dustyfox Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 is that regardless of breed dusty mate ?im sure that is what you mean.... i have an apprentice at work... he's a bad case, come from social services been in care all his life.... he's a typical dead head kid of today, been in plenty of trouble all his life... his social worker has been round to his flat(witch they pay for incidentally) and insisted he gets rid of his 8 week old staff pup as he has an 18 minth old son who visits.... totally the right move by social services.... not because the 8 week old pup is a threat, but beacause the owner, the lad will more than likely bring it up poorly..... theese are the cases wich need addressing... Yes any dog, cause you get rid of staffs they move onto another tough breed like Akita's and so on Staffordshire Bull terriers is just like marmite you either love em or hate em. df Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatcatsplat Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 Yes any dog, cause you get rid of staffs they move onto another tough breed like Akita's and so on Staffordshire Bull terriers is just like marmite you either love em or hate em. df They're rubbish on toast though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Fudd Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 They're rubbish on toast though! nice if theyre barbecued with a bit of honey on the cracling.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy. Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 You've only got to do a google news search with the term Staffordhire Bull Terrier to see that this simply is not the case! Spot on. They should be banned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdubya Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 Its a sad fact that accidents happen, blaming it on dog breeds as the media frequently do is a nonsense. Personally I don't think legislation will make a difference. leaving a kid alone with acouple of dogs aint an accident? KW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myzeneye Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 (edited) i hardley think she done it on purpose with the intention of having her grandchild mauled to death......... probably the dogs are fine in her company, she mistakenly,foolishly presumed they'd be fine around her grandchild, perhaps the dogs had never given her any reason to think otherwise and she, foolishly, trusted them to be left alone... yes, with hynd sight she should have known better.... but there you go.... Edited February 8, 2009 by myzeneye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huntinlass Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 No matter what breed of dog, a child of any age should not be left alone. Bad judgement of the parent has cost a childs life. Something the parents and family are going to have to live with for the rest of their lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodcock11 Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 This has caused a huge debate. Honestly held opinions by others - even if you dont agree with them - should not be a cause for insults or name-calling. Pigeon Watch is not the House of Commons! No dog - whatever the breed - is perfect and the fact is that we humans just do not know what causes a dog or dogs to react as they do. Certainly, when you have more than one dog, "the Pack instinct" can kick in. I too know of a black labrador who attacked a small child. I was there at the time and suspect there was a degree of provocation towards the dog but we dont know for sure. In this instance fortunately there was no lasting damage, the child was OK and the lab went to a new home and there were no problems after this attack - or before for that matter, so it was very much a one off incident. We have a springer and a black lab here - two wonderful and adorable dogs who we love to bits, but we would never leave them alone with children for even a second. What has happened is very very sad but like with everything else, cars, motorbikes guns etc, you just cannot be too careful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeylove Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 public enemy no.1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimdfish Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 i have a gorgeous old bitch staff whom has never done any other living creature any harm. I find the stereotyping offensive./ how many of you would like airguns licensed or banned. they count for many deaths each year, usually at the hands of chavvy scum so if we remove airguns, or hey, any guns at all then we will remove the threat . Hoozah!! i bet people will not be as quick to jump on this reactionary bandwagon. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherman Mike Posted February 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 As I started this topic I would like to have the final word. The death of that poor child is a utter tradegy which should not have occured. I appreciate that any dog is capable of such an act whether it be a poodle or a great dane, but invariably when one hears about the all too frequent child deaths caused by dogs its predominantly the same 4 breeds responsible in 95% of the cases and we all know in our hearts that this is an undisputable fact. My original thread suggested that dogs and young children just dont mix and I stand by that what ever the breed. And I dont accept some owners beliefs that their dog is 100% trustworthy with children. At the end of the day a dog is the decendant of a wolf what ever colour coat it has and when two or more dogs of any breed congregate the genetical switch is thrown and the dog quickly becomes a pack animal again. The death of this and all