BASC (and other representative bodies) pointless and toothless?

[old'un]

10 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Well done, but you have to allow dissent, which leads to debate.

Yes, bit like the “Putin announces 'military operation' in Ukraine” thread, 163 pages and still counting.

Does anyone know what the record number of pages are for a PW thread.

[Newbie to this]

10 minutes ago, old'un said:

Does anyone know what the record number of pages are for a PW thread.

Don't know for sure, but the Brexit one has to be a contender. 398

Edited October 21, 2022 by Newbie to this

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Long way to go yet!

[old'un]

19 minutes ago, Newbie to this said:

Don't know for sure, but the Brexit one has to be a contender. 398

I see the hand of Zapp ended that one, what happened to him not seen him about for ages, bet ditchman’s happy.

[clangerman]

10 minutes ago, old'un said:

I see the hand of Zapp ended that one, what happened to him not seen him about for ages, bet ditchman’s happy.

with the putin thread rammed with name calling and insults yet still open despite a warning we could certainly do with his return 

[bruno22rf]

1 hour ago, jall25 said:

Not sure about that TC - asked a civil question 

No real answer  

Our MPs came on a none shoot day - so it cost nothing - they went away however with a better opinion on shooting and conservation than they came with. - I have also had members of the council come local and borough and the same result. I have taken round young surveyors / children with parents from the local schools etc etc - If we dont ALL stand up for our sport then yes it may well be gone.

As i say Bruno what do you do ? Try something positive 

You know absolutely nothing about what I do so your implications, again, are just pure spiteful conjecture. I answered your question perfectly but not with  the answer that you wanted so you now resort to calling me a troll. Been on this forum for more years than I care to remember and made many friends, tutored a few in FAC and taken a few out shooting (I'm trying to sort out 5k acres for a disabled gun at this very moment) but none of this matters in your world where everthing you think you know is gospel. So fire away pal, I've got skin a whole lot thicker than you will ever dent, first person on this forum in 10 years I'm going to ignore so dont expect me to try and defend myself against any more of your petty venom. PS. still will not waste a penny on BASC. 

[old'un]

PW is getting like the house of parliament.

[Newbie to this]

59 minutes ago, old'un said:

I see the hand of Zapp ended that one, what happened to him not seen him about for ages, bet ditchman’s happy.

Hasn't been on since February 

[Gordon R]

The Putin thread 163+ and Brexit 398 were / are lengthy and neither has come to a harmonious conclusion.

Can't we discover another Burnley Dave - the Roy Batty (Rutger Hauer) of PW whose light shone brightly, but not as long as the aforementioned other threads.

[jall25]

6 hours ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

 

 

12 hours ago, harkom said:

jall25 - you a life member of bsac by any chance?

Not even a member

regards

[HantsRob]

A question that's been eating away at me.....

 

is BASC set up for game shooters, and not clay shooters? When I read a lot of these posts the positivity seems to come from game shooters rather than clay shooters.

I may perceive it wrong, but much of my perception is those that shoot game are ok with the potential lead ban, and clay shooters are obviously appalled at the lack of support.

Is there a direct correlation here to senior persons in BASC etc who are primarily game shooters, which may give a perception and actual slant on their fight, rather than a more broad view or opposite view of clay shooters?

I ask for discussion, and certainly happy to learn. It's not anti or positive, just an observation. Oh, and yes, I am a member of one of the top 4 shooting organisations/charities for insurance and shooting. 

[harkom]

22 hours ago, jall25 said:

 

Not even a member

regards

...leaves me wonderin' how you are so well versed in bsac bs if you aren't reading their propaganda ?

 

[jall25]

10 hours ago, harkom said:

...leaves me wonderin' how you are so well versed in bsac bs if you aren't reading their propaganda ?

 

 

10 hours ago, harkom said:

...leaves me wonderin' how you are so well versed in bsac bs if you aren't reading their propaganda ?

 

Who are you with then ?

[Keith 66]

For what its worth my take on Basc is as follows.

