Glenshooter Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 MrM, UKIP will do very well to get 3 seats, 2 is possible and 1 most likely. There is no hope at all of any sort of formal coalition deal with UKIP. That's what the polls seem to be suggesting. And has been said frequently, the big risk is that the Conservative vote is split in marginals and labour get in. They will lose their Scottish seats, but if UKIP split the 'non labour vote in marginals or even relatively safe conservative seats, then we'll have Ed as PM. The only way to get a referendum on Europe, is to vote conservative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 UKIP will get a decent percentage share of the vote or around 13% or 14%, maybe even enough to make them 3rd in that respect, but polls show them being 8th largest party in the house. By comparison the SNP will have something like a 4% share of the vote so well down the list in terms of percentage share, but will be the 3rd largest party in the house in terms of seats. I think that if the Conservatives had made a manifesto pledge to look at the voting system in this country and turn it into something more representative that would have been a winning policy, but that road is fraught with pitfalls. It is what needs to happen though along with regional devolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdubya Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 As long as we dont get the cons again I couldn't give a flying fig as to the effect of my UKIP vote, and if it annoys the indignant benefit bashing tax avoidance lovers on here all the better. KW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 kdubya - don't dress it up - tell them straight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 That's what the polls seem to be suggesting. And has been said frequently, the big risk is that the Conservative vote is split in marginals and labour get in. They will lose their Scottish seats, but if UKIP split the 'non labour vote in marginals or even relatively safe conservative seats, then we'll have Ed as PM. The only way to get a referendum on Europe, is to vote conservative. I find all this hilarious, really. Some folk just don't get it do they? To vote for a party I don't want to keep out a party I want even less isn't an option; it really isn't. If I vote for the tories to keep out labour it wont register as a protest vote at all, it will be seen for what it is, a vote for the tories. I can't write on my voting slip 'I'm really keen on UKIP but am voting Cons as I don't believe UKIP will get in and I see the tories as the better of two evils between them and labour'. The only way I can register my dissatisfaction with the tories is to vote for another party. Can no one see that? Also, do those who claim Cameron will give us a referendum on Europe really believe that? Like I said; hilarious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 The only way to get a referendum on Europe, is to vote conservative. Ha ha ha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Scully - on the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVB Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 I find all this hilarious, really. Some folk just don't get it do they? To vote for a party I don't want to keep out a party I want even less isn't an option; it really isn't. If I vote for the tories to keep out labour it wont register as a protest vote at all, it will be seen for what it is, a vote for the tories. I can't write on my voting slip 'I'm really keen on UKIP but am voting Cons as I don't believe UKIP will get in and I see the tories as the better of two evils between them and labour'. The only way I can register my dissatisfaction with the tories is to vote for another party. Can no one see that? Also, do those who claim Cameron will give us a referendum on Europe really believe that? Like I said; hilarious. Whether the Consevatives can give you a referendum will depend on who they are in bed with (assuming a coalition). If UKIP they will, if LIB Dems, unlikely as they wouldn't win a commons vote. That's the way parliament works. It's a series of compromises. And If Labour get in do you really think they will care whether UKIP get 10%, 15% or even 50% of the vote? Of course not. I am similar to KW. As long as Labour don't get in I don't care if UKIP win. They would end up implementing policies similar to the Conservatives anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitebridges Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 (edited) What I would like to see is a proper leader running the country not some school boy/girl who tells lies and who refuses to listen to his/her electorate. Edited April 8, 2015 by Whitebridges Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keg Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Anyone in mind? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitebridges Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Anyone in mind? If you read the whole thread you'll easily work it out Keg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVB Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 If you read the whole thread you'll easily work it out Keg. Ok, ok I'll do it BUT you are all going to have to chip in to make up my salary. I am not taking a big drop to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 (edited) Whether the Consevatives can give you a referendum will depend on who they are in bed with (assuming a coalition). If UKIP they will, if LIB Dems, unlikely as they wouldn't win a commons vote. That's the way parliament works. It's a series of compromises. And If Labour get in do you really think they will care whether UKIP get 10%, 15% or even 50% of the vote? Of course not. I am similar to KW. As long as Labour don't get in I don't care if UKIP win. They would end up implementing policies similar to the Conservatives anyway. I don't really understand what you're trying to say here. Are you seriously suggesting the tories will give the British public an 'in out' referendum? The tories wont give anyone a referendum regardless of who they share power with because they daren't risk the public voting to leave the EU. The tories don't want to leave the EU; it has only become a suggestion by them because they fear they will lose votes to UKIP unless they appear to be on the side of a referendum. It wasn't an option they had even considered until they saw how popular UKIP had become on the back of the EU issue. I don't care what labour think regarding the percentage of UKIP votes; and I never suggested they would. I don't want labour in either but I wont vote tory to ensure it, as some suggest I should. The suggestion is ridiculous. I'll be voting UKIP. Whatever happens, happens. Edited April 8, 2015 by Scully Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjimmer Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Immigration is my number one concern. It might not be everyone's, but it is mine. