Riots and truth media

[Raja Clavata]

8 hours ago, Mice! said:

Have all those with a fancy new phone ( or even a basic phone) got jobs then? Not a chance, my phone bill is about £8 a month and I bought the phone from Argos, 3 years old and I need a new one, I could happily go buy one tomorrow with my own money I've earned,  but it's the hassle I can't be bothered with. 

Lots of people screaming poverty spend what they get on stuff they don't need, fags/vapes,  takeaways, phones and anything else they want, I very much doubt there will be many rioting and looting who went in work the day after.

As for the Giro, easy just walk to a post office, most probably want cash anyway 🤷‍♂️

Serious question, if you view buying a new phone as too much hassle how do you deal with the real chores of life or are you working so hard you have no energy for such trivial things?

Bit lost on the point you’re trying to make to be honest.

Different people have different priorities, a small number of people I’ve come across in life have designer clothes and fancy cars but homes that look like they’ve been burgled. I visited one once and was offered a cup of tea, the water for which was boiled in a saucepan on the stove 😂

By the same token, people on benefits are free to spend their money on the things they prioritise. That’s what personal liberty is all about. If as a result, for example, they don’t have enough money for food then as far as I’m concerned they can starve, if they can’t feed their kids enough then we can’t as a society let them starve so social care comes into play. I’m being extreme here to make a point, obviously.

Your comment about rioters not going to work the next day is a cause-effect thing. People who riot are typically jobless so the very fact they riot indicates they don’t have a job to go to (in the main).

I’d just add that economic inactivity is one of the ingredients that lead to a riot, which is a good thing else Clacton would constantly be ablaze😆

[Mice!]

5 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said:

Serious question, if you view buying a new phone as too much hassle how do you deal with the real chores of life or are you working so hard you have no energy for such trivial things?

Bit lost on the point you’re trying to make to be honest.

I just can't be bothered transferring information from my old phone, and looking at new ones, it likes buying tyres, I've slowly turned into a techno phobe over the years, my point is that I'd be using my money I've earned and its not an issue,  I wouldn't be using benefit money meant for important things.

9 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said:

By the same token, people on benefits are free to spend their money on the things they prioritise. That’s what personal liberty is all about. If as a result, for example, they don’t have enough money for food then as far as I’m concerned they can starve, if they can’t feed their kids enough then we can’t as a society let them starve so social care comes into play. I’m being extreme here to make a point, obviously.

Probably not as extreme as you think though, there's a good reason why people who work often choose to have two or three kids, and those working the system and living on handouts have more, if you can't feed your kids but your spending money on 'stuff' it should be a criminal offence.

15 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said:

Your comment about rioters not going to work the next day is a cause-effect thing. People who riot are typically jobless so the very fact they riot indicates they don’t have a job to go to (in the main).

Think how good facial recognition is these days, I realise a lot would be wearing masks, but anyone involved in civil unrest or criminal actions should have any benefits removed, I'm sure that would make a few think twice.

[Raja Clavata]

7 minutes ago, Mice! said:

Probably not as extreme as you think though, there's a good reason why people who work often choose to have two or three kids, and those working the system and living on handouts have more, if you can't feed your kids but your spending money on 'stuff' it should be a criminal offence.

Think how good facial recognition is these days, I realise a lot would be wearing masks, but anyone involved in civil unrest or criminal actions should have any benefits removed, I'm sure that would make a few think twice.

I understand your reasoning on the first point but for me that would infringe on what I’d consider reasonable and necessary individual liberties. The cap on a limit to the number of dependents you can claim benefits for is however a sound policy in my book. 

On the second, again like the logic but then complete removal of benefits would further impoverish and that’s likely to lead someone to contribute to civil unrest further. So perhaps a significant reduction in benefits for a period would be an acceptable compromise.

PS, masks are likely blown off if you water cannon them 😉

[Mice!]

4 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said:

, masks are likely blown off if you water cannon them 😉

If only they could or would, don't want to hurt or upset the little darlings.