young children by mauling is entirely preventable and in my opinion anybody who leaves any dog alone with a child who is not either old enough or strong enough to control it is guilty of an offence against humanity and should be punished. Patently many dog owners have a higher regard for their dogs than they do for humans and that is the saddest thing. Thanks for your input everybody to a very interesting debate, again apologies if I have offended any individual and for my own part my opinion of the more "sinister" breeds has not changed. Just by pure coincidence I was in the field this afternoon with my springer who I always keep muzzled and there was a very responsible chap with a Rott which played with the other dogs very well for 1/2 hour until it and a chocolate lab had a very minor disagreement. The owner of the Rott was a local businessman fit and healthy, probably about 40, However he did not have the physical strength to restrain his dog which he said weighed nearly 9 stone. I rest my case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/ind...&hl=monster mart, come on mate... you posted a thread about your brothers dog "monster" i believe he was called...not a staff either... its dogs and people like this who need taking to task..our bennys never shown ANY sign of aggression to anyone... ever....... aprt from a railway worker who came trotting down the line which runs parralell to our house late one nightand took him by suprise as he was obviously, not a train and shouldnt have been there... benny gave a bark and stuck his chest out, as im sure any dog would do... with a "hey!,behave!" he reverted inediatly back to his state of passiveness.... daft as a brush.. http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm189/m...38f008407_b.jpg gentle, loyal and obedient.... ( these days, puppy phase of chewing and destruction has gone, thank god !!) I understand what you are saying Matty, as you have never seen this type of behaviour in your dog, but why is it that is MOSTLY seems to be the fighting dog types that we hear reported about? Im not saying everybodys dog is a killer, but if you asked any expert, im sure they would show you the figures that say your dog is more likley to snap than the collie up the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperfection Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 why is it that is MOSTLY seems to be the fighting dog types that we hear reported about? your dog is more likley to snap than the collie up the road. Because the media circus know full well that a headline like 'Staffie mauls child!' will sell a million copys while perhaps 'Retriever attacks baby' will get overlooked.The tabloids will no doubt be whipping everyone into a frenzy again and have polls for people to vote to have all Staffies,Rotties,Dobies,GSD's etc muzzled/banned/exiled/vapourised... Besides,if Staffs were banned-plebs would only turn their attention to Rotties.Then when they're banned-turn their attention to GSD's etc etc.Where would it end? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootnfish Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 It probley would end with us all having little handbag rats(sorry dogs) to go shooting with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Fudd Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 The owner of the Rott was a local businessman fit and healthy, probably about 40, However he did not have the physical strength to restrain his dog which he said weighed nearly 9 stone. I rest my case. im 25, not very fit or healthy and can easily restrain my dog which is 9 stone. its simple. use a choke chain. sorry, not a good point mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myzeneye Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 I understand what you are saying Matty, as you have never seen this type of behaviour in your dog, but why is it that is MOSTLY seems to be the fighting dog types that we hear reported about?Im not saying everybodys dog is a killer, but if you asked any expert, im sure they would show you the figures that say your dog is more likley to snap than the collie up the road. is that a fact or your estimation mate.... i dont have the facts either, but im sure the truth would be that the collie would be the more probable dogn to "snap", probably quite frequently to from my experience with that particular breed... staffs, are not quick to pick a fdight mate.... the trouble is, if they do, the results are much more severe.... thats probably the whole point here i guess.... the breed is not a bad natured one as youd be led to believe.... but when you get the "micheal ryan" of dogs, you get a tradegdy.... what do we do ? ban everything which presents a threat to anyone/things saftey ? better get busy pal, we've alot of work cut out.... better start with "monster"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J@mes Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 People need to look past the breed and look at the people who chose to own this breed. The way they treat it, the way they train it. Then you will see why there are so many problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth Stalker Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 I'm currently doing a lot of work in some of the nastiest parts of Edmonton North London & I can honestly say I've never seen so many staffs about the place, for the scum bags, hoodies, drug dealers these are definatly the "in dog" to have. I've no doubt in my mind that these dogs are not treated as a loving family pet, but as an aggressive accessorie to their anti social behaviour. For my part I don't blame the animal its the owners that need to be socialized & domesticated SS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 [/b] is that a fact or your estimation mate.... i dont have the facts either, but im sure the truth would be that the collie would be the more probable dogn to "snap", probably quite frequently to from my experience with that particular breed... staffs, are not quick to pick a fdight mate.... the trouble is, if they do, the results are much more severe.... thats probably the whole point here i guess.... the breed is not a bad natured one as youd be led to believe.... but when you get the "micheal ryan" of dogs, you get a tradegdy.... what do we do ? ban everything which presents a threat to anyone/things saftey ? better get busy pal, we've alot of work cut out.... better start with "monster"... trust me Matt, my kids wont be going anywhere near that thing. ive never seen a dog so angry for no reason, i didnt even make eye contact with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Elvis Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 no its well put , and like you say some of the comments are no better than what we would recieve from the shooting antis in this post No offense to who-ever wrote the above comment, but does the only thing we all have in common, ie guns mean that we HAVE to all have the same opinion??? I really dont like staffs, i dont want them banned for everyone....thats nonsense but if someone is wearing a shell suit they shouldnt be allowed to buy a staff!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherman Mike Posted February 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 im 25, not very fit or healthy and can easily restrain my dog which is 9 stone. its simple. use a choke chain. sorry, not a good point mate Yeah Right… I’ve firsthand experience of a Male Rott which went berserk and clamped onto a Greyhound with two 15 stone men in toe on the end of a choke chain ( I was one of them ) We were pulled along like a couple of rag dolls. We hit the dog over the head with a tree branch and it still wouldn’t release. After it killed the hound it turned on the handler and we ran to the car. I would be prepared to bet my house that you couldn’t restrain that beast with a choke chain. Sorry I think that is a good point… mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Elvis Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 ABSOLUTELY ANY DOG CAN SAVAGE YOU!!! EVEN A CHIHUAHUA But theres degrees of damage, and frequency and the staff qualifies for both!!! i keep very large snakes....BUT i am prepared for them to attack, there is an axe in my reptile room and i wouldnt hesitate to use it............how many of you staff owners would be prepared to kill your dog to prevent injury to a third party? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roadkill Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 ABSOLUTELY ANY DOG CAN SAVAGE YOU!!! EVEN A CHIHUAHUA But theres degrees of damage, and frequency and the staff qualifies for both!!! i keep very large snakes....BUT i am prepared for them to attack, there is an axe in my reptile room and i wouldnt hesitate to use it............how many of you staff owners would be prepared to kill your dog to prevent injury to a third party? i wouldnt think twice , if mine ever did attack anyone or show any aggression then it would be the end for it as i wouldnt take the risk roadkill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 the point has nearly been made here, the difference between most dogs and the hardier so called fighting breeds is that most dogs will bite but few will kill people. In this case I wouldn't be surprised if the Jack Russel started it but i would be surprised if the JR killed the child. A lots been said about how the dogs brought up but remember instinct when it kicks in dogs can ignore any training, you don't teach a JR to kill rats it just does it. Fascinating that they know what to do but they do, similarly I had an 8 week old JR pup who I taught to swim. She was paddling before she went into the water for the first time which amazed me. On the same note when that switch gets flicked in a staffie etc then someone will get hurt. I'm not sure i'd like them banned but more sense used and control of the types of owner would be a good start. My GWP is as good as I can imagine with my nephews, she sits patiently while they pull her about bearing in mind they are 12 months and 6 months and loves the attention. But would never be left with them despite the fact she is as soft as could be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdubya Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 Yeah Right… I’ve firsthand experience of a Male Rott which went berserk and clamped onto a Greyhound with two 15 stone men in toe on the end of a choke chain ( I was one of them ) We were pulled along like a couple of rag dolls.We hit the dog over the head with a tree branch and it still wouldn’t release. After it killed the hound it turned on the handler and we ran to the car. I would be prepared to bet my house that you couldn’t restrain that beast with a choke chain. Sorry I think that is a good point… mate like i said in my post re my mate ernie , 6ft 4" 18 clem (at least) ex bouncer hard as they come , when rocky his dog turned on him, it had nearly ripped his arm off before he got the better of it, fortunately he worked from home repairing bangers and selling them on to unsuspecting oops willing buyers, he manged to get a pry bar and shove it through the dogs collar and twisted it till the dog was eventually strangled, bet a choke chain would have worked better though eh! nah think not, leaving a baby with a staffie or rottie is the same as letting a toddler play with alive hand grenade with a loose pin. cheers KW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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