Universal Basic Income coming to England

[discobob]

Some people may have watched Beyond The Reset that I have put up before, some may have scoffed at it. However, it has been announced today that UBI is to be trailed in 2 areas of England like it is in Wales. £1600 per month for doing nothing. But who will be paying for this I wonder or have the consocialists found a Magic Money Tree?

if you haven’t watched it please do look it up on YouTube 

Meanwhile here is Jeff on it

 

[Newbie to this]

I strongly object to UBI, and shall be making this clear to my MP and the PM's office. This is not what I pay Taxes for.

[Fargo]

Belgium is like this . Those who are not working or choose not to get 1800€ per month. However you have to pay for health care and housing. 

[grahamch]

Very canny if you can get it but what about hard working folks and who will pay ofr it?

 

We need a reduction in state benefits not more to get lazy **** back to work

 

[TOPGUN749]

I don’t get this universal basic income thing! Maybe I am missing something? So,if everyone over 18,and that’s about 54 million people were to be given an extra income of say £18,000 a year regardless of the income they already have,that would cost the government about 972 billion a year,ok, so some of it would go back as tax,but could still be 700 billion or more nett.Would government simply print this money? As their revenue is already spoken for with existing commitments.

So it can only be pie in the sky! This country couldn’t afford to give anything away as things stand.

[Acerforestry]

Interesting how so much of this has been predicted several years back by a number of individuals with keen foresight, and now here we are. This is not going to end well, less so when the Centralised Bank and digital ID's come in 

Edited June 5, 2023 by Acerforestry

[Scully]

400 quid a week? I couldn’t live off that and I’m not sure I know anyone who could, but I suppose it would be a big help to those on the poverty line. 🤷‍♂️

[TOPGUN749]

£400 a week,many live on far less, universal credit is about £80 for a single person plus their accommodation costs. I currently live on under £200 a week though no mortgage now!

[armsid]

Sweden did a project at abolishing the welfare state and paying 1200c a month they would save money makes you wonder what they are paying out. This is more than some oap,s get and they are paying tax .As has been qouted where is the money coming from?

[Scully]

One annoying comment was the need to offset ‘ the shock of climate change’, whereas in fact the only ‘shock’ is that created by governments in their rush to address a non-existent problem. 

[Fargo]

They also pay the money out ( maybe this is why we are set in a few years to have 1,000,000 migrants a year coming here) but raise taxes on everything . 
 

Lot of people could live of it but if the housing benefits where stopped  and rents paid you would not have a lot , if any left.

[Lloyd90]

I’m all for it, I’m well up for a system that is fair and pays the same to everyone:  
 

Why am I paying 40% + in taxes but get almost nothing back?! 

Then someone who pays no tax can claim their housing benefit, mobility car, PIP, DLA, reduced council tax, get a council property at a fraction of market rate rent and then after years buy it for a fraction of the market value? 
 

My wife is expecting our first child in October … we were told to check child tax credits, as apparently will pay her NI stamp whilst off on maternity pay. She will get it but I then have to repay the entire amount so we get nothing. 
 

So far this year, and we’re only 2 months in I’ve paid just under £3.5k in tax and NI (just tax +) and yet I’m entitled to a lot less than people who’ve not paid a penny in their lives. 

[Yellow Bear]

8 hours ago, Lloyd90 said:

I’m all for it, I’m well up for a system that is fair and pays the same to everyone:  
 

Why am I paying 40% + in taxes but get almost nothing back?! 

Then someone who pays no tax can claim their housing benefit, mobility car, PIP, DLA, reduced council tax, get a council property at a fraction of market rate rent and then after years buy it for a fraction of the market value? 
 

My wife is expecting our first child in October … we were told to check child tax credits, as apparently will pay her NI stamp whilst off on maternity pay. She will get it but I then have to repay the entire amount so we get nothing. 
 

So far this year, and we’re only 2 months in I’ve paid just under £3.5k in tax and NI (just tax +) and yet I’m entitled to a lot less than people who’ve not paid a penny in their lives. 

and yet Starmer wants to reduce services in what he calls "affluent areas"(You know areas  where higher rate taxpayers live), increase higher rate taxes, and yet some of these will still vote for him.

