22lr HV versus 22lr Subsonics

[TaxiDriver]

Does anyone know how much different the point of impact would be at any given distance?

Example if trying to zero with subs at 60yrds,

Would HV rounds(eg CCI Stingers) shoot higher ?

Could I use HV rounds to push the point of impact further out

 

I'm thinking(hoping) maybe I can use subs, zero'd at a cirtain distance, and then gain a bit further reach by using HV rounds to reach those rabbits I can't get so close to without having to re-zero between the two.

 

Sorry If this is rudimentary, but I really haven't used the 22lr anywhere near as much as I'd hoped since getting it.

Edited November 4, 2011 by TaxiDriver

[steve_b_wales]

I have used both sub sonic and hyper velocity. I found that the HV were hitting 1" high at 60 yards, compared to the sub's, but at a shorter range, were exactly the same.

I have used HV for corvid shooting up to 100 yards, but found them to be not so accurate as the subs.

[stubby]

my shooting partner thought the same thing, weather it works for others or not I dont know, but after he fired a stinger I told him no more with me, the racket they make is enough to scare rabbits 3 fields away,away

[minghis]

If I recall correctly, I once tried this and found that if I zeroed for Winchester Subs at 75 yards then Winchester Lazers HV's were close to that zero at just over 100 yards.

 

After thinking about it having written it, it doesn't seem right but I'm sure that's what I found. If it wasn't 100 yards it may have been 125 yards.

 

Probably totally confused you. I've confused myself now!

[willy1]

My .22lr is zero'ed at 65yards with subs,and will hit the bullseye at 100yards with HV,(CCi Mini-Mags)

 

Alan

[TaxiDriver]

my shooting partner thought the same thing, weather it works for others or not I dont know, but after he fired a stinger I told him no more with me, the racket they make is enough to scare rabbits 3 fields away,away

I have to agree, it was the noise from some cci stingers I tried was what caused the disagreement with the neighbour of my permission, who then went and complained to my landowner about noise setting the dogs off barking, resulting in me being asked "Not to shoot where the rabbits are"

 

I'm still unsure from the responses so far, will HV rounds push my zero out abit further than Subs ?

Say for example, zero with subs at 60yrds and be on bullseye, and by using hv rounds be on bullseye at say 80yrds or a bit further ?

 

I've thought about changing the 22lr for 17hmr but having tried cci stingers (22lr HV) and found how noisy they are, I wonder if a 17hmr would be as noisy or more so ?

Edited November 4, 2011 by TaxiDriver

[Gimlet]

I have to agree, that was the noise from some cci stingers I tried was what caused the disagreement with the neighbour of my permission, who then went and complained to my landowner about noise setting the dogs off barking, resulting in me being asked "Not to shoot where the rabbits are"

 

Im still unsure from the responses so far HV rounds will push my zero out abit further than Subs ?

Say for example, zero with subs at 60yrds and beon bullseye, and by using hv rounds be on bullseye at say 80yrds ?

 

I've thought about changing the 22lr for 17hmr but having tried cci stingers and found how noisy they are, I wonder if a 17hmr would be as noisy or more so ?

 

 

I think .22 HVs are noisier than .17HMR. The HMR produce more muzzle blast because they burn more powder, but that can be moderated. The problem is the sonic crack. .22 rounds have greater mass than .17s and they create a larger pressure wave in front of them. When this cracks the noise is louder and there's nothing you can do about it. HVs don't sound much different at short range: 50/60 yards. But at 100 yds its very noticable.

[Dekers]

My .22lr is a dedicated SUB tool these days.

 

But back when, the Magtech 40g HP Subs zeroed at 60 yards, gave me almost exactly a 100 yard zero with CCI Velocitors (if you could call it that, on a good day the group was about 2 inches with the CCI)!

 

The only way you will find out what yours does it to try it!

 

[Underdog]

You gotta try it really all rifles are different.

The stingers seem to shoot quite a bit higher than a standard HV, a rifle that shoots them is a fair tool!

 

My 9422 shoots most stuff to the same point give or take so a gain in zero distance is negliable. (Not tried stinger in it!)

 

We just use the HV stuff when we have to go out in a gale at night on the rabbits just to help with the windage a little, the lamp still catches them being blown way off! In sayin' that I ain't got any in!

 

Have fun.

 

U.

[drut]

My .22lr is a dedicated SUB tool these days.

 

But back when, the Magtech 40g HP Subs zeroed at 60 yards, gave me almost exactly a 100 yard zero with CCI Velocitors (if you could call it that, on a good day the group was about 2 inches with the CCI)!

 

 

As above I am zeroed @60yds with Win subs,dead on the money @100yds with Velocitors(about 2" high @50yds.I am fortunate that strangely my CZ is as accurate with Velocitors as subs although I rarely use them because of noise,tried Stingers & RWS high velocity but groups were appalling.

[Gimlet]

The .22 lr and subsonic rounds are a marriage made in heaven really. .22 subs are inherently stable. There was an article a couple of months aga in NRA magazine about long range target shooting with .22 subs. They were shooting at 600 yds if memory serves and the groups were amazing.

Its well worth using a range finder and getting to know the trajectory of .22 subs. Maybe the HMR has made us all a bit lazy.