I was a member of Wagbi when i started shooting & wildfowling then Basc. The relatively traditional formal structure of wildfowling clubs meant a far higher degree of interaction between those affilated clubs & their governing body, Club members were generally motivated & could be relied upon to lobby, write letters & vote to a far higher degree than today.

Today many such clubs have shrinking aging memberships & apathy rules, getting any club members to even vote for a wildfowling candidate at a council election is hopeless. You only have to look at the numbers of votes cast to see this is true.

Basc do get some things right, quite a few years ago I had a lot of grief from an Feo at renewal time, the guy was rude aggressive & arrogant, not just to me but several other club members,  Thanks to Mike Eveleigh's intervention from the Basc firearms dept he was removed as an Feo. Top marks there!

11 Years as a wildfowling club secretary necessitated much contact with Basc officers & staff, all were universally helpful & professional.

However during my time as secretary of Cwca the emphasis on Game shooting became apparent, not surprising as Basc's remit broadened. And so its original wildfowling membership became less of a percentage in Basc's membership & their clout lessened.

Go back ten years or so & there was much talk of Basc buying land & leasing the land bank back to smaller clubs. This nearly came about but for some reason Basc top brass were vehemently against it & the idea was killed off. I suspect that the game shooting interests were behind this. I am convinced this was a major mistake on their part & has left many smaller clubs & syndicates in the position where they have no future.

We have seen Kent dissafiliate from Basc & we know that their business model works. Its an absolute no brainer.   But for many smaller clubs the choice has become stay as you are, wither away & die or get eaten by a larger club.  The wildfowl habitat trust wasnt really an option as repayment times were short & costs such as to make it unviable, its got no better in todays world.

Im still a Basc member through my club but wish things had gone another way.

[jall25]

Good post above

As we have Conor on here - who it has to be applauded continues to provide as much information as he can while not having universal support - i wonder if we could actually start a properly civil thread whereby we ask BASC to actually look at what we want ?

 

For me - 

More engagement with the public through from schools - scout clubs etc

Maybe make films like Jacks Game -many series on discovery showing hunting and fishing are very popular - like Alaska the Last frontier - The last Alaskans - through to some of the more edgy stuff showing crocodile hunting. See if we can get an ambassador to front it like Clarkson, Vinnie Jones or Beefy.

Who would have thought Clarkson's farm would be so popular - it would be very easy to add a Shooting and Conservation aspect to this and it has been touched on already.

I would like BASC to assist with land purchases and Bio-diversity surveys - during Covid they came round and advised on the shoot days formats for free - so why not push this out and help shoots become better places ?

 

Just a couple of ideas and i appreciate some think i am part of BASCs defence committee - im not - I am actually with GWCT but i do believe we all need to try and get on the same page if we can.

 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

All very nice, living in the past.

What is done is done.

BASC have decided to replace lead in order to keep the commercial game shoots alive at the cost of all of us who shoot a few pheasants, wood pigeons and rabbits.

They have sold the ordinary shooting man down the river and there is no turning back.

[clangerman]

good on you TT at last the truth no doubt a reply of the old cobblers one go all go will appear shortly 

[Scully]

2 hours ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

All very nice, living in the past.

What is done is done.

BASC have decided to replace lead in order to keep the commercial game shoots alive at the cost of all of us who shoot a few pheasants, wood pigeons and rabbits.

They have sold the ordinary shooting man down the river and there is no turning back.