[Lloyd90]

1 hour ago, Yellow Bear said:

and yet Starmer wants to reduce services in what he calls "affluent areas"(You know areas  where higher rate taxpayers live), increase higher rate taxes, and yet some of these will still vote for him.

Higher tax rates in what way is the question? 
 

Surely not for the people in the 40% bracket by just a few grand. 
 

As usual, everyone wants to see the bit corporations making billions upon billions every year pay more tax. 
 

The current Tory Government has been such a shambles people will vote for any party that ain’t them. 

[discobob]

6 minutes ago, Lloyd90 said:

The current Tory Government has been such a shambles

But it isn't really a Tory Government thing - it is any Government thing - the WA (labour run for +20 years) - have been trialling UBI since last year - theirs is focussed on people leaving social care environments who generally have no support networks available for them and I do sort of see it as a good thing - in that particular "narrow" exception - but it will be when it is being rolled out further and capturing more in the UBI net they will need more money to fund it - and as we all know governments don't actually have money - they get it from us - and they will want more and more from us.

As I started - it isn't Torry - it is a socialist construct that is being pushed down from supra-national organisations that don't get voted on.

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/04/covid-19-universal-basic-income-social-inequality/

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/08/why-data-needs-to-underpin-the-basic-income-debate/

They publish it themselves - totally transparent - but yet everybody calls people like me a Conspiracy Theorist and throws tin-foil comments my way. 

What do you think Furlough was???

[TOPGUN749]

1 hour ago, Yellow Bear said:

and yet Starmer wants to reduce services in what he calls "affluent areas"(You know areas  where higher rate taxpayers live), increase higher rate taxes, and yet some of these will still vote for him.

If you think you’d be better off with child benefit you could get a job paying under £50,000 a year.  Many get less than half that for a 40 hour week. Sounds like a good income to me!

[Penelope]

58 minutes ago, discobob said:

But it isn't really a Tory Government thing - it is any Government thing - the WA (labour run for +20 years) - have been trialling UBI since last year - theirs is focussed on people leaving social care environments who generally have no support networks available for them and I do sort of see it as a good thing - in that particular "narrow" exception - but it will be when it is being rolled out further and capturing more in the UBI net they will need more money to fund it - and as we all know governments don't actually have money - they get it from us - and they will want more and more from us.

As I started - it isn't Torry - it is a socialist construct that is being pushed down from supra-national organisations that don't get voted on.

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/04/covid-19-universal-basic-income-social-inequality/

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/08/why-data-needs-to-underpin-the-basic-income-debate/

They publish it themselves - totally transparent - but yet everybody calls people like me a Conspiracy Theorist and throws tin-foil comments my way. 

What do you think Furlough was???

Quite!

None as blind as those that refuse to see.

Edited June 6, 2023 by Penelope

[sportsbob]

55 minutes ago, TOPGUN749 said:

If you think you’d be better off with child benefit you could get a job paying under £50,000 a year.  Many get less than half that for a 40 hour week. Sounds like a good income to me!

I have a couple of businesses and around half my income goes on tax and NI but you never hear the people on benefits thanking me.

[Rewulf]

My 2p s worth.
UBI in this country is unworkable, there are far too many on the social security system already, and some getting more , whilst others got less , would lead to a back up system needing to be implemented to cater for the shortfalls, in effect, there would be a system within a system, open to wider abuse than the massively abused system we have now.
I dont know who put the publicity out for this very limited trial, but I guess the usual lefty agitators, spoiling for some quasi marxist dream of societal equilibrium .
Conveniently leaving out the basic fact , that capitalism powers the social state.

Take a look at this https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/countries-with-universal-basic-income and look at exactly how many countries are even attempting a trial, and the two countries that have a limited roll out, neither are countries with a record of socialism (in the standard form)

Like 15 minute cities , and digital currency, UBI is a pipe dream of those elites who have a dream of 'Complete Control' over the unwashed masses.