[old man]

19 hours ago, Gordon R said:

Children are taken into care for their own safety, cue a riot. I find it hard to understand the thinking behind turning over a Police car, burning a bus, followed by a full scale riot, as if this will somehow bring the children back.

If the children are returned, just how will Social Services monitor their well being? It won't happen. The view is that if Social Services revised their decision, the problem would go away. Bend to mob rule and forget the kids welfare. 

I can find little information as to just how Social Services became involved. Harking back to Mungler's Tom Daley scenario on another thread, someone alerted them to a child at serious risk. 

A bit of wacky baccy and a few pints lubricate the neuron no end?

[Rewulf]

16 hours ago, oowee said:

How do you make the job more attractive? That would be funding then. No one wants the job because of the stress, the hours, the training, and the lack of reward. ?

How do you make a sewage workers job more 'attractive' 

Social workers pay is good, the work can be stressful,  so is police work , firefighters and nurses, the salaries are all very similar.

[johnphilip]

2 hours ago, oowee said:

From the tippling philosopher, interviews at the Republican party Conference.

A brilliant interview with Farage by Emily Maitland starts at 8.45. Follows on with some Maga MTG makes you realise our politics is not as bad as you think. 

 

She sure made herself look stupid, 

[oowee]

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

How do you make a sewage workers job more 'attractive' 

Social workers pay is good, the work can be stressful,  so is police work , firefighters and nurses, the salaries are all very similar.

? so what would you do? 

[Raja Clavata]

4 hours ago, Rewulf said:

How do you make a sewage workers job more 'attractive' 

Social workers pay is good, the work can be stressful, so is police work, firefighters and nurses, the salaries are all very similar.

Good in comparison to what? One of my SiL’s a PhD educated detective working in child protection (helps convict paedos). She earns about a third of that of both my partner and her sibling solicitor and about a sixth of the other one in finance. Which one do you reckon work’s unpredictable shifts and unsocialable hours? Like you’ve indicated stressful compared to typical private sector jobs.

[Westward]

2 hours ago, oowee said:

? so what would you do? 

I'm 78 and after working since I was 16 I can honestly say that paying people more money has never reduced stress or anxiety at work and never made anyone happier in their job. Further to that, increasing someone's pay in order to stop them leaving only ever seems to delay things as they leave anyway and with a higher market value. 

[Westward]

1 hour ago, Raja Clavata said:

Good in comparison to what? One of my SiL’s a PhD educated detective working in child protection (helps convict paedos). She earns about a third of that of both my partner and her sibling solicitor and about a sixth of the other one in finance. Which one do you reckon work’s unpredictable shifts and unsocialable hours? Like you’ve indicated stressful compared to typical private sector jobs.

I wouldn't dispute that there are public sector staff with stressful jobs and unsociable hours but the overwhelming majority of public servants have nice cosy jobs with plenty of perks, very few of which are available to private sector staff.

Interestingly one of my sons is a mid level civil servant, the money's not great but the hours are good and like most,  he works flexi time which lets him have a side hustle. Another son works for a global bank. He's paid a lot more but puts in twice the hours, has to be willing to fly to America at short notice and in time for for the Monday 9 am meetings, fly back on the Tuesday red eye to be in the office in The City in time for a days work, then get home typically after 7pm and after the children have gone to bed. (And no, he doesn't want to be in a union)

[.357shooter]

if you import 3rd world scum they bring all of their **** with them.funny how the media do not report on the 10,000,s marching in the middle of london and manchester.it is as if it does not happen when a certain now majority in these places dicide to kick off yet again and are treated very differently than indiginous people.now i am considered far right for knowing that my way of life is being destroyed.very sad times in the soon to not be the united kingdom.

[Rewulf]

5 hours ago, oowee said:

? so what would you do? 

You'll laugh.

National service (non military)

Apprenticeships/YTS

Work experience in civil service jobs.

Lose this ethic of useless degrees getting fast track promotions.

There are plenty of people out there who would make great social workers, people who genuinely want to help their communities.

Give people vocation, not just a wage.

3 hours ago, Raja Clavata said:

Good in comparison to what?

Other civil service jobs.