Here we go again. 🙂

The decision wasn’t BASC’s. It wasn’t BASC’s decision to ban lead shot over wetlands or for wildfowl, and it’s isn’t their decision now. It’s politics, plain and simple.
There are agendas at work here, and one of them is the environment, pushed by all those who will jump on any bandwagon in their pursuance of that agenda against government policy, the wealthy, and any other class they perceive to be privileged and entitled. The CND and all those rabid resentful organisations from the 70’s haven’t gone away, they’ve just morphed into those we have now. 
Consumers and environmentalists are ruling the roost now, and they increasingly dictate policy.
If game dealers can’t sell lead shot game to consumers then they won’t buy it.
I’ve been informed that steel is more expensive to process than lead, and that once it corrodes it causes more damage to the environment than lead does, but that doesn’t matter because the case against lead has been made. The effluent pits which are a side effect of battery production are hugely toxic, but no one cares; there is now an agenda to pursue and political policies built on that agenda. It’s all rubbish, and we know it is, but we’re outnumbered. 
This topic has now morphed into yet another prime example of how un-united UK shooters are. 
Has anyone heard of the CPSA’s condemnation of the proposed lead ban? Have they condemned it or are they keeping a low profile in the hope they won’t be affected? It’s a genuine question as I don’t know. 
Has anyone considered the reaction of all those who oppose what we do, from individuals to groups and organisations, and politicians and political parties, if BASC and all the shooting organisations just turned round and said ‘we aren’t complying’? 

I was talking to representatives from Gamebore and Eley yesterday ( got some freebies! 🙂) and it was most enlightening, but they are all gearing up for and developing steel loads because it is good business sense to do so. Not because BASC has decided lead should be fazed out, but because the governments of many countries at some point are going to introduce a cut off date. It’s not up to BASC. 

If you want to save shooting, get your act together now for the campaign that is inevitable against steel when it is found it is much more detrimental than lead. 
 

1 hour ago, clangerman said:

good on you TT at last the truth no doubt a reply of the old cobblers one go all go will appear shortly 

And right on cue, here’s that old cobbler! 😀

Tell us oh wise and wonderful one, why you think you will be left to pop the odd pigeon or two if game shooting goes. 
I’m all ears! 🦻🙂

[old'un]

34 minutes ago, Scully said:

Here we go again. 🙂

The decision wasn’t BASC’s. It wasn’t BASC’s decision to ban lead shot over wetlands or for wildfowl, and it’s isn’t their decision now. It’s politics, plain and simple.
There are agendas at work here, and one of them is the environment, pushed by all those who will jump on any bandwagon in their pursuance of that agenda against government policy, the wealthy, and any other class they perceive to be privileged and entitled. The CND and all those rabid resentful organisations from the 70’s haven’t gone away, they’ve just morphed into those we have now. 
Consumers and environmentalists are ruling the roost now, and they increasingly dictate policy.
If game dealers can’t sell lead shot game to consumers then they won’t buy it.
I’ve been informed that steel is more expensive to process than lead, and that once it corrodes it causes more damage to the environment than lead does, but that doesn’t matter because the case against lead has been made. The effluent pits which are a side effect of battery production are hugely toxic, but no one cares; there is now an agenda to pursue and political policies built on that agenda. It’s all rubbish, and we know it is, but we’re outnumbered. 
This topic has now morphed into yet another prime example of how un-united UK shooters are. 
Has anyone heard of the CPSA’s condemnation of the proposed lead ban? Have they condemned it or are they keeping a low profile in the hope they won’t be affected? It’s a genuine question as I don’t know. 
Has anyone considered the reaction of all those who oppose what we do, from individuals to groups and organisations, and politicians and political parties, if BASC and all the shooting organisations just turned round and said ‘we aren’t complying’? 

I was talking to representatives from Gamebore and Eley yesterday ( got some freebies! 🙂) and it was most enlightening, but they are all gearing up for and developing steel loads because it is good business sense to do so. Not because BASC has decided lead should be fazed out, but because the governments of many countries at some point are going to introduce a cut off date. It’s not up to BASC. 

If you want to save shooting, get your act together now for the campaign that is inevitable against steel when it is found it is much more detrimental than lead. 
 

And right on cue, here’s that old cobbler! 😀

Tell us oh wise and wonderful one, why you think you will be left to pop the odd pigeon or two if game shooting goes. 
I’m all ears! 🦻🙂

Great post Scully.