[scotland rifles]

used 22 lr subs for years out to 100 no bother,

 

i have used HV 22lr (IN A CATAPULT) AS IT WAS BETTER AND MORE ACCURATE THAN THE RIFLE WAS WITH THEM, inherently inaccurate and ric O sha more than subs

 

bob.

[vampire]

Mate,my cz .22lr is zeroed at 60 yrds and has no probs on rabbits out to 80 yrds using eley subs.I know you are having problems getting near enough to them rabbits,but if you get to within range and wait for a few minutes they will all come out a again.

If you get a .17hmr the crack will send em scurrying away from every field around.

[normgun]

try the cci segmented hollow points they are pretty good, i am zeroed at 80 and have no probs fron 50 to 80 on rabbits head shots

[ollie]

My LR is set @ 60 yards with Eley Subs and I carry another mag around with Winchester Super Speed HV; the HV's are pretty much the same POI @ 90 yards.

[Fishermanpaddy]

My LR is set @ 60 yards with Eley Subs and I carry another mag around with Winchester Super Speed HV; the HV's are pretty much the same POI @ 90 yards.

 

Thats what I have started doing recently, just carry the gun with an open chamber and put the appropriate mag in for the target.

[bruno22rf]

With regards to noise-the .17 hummer we use with a moderator is as loud as the .22 without-one shot clears the fields for quite a while and makes the .22 much more useful on most occasions.As regards the sub/hv matter -I seem to recall that the impact point of the 2 is about the same shortly after 100 yards as the hv loses speed more rapidly than the sub.The sub is more than capable of killing bunnies at 200 yards and its the accuracy that matters the most-therefore shooting at a more realistic 100 yards I would invest in a milldot scope and learn the hold over required to achieve vertical zero beyond your normal zero point.In my experience subs are far more accurate than hv rounds(with the exception of RWS hv rounds)and coupled with the ability to be silent makes them virtually perfect for the .22 rifle-almost a marriage made in heaven (unlike most others).

[Chr15j]

Just bought a 5 shot mag off another pw member for this very purpose. Ie Im now waiting for my 5 shot to put hv rounds in.

[Glenshooter]

It's been some years now since I did the testing but with a 50yd zero, the subs dropped about 9" at 100 and the HV 5 or 6 inches. I really only use subs now as if I'm going noisy, I take the 223.

 

There have been some comments about accuracy being reduced as the bullet drops through the sound barrier but I haven't found HV to be inaccurate in my rifle. I have achieved 1" groups at 100yds.

 

This is an interesting subject.

 

Bryan Litz is engaged in a thread about this subject here: (which you have to log onto in order to read)

 

http://www.usrifleteams.com/lrforum/...ic=13415&st=75

 

It seems that there are many different issues relating to the stability of a bullet as it passes through the transonic zone and merely by passing through the transonic zone a bullet does not necessarily become either unstable or inaccurate.

[njc110381]

I've found that a 50 yard zero with Winchester subs gives me a second zero at approximately 90 yards with the hyper velocity rounds I have - I think they're Remington but don't quote me on it.

 

I've just started carrying a 5 round mag with HV's in in case I see a fox - not that the subs do a bad job of you place the shot well but anything extra you can gain is worth doing on larger quarry.

[TaxiDriver]

Looking at CCI's website seems that the Stingers are top of the range velocity wise and subs at the bottom (Ok so there's shotshells lower)

but in between Subs and the Stingers theres other 22lr hollow points, So, I'm thinking I might try some of them.

 

At what velocity does a bullet goes 'sonic' if thats the right word ?

[Vince Green]

Stingers are a bit overblown for most rifles and don't give rabbit head shot accuracy at the further ranges. So you are just giving yourself a different problem to overcome. But it won't break the bank to buy a couple of boxes and have a play then you can decide for yourself. who knows? maybe your rifle will love them.

[TaxiDriver]

Vince,

thats the problem I experienced, the CCI stingers I have tried are SO LOUD,

Which led to the neighbour of my permission complaining to the landowner, who in turn asked me not to shoot the rabbits down there (where the rabbit problem is the worst)

 

So, I was looking for something with a little more legs than the Winnie Subs but the Stingers are just too noisy

[Fishermanpaddy]

Looking at CCI's website seems that the Stingers are top of the range velocity wise and subs at the bottom (Ok so there's shotshells lower)

but in between Subs and the Stingers theres other 22lr hollow points, So, I'm thinking I might try some of them.

 

At what velocity does a bullet goes 'sonic' if thats the right word ?

 

 

I believe anything over 1100fps Is getting on for supersonic. It depends on the temperature too, If the air temp is low then the fps needed to breach the sound barrier is lower than if the air temp is higher.

[Gimlet]

Vince,

thats the problem I experienced, the CCI stingers I have tried are SO LOUD,

Which led to the neighbour of my permission complaining to the landowner, who in turn asked me not to shoot the rabbits down there (where the rabbit problem is the worst)

 

So, I was looking for something with a little more legs than the Winnie Subs but the Stingers are just too noisy

 

How far are these rabbits? Subs are good for 100 yds comfortably, though you'll need to holdover a few inches. Maybe you just need to get more familiar with .22 sub trajectory or get closer with a pre-planned hide position, or both.

Unfortunately you're not going to get anything to shoot flatter than subs without making a racket.

Edited November 8, 2011 by Gimlet