Its a complete distraction from whats really going on in the world today.

[Lloyd90]

4 hours ago, TOPGUN749 said:

If you think you’d be better off with child benefit you could get a job paying under £50,000 a year.  Many get less than half that for a 40 hour week. Sounds like a good income to me!

Who said anything about being “better off”?!
 

You’ve clearly read what was said and misunderstood the point. 
 

I certainly wouldn’t be better off, that is beyond obvious. 
 

What I said was, why should I pay significantly more tax yet be entitled to almost nothing? 
 

Someone earning around £25k a year will pay under £4K in tax and NI in a year. 
 

This year I’ll pay just under £22.5k in tax and NI. 
 

Yet my wife who will be on maternity isn’t entitled to the same as the wife of the man above who earns £25k. 
 

An individual I know personally who is a multi millionaire and has enough money for it to be worth while to have a top financial management firm look after all their money and investments pays less tax than the man earning the £25k. 
 

A “good income” is dependant on many factors. We are definitely not hard up that’s for sure. The fact I find the above unfair is the point. 
 

 

 

There are many many people who are highly skilled people who will however do exactly what you suggest. 
 

They will only work so many days a week to keep their earnings under the threshold so they remain entitled to certain things. 
 

They won’t push themselves or their businesses to do too well to avoid certain taxes or loss of certain benefits. 
 

I work with lots of people who have the potential to earn the same as me but will only be part time because they don’t see it as worthwhile doing all the extra hours, and then losing almost 50% of the pay. 
 

They’d rather have the time off. 

 

[TOPGUN749]

Exactly true about working minimum hours to maximum top ups.My brother works 18 hours a week for £198,pays zero tax or NI, but receives working tax credits of £70 a week for him and his wife to live on. Plus they get all the cost of living government handouts,£900 this year I believe.He got an £8,000 gas heating system installed free by Nest,and if they put £50 a month into the government savings scheme they get a 50% bonus on it! People think of claimants as poor,but as working tax credits isn’t means tested they can be wealthy as my brother is due to huge savings and inheritance.

[shaun4860]

18 hours ago, Lloyd90 said:

 
 

Then someone who pays no tax can claim their mobility car, PIP, DLA, 
 

Can I point out that PIP and DLA are non means tested.

The only new DLA claims are for children, 

Old DLA claims are slowly being moved to PIP and AA

To get a mobility car you have to have the high rate of the mobility component of PIP or DLA.

Children on the high rate can also get a mobility car for their parents to ferry them around.

Its easy to pour scorn when you don’t know the facts 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Lloyd90]

1 hour ago, shaun4860 said:

Can I point out that PIP and DLA are non means tested.

The only new DLA claims are for children, 

Old DLA claims are slowly being moved to PIP and AA

To get a mobility car you have to have the high rate of the mobility component of PIP or DLA.

Children on the high rate can also get a mobility car for their parents to ferry them around.

Its easy to pour scorn when you don’t know the facts 🤷🏻‍♂️

Indeed they are. My apologies for that error. 
 

No scorn here, I am quite proud to live in a country where we have a system that looks after those who are GENUINELY disabled or down on their luck. 
 

Feeling that elements of the system are broken or unfair, or that they punish and disincentivise people from doing better than they could is a fair criticism. 

[Mungler]

The making corporations that make billions pay more tax is a jealous moron’s quest:

1. a lot of investments and pensions benefit from large shareholding’s in those profitable companies (and so the money when distributed gets taxed and finds it’s way back into circulation)

2. These companies won’t hang around to have their backsides ripped apart

3. when making future strategic investment decisions these companies will swerve the UK.

So, where’s this universal basic income money coming from?

Interesting idea to stop all other forms of hand outs, in favour of UBI but with that there’s then tens of thousands of admin and public sector jobs gone.

Inflation with all that extra dosh sloshing about?

They’re playing with fire.

.

 

Edited June 6, 2023 by Mungler

[Vince Green]

The boats will be queuing up to unload at Dover

Edited June 7, 2023 by Vince Green