[clangerman]

45 minutes ago, Scully said:

 

 

And right on cue, here’s that old cobbler! 😀

Tell us oh wise and wonderful one, why you think you will be left to pop the odd pigeon or two if game shooting goes. 
I’m all ears! 🦻🙂

such a tasty morsel deserves a take my friend so never gave a jot for the law only tolerate it for the ticket which I’m not renewing so regardless of idiot starry boy shutting all or some of us down my freezer will never be empty glad your feeling better wouldn’t be the same if you pegged it 

Edited October 23, 2022 by clangerman

[London Best]

40 minutes ago, Scully said:

Here we go again. 🙂

The decision wasn’t BASC’s. It wasn’t BASC’s decision to ban lead shot over wetlands or for wildfowl, and it’s isn’t their decision now. It’s politics, plain and simple.
There are agendas at work here, and one of them is the environment, pushed by all those who will jump on any bandwagon in their pursuance of that agenda against government policy, the wealthy, and any other class they perceive to be privileged and entitled. The CND and all those rabid resentful organisations from the 70’s haven’t gone away, they’ve just morphed into those we have now. 
Consumers and environmentalists are ruling the roost now, and they increasingly dictate policy.
If game dealers can’t sell lead shot game to consumers then they won’t buy it.
I’ve been informed that steel is more expensive to process than lead, and that once it corrodes it causes more damage to the environment than lead does, but that doesn’t matter because the case against lead has been made. The effluent pits which are a side effect of battery production are hugely toxic, but no one cares; there is now an agenda to pursue and political policies built on that agenda. It’s all rubbish, and we know it is, but we’re outnumbered. 
This topic has now morphed into yet another prime example of how un-united UK shooters are. 
Has anyone heard of the CPSA’s condemnation of the proposed lead ban? Have they condemned it or are they keeping a low profile in the hope they won’t be affected? It’s a genuine question as I don’t know. 
Has anyone considered the reaction of all those who oppose what we do, from individuals to groups and organisations, and politicians and political parties, if BASC and all the shooting organisations just turned round and said ‘we aren’t complying’? 

I was talking to representatives from Gamebore and Eley yesterday ( got some freebies! 🙂) and it was most enlightening, but they are all gearing up for and developing steel loads because it is good business sense to do so. Not because BASC has decided lead should be fazed out, but because the governments of many countries at some point are going to introduce a cut off date. It’s not up to BASC. 

If you want to save shooting, get your act together now for the campaign that is inevitable against steel when it is found it is much more detrimental than lead. 
 

And right on cue, here’s that old cobbler! 😀

Tell us oh wise and wonderful one, why you think you will be left to pop the odd pigeon or two if game shooting goes. 
I’m all ears! 🦻🙂

Spot on Scully.

[Scully]

Just now, clangerman said:

such a tasty morsel deserves a take my friend so never gave a jot for the law only tolerate it for the ticket which I’m not renewing so regardless of idiot starry boy shutting all of some of us down my freezer will never be empty glad your feeling better wouldn’t be the same if you pegged it 

Thanks, but I haven’t been ill. 
Just let us know when you can be bothered getting round to answering the question. There’s no rush, just when you’re ready. 👍

[clangerman]

6 minutes ago, Scully said:

Thanks, but I haven’t been ill. 
Just let us know when you can be bothered getting round to answering the question. There’s no rush, just when you’re ready. 👍

someone as smart as you should have no problem working out my meaning but to oblige starmer will gain power regardless of his actions i will continue filling my freezer but not from peoples birds that’s plain rude 

[Scully]

1 minute ago, clangerman said:

someone as smart as you should have no problem working out my meaning but to oblige starmer will gain power regardless of his actions i will continue filling my freezer but not from peoples birds that’s plain rude 

That’s a cop out and everyone knows it, even you, but no doubt you’ll be back to applaud someone who comes up with a reply.  
As usual you just don’t have a clue. 

[clangerman]

7 minutes ago, Scully said:

That’s a cop out and everyone knows it, even you, but no doubt you’ll be back to applaud someone who comes up with a reply.  
As usual you just don’t have a clue. 

I will leave your abusive reply to speak for itself then have a nice day