[oowee]

3 hours ago, Westward said:

I'm 78 and after working since I was 16 I can honestly say that paying people more money has never reduced stress or anxiety at work and never made anyone happier in their job. Further to that, increasing someone's pay in order to stop them leaving only ever seems to delay things as they leave anyway and with a higher market value. 

You have no proposals to deal with the shortage of staff.

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

You'll laugh.

National service (non military)

Apprenticeships/YTS

Work experience in civil service jobs.

Lose this ethic of useless degrees getting fast track promotions.

There are plenty of people out there who would make great social workers, people who genuinely want to help their communities.

Give people vocation, not just a wage.

Other civil service jobs.

What will that do to tackle the shortage of people in the profession? You don't have to have a degree to work in the sector now.  We can't rely on charity and good will in the civil service anymore than we can in the private sector. 

If they are out there why are they not coming forward? 

 

3 hours ago, Westward said:

I wouldn't dispute that there are public sector staff with stressful jobs and unsociable hours but the overwhelming majority of public servants have nice cosy jobs with plenty of perks, very few of which are available to private sector staff.

Interestingly one of my sons is a mid level civil servant, the money's not great but the hours are good and like most,  he works flexi time which lets him have a side hustle. Another son works for a global bank. He's paid a lot more but puts in twice the hours, has to be willing to fly to America at short notice and in time for for the Monday 9 am meetings, fly back on the Tuesday red eye to be in the office in The City in time for a days work, then get home typically after 7pm and after the children have gone to bed. (And no, he doesn't want to be in a union)

Really 🤣

So you base your judgement on a survey of ...one?

My boss Clive Dutton died before retirement as he worked so hard he had no time to deal with his illness. After that Bob Kerslake (now dead) an unbelievable work load and a brain the size of a planet. There are slackers in all sectors and all industries but senior civil servants in my experience work above and beyond it becomes a way of life not a job.

I know some in my office that stayed in the hotel next to the office as they had no time to travel home. 

[Rewulf]

24 minutes ago, oowee said:

What will that do to tackle the shortage of people in the profession? You don't have to have a degree to work in the sector now. 

That's not strictly true.

One pathway is through a university course and a degree in social work. However, you don't need to go to university to become a social worker. An alternative route is through an apprenticeship, where you can start working and earn while you qualify as a social worker.21 Mar 2023

We have 3 million unemployed, I'm sure at least a few of them would like a job in social work, or nursing, or any of the multitude of jobs that we seem to think we have to import people for, why don't we try and find them ?

700,000 new people a year , who need nurses, doctors, dentists, and social workers...

[oowee]

9 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

That's not strictly true.

One pathway is through a university course and a degree in social work. However, you don't need to go to university to become a social worker. An alternative route is through an apprenticeship, where you can start working and earn while you qualify as a social worker.21 Mar 2023

We have 3 million unemployed, I'm sure at least a few of them would like a job in social work, or nursing, or any of the multitude of jobs that we seem to think we have to import people for, why don't we try and find them ?

700,000 new people a year , who need nurses, doctors, dentists, and social workers...

Cant read the blacked out bit but

An alternative route is through an apprenticeship, where you can start working and earn while you qualify as a social worker. You need four or five GCSEs at grades 9 to 4 (A* to C) and A levels, or equivalent, to do a Social Worker Level 6 Degree Apprenticeship. It takes around three years to complete.

[100milesaway]

39 minutes ago, oowee said:

You have no proposals to deal with the shortage of staff.

What will that do to tackle the shortage of people in the profession? You don't have to have a degree to work in the sector now.  We can't rely on charity and good will in the civil service anymore than we can in the private sector. 

If they are out there why are they not coming forward? 

 

Really 🤣

So you base your judgement on a survey of ...one?

My boss Clive Dutton died before retirement as he worked so hard he had no time to deal with his illness. After that Bob Kerslake (now dead) an unbelievable work load and a brain the size of a planet. There are slackers in all sectors and all industries but senior civil servants in my experience work above and beyond it becomes a way of life not a job.

I know some in my office that stayed in the hotel next to the office as they had no time to travel home. 

