I have shot more Pigeons ? , yes I could have done but that would had been mainly from the harvest onward's , My ( year ) start as soon as the four Saturday roost shooting in February finish , I am then giving a map where all the various crops are grown , I start off with keeping the Pigeons ( if there is any ) off the rape , then around April it start to re grow and our Peas go in , these and the odd rape field keep me happy till they are cut , or any barley have gone down , then this year we had a early start to the harvest and this continued non stop for close on five weeks , when it was over it was time for me to relax , I could easily have shot virtually every day but age and lack of demand for the bag put paid to that , I can still move on a few but not a fraction of the numbers we once did , funny enough I took 25 today to the hotel we have got on the estate , what a rig more roll , Monday I took 22 to the butcher to process me 20 , he charge me £1.50 each , today I went and picked them and paid him , just after dinner I dropped my wife off at the garden centre and carried on to the hotel , on top of the 20 the new chef wanted a extra 5 so he could try his hand at plucking , I charged them £2 for the extra 5 and £45 for the processed ones , this gave me £15 for the birds , taking them to the butcher , picking them up and then take them another 5 miles to the hotel , and my payment will go through a bank transfer , when ? , there is no telling but they will pay when they are ready , so as you can see , the easy days of moving them on are possibly over but you can still move on a few , do I get frustrated not being abel to shoot a big bag , no I don't , in fact I enjoy a fairly relaxing afternoon more now than shooting more than I need .

[getthegat]

18 hours ago, Wilts#Dave said:

Seems to have been plenty about in my area this summer, after a lean spring. So much to do with cropping though, one farm grew 150 odd acres of peas which the pigeons found and stayed on. Another couple grew rape where they haven’t been the last few years and had some good bags on the stubble…..this year neither may be grown or in good fields and the shooting could drop right off next year. For me / in my area the crops and where they’re grown is key in the numbers we shoot.
How big an area do you cover? 
I find it changes year on year as to which farms I shoot the most pigeons on…..one year will be great and the following year might be terrible for numbers but better somewhere else. 
It’s a funny old game, but I’m as addicted now as I was when I started going with the old man 30 odd years ago. 
If I had unlimited time and access to all the ground I found pigeons on I could be a lot busier, alas most of us have restrictions as to where and when we shoot! 

I'm not that good on acre sizes, but at a wild guess at this moment I have 150 to 200 acres of bean stubble and maybe double that of rotavated barley and wheat stubble. Apparently a lot is going into OSR later this year. I have very little woodland so not a lot of roosting places. I think I've got about 20 years addiction on you, having been brought up in the Somerset countryside. 

[Wilts#Dave]

8 hours ago, getthegat said:

I'm not that good on acre sizes, but at a wild guess at this moment I have 150 to 200 acres of bean stubble and maybe double that of rotavated barley and wheat stubble. Apparently a lot is going into OSR later this year. I have very little woodland so not a lot of roosting places. I think I've got about 20 years addiction on you, having been brought up in the Somerset countryside. 

I’d expect the rape to have been drilled or being drilled very soon. 
There’s a definite fact that some areas as well as parts within those areas just don’t hold good numbers of pigeons…..some of our farms are a lot more productive than others irrelevant of cropping, and only half an hours drive apart for example. 
Surprised those beans haven’t drawn any pigeons, not doing so at this time of year would certainly suggest you’re low on numbers.
I’ve only had a couple of farms with beans, one they didn’t really hit but was cut early on and cultivated…..the other only cut them a couple of weeks ago and they finally found them and built up over the last few days, shot 124 this afternoon on them with my little 28g. They’re very close to a large block of pea stubble and there’s been a good number of pigeons in the area for a while. 
Dad’s been shooting for over 60 years, but happy for me to do the shooting generally these days (as long as he’s there he’s happy). 
Fingers crossed next year is a better year for you numbers wise. I know I won’t have the acreage of peas next year and the rape has gone into fields that aren’t in great locations so I may well have a poor run next year…..who knows eh, that’s what keeps it interesting! 

[getthegat]

One minor bonus to all of this, is that I don't need to carry so many cartridges or hump so many birds across the field at the end😄 Really it was about an observation and half a dozen well shot woodies in a couple of hours, watching the local hawks and buzzards etc, being away from work, it's very pleasurable. 

[marsh man]

12 hours ago, Wilts#Dave said:

I’d expect the rape to have been drilled or being drilled very soon. 
There’s a definite fact that some areas as well as parts within those areas just don’t hold good numbers of pigeons…..some of our farms are a lot more productive than others irrelevant of cropping, and only half an hours drive apart for example. 
Surprised those beans haven’t drawn any pigeons, not doing so at this time of year would certainly suggest you’re low on numbers.
I’ve only had a couple of farms with beans, one they didn’t really hit but was cut early on and cultivated…..the other only cut them a couple of weeks ago and they finally found them and built up over the last few days, shot 124 this afternoon on them with my little 28g. They’re very close to a large block of pea stubble and there’s been a good number of pigeons in the area for a while. 
Dad’s been shooting for over 60 years, but happy for me to do the shooting generally these days (as long as he’s there he’s happy). 
Fingers crossed next year is a better year for you numbers wise. I know I won’t have the acreage of peas next year and the rape has gone into fields that aren’t in great locations so I may well have a poor run next year…..who knows eh, that’s what keeps it interesting! 

Very good post and another 100 plus bag is to be admired , Glad your dad is still taking part and keeping an eye on proceedings , he would be roughly the same age as me and now we can look back at the sport we have had , yes I still call it sport , and can now be grateful we are still out there and just doing enough without over doing it .

Some of our rape have gone in along with the Fodder Radish , the ground was rock hard at the time and extremely dry but it is now beginning to Green over, now we have had a fair bit of rain off and on during the week the tractors are now starting to pull all the stubble's up , so the pigeon gear will soon go away in three or four weeks time as our first shoot is the last Saturday of October.

This morning was the coldest it had been since the Spring and with the nights pulling in fast and the Acorns dropping off the trees I think we can safely say that the Summer is well and truly behind us .

Good Luck if you have one or two more days .