They are not coming forward because they are all on massive pensions. My  answer would be to ban working from home and make everyone self employed.

From Auntie.

4 minutes ago, oowee said:

Cant read the blacked out bit but

An alternative route is through an apprenticeship, where you can start working and earn while you qualify as a social worker. You need four or five GCSEs at grades 9 to 4 (A* to C) and A levels, or equivalent, to do a Social Worker Level 6 Degree Apprenticeship. It takes around three years to complete.

Pity commonsence  isn't  a requirement. 

From Auntie 

[Rewulf]

15 minutes ago, oowee said:

You need four or five GCSEs at grades 9 to 4 (A* to C) and A levels, or equivalent, to do a Social Worker Level 6 Degree Apprenticeship. It takes around three years to complete

So you need everything you would to go to uni and get a degree. Then spend 3 years training,  in which you would likely get that degree in social work.

As I said , it's not 'strictly' true.

[oowee]

20 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

So you need everything you would to go to uni and get a degree. Then spend 3 years training,  in which you would likely get that degree in social work.

As I said , it's not 'strictly' true.

You dont need a degree.

Either way we don't want untrained people doing the work. It's a skilled job. 

36 minutes ago, 100milesaway said:

They are not coming forward because they are all on massive pensions. My  answer would be to ban working from home and make everyone self employed.

From Auntie.

Pity commonsence  isn't  a requirement. 

From Auntie 

🤣 What nonsense.

If they are already on a pension they have likely finished work. Even the massive (🤣) pension they pay for, which will be DC rather than DB is not enough to attract the workers. Maybe common sense is keeping people away. They see the hours, the lack of pay, the personal risk and they go for something easier and more rewarding in the private sector. 

[100milesaway]

1 hour ago, oowee said:

You dont need a degree.

Either way we don't want untrained people doing the work. It's a skilled job. 

🤣 What nonsense.

If they are already on a pension they have likely finished work. Even the massive (🤣) pension they pay for, which will be DC rather than DB is not enough to attract the workers. Maybe common sense is keeping people away. They see the hours, the lack of pay, the personal risk and they go for something easier and more rewarding in the private sector. 

As I  understand it the government is still trying to recruit  from the early retirees  to save them having to retrain the next batch of woke workers.

From Auntie.

[Dave-G]

3 hours ago, oowee said:

....

Me thinks that should be:

What will that do to tackle the shortage of people not obstructively working to rule in the profession? You don't have to have a degree to work in the sector now.  We can't rely on charity and good will in the civil service anymore than we can in the private sector. 

If they are out there why are they not coming forward?

....

Maybe that might change now the lefties aren't obstructing the Tories.

 

[Gordon R]

Quote

 

 senior civil servants in my experience work above and beyond it becomes a way of life not a job.

I know some in my office that stayed in the hotel next to the office as they had no time to travel home. 

 

Made me smile. It's a shame that these fantastic civil servants took it upon themselves to enter politics without going via the ballot box. They have brought disgrace upon the Civil Service.

As for above and beyond - based in Whitehall, getting London Weighting, residing in Cornwall? Noses in the trough.

 

[100milesaway]

15 hours ago, Rewulf said:

You'll laugh.

National service (non military)

Apprenticeships/YTS

Work experience in civil service jobs.

Lose this ethic of useless degrees getting fast track promotions.

There are plenty of people out there who would make great social workers, people who genuinely want to help their communities.

Give people vocation, not just a wage.

Other civil service jobs.

Good post Rewulf, I think I will ask Teal to make another website for oowee and Raja Climata called Ostrich Watch.

From Auntie.

[johnphilip]

18 minutes ago, 100milesaway said:

Good post Rewulf, I think I will ask Teal to make another website for oowee and Raja Climata called Ostrich Watch.

From Auntie.

A true Yorkshire lass  for a county Durham lad 😀😀

[Rewulf]

1 hour ago, 100milesaway said:

Good post Rewulf, I think I will ask Teal to make another website for oowee and Raja Climata called Ostrich Watch.

From Auntie.