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 (edited) Ok, ok I'll do it BUT you are all going to have to chip in to make up my salary. I am not taking a big drop to do it. That made me laugh, good of you to put yourself forward and offer to take one for the team. I would volunteer as well, but to be one of the dark ministers, pulling the strings and operating the levers behind the scenes. I don't really understand what you're trying to say here. Are you seriously suggesting the tories will give the British public an 'in out' referendum? The tories wont give anyone a referendum regardless of who they share power with because they daren't risk the public voting to leave the EU. The tories don't want to leave the EU; it has only become a suggestion by them because they fear they will lose votes to UKIP unless they appear to be on the side of a referendum. It wasn't an option they had even considered until they saw how popular UKIP had become on the back of the EU issue. I don't care what labour think regarding the percentage of UKIP votes; and I never suggested they would. I don't want labour in either but I wont vote tory to ensure it, as some suggest I should. The suggestion is ridiculous. I'll be voting UKIP. Whatever happens, happens. I actually do believe we would see a referendum under a Conservative majority, but little to no chance in a minority government as the parties will be enforcing a 3 line whip for the vote. There is a bill on it's second reading in the lords that would mandate a vote being taken on a EU referendum by the end of 2017 if there is a Conservative government. Edited April 8, 2015 by grrclark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FatFreddysCat Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Jeremy Clarkson for PM anyone? Should provide a few laughs if nothing else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mick miller Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Ah, the illusion of democracy. They've made it so very convincing haven't they? Like whatever you vote will matter a jot or in some way massively transform your lives for the better. Just vote for whomever floats your boat. If that's UKIP so be it, the idea that anyone would vote tactically to either keep Labour or Conservative out is a bit daft isn't it? Whats the point of that? It utterly undermines the democratic vote you think you have to tactically vote for a party you don't believe in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 I actually do believe we would see a referendum under a Conservative majority, but little to no chance in a minority government as the parties will be enforcing a 3 line whip for the vote. There is a bill on it's second reading in the lords that would mandate a vote being taken on a EU referendum by the end of 2017 if there is a Conservative government. I don't believe we would be given a referendum even with a majority. It has never been in the interest of the tories nor was it ever tory policy until UKIP forced their hand to do so and there are ways and means by which bills can be stalled or withheld until it runs out of time. A mandate means nothing without the will to see it through, and nor does a vote to see if there should be a vote. The tories don't have the will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krugerandsmith Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Ha ha ha Thanks for reminding us of what a liar this man is ...... not to be trusted.... Oh why can't these Conservatives be honourable like they used to be men like Macmillan .... Home... even Ted Heath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 I don't believe we would be given a referendum even with a majority. It has never been in the interest of the tories nor was it ever tory policy until UKIP forced their hand to do so and there are ways and means by which bills can be stalled or withheld until it runs out of time. A mandate means nothing without the will to see it through, and nor does a vote to see if there should be a vote. The tories don't have the will. We can agree to disagree, it doesn't really matter. I think it is all rather moot as there will not be a majority government so we are likely to see watered down policies across the board. This thread although fairly interesting in parts is all a bit moot too, people have their own reasons for voting the way they choose and people should stand by their principles, whether that is a vote for protest, a tactical vote or just a straight forward endorsement for your candidate or party of choice, or to spoil the paper. No matter what the outcome some will be happy and some unhappy, but we will all have had the opportunity to have our say and that is important. If some exit this process a bit more informed than they started it then that is a bonus. There will always be some who will be led by ignorant belief and some led by fantasy and some led by rhetoric and spin. Hopefully the rest considered what matters to them and their value system before marking their X. I like politics and find it interesting, but I would never want to be an elected representative, I would find it soul destroying to have to contend with the short sightedness and self interest that is the plague of all elected bodies. Better to be in business and be autocratic if you actually want to achieve anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 We can agree to disagree, it doesn't really matter. Yes, we can. And yes again, it doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Galore! Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Ok, ok I'll do it BUT you are all going to have to chip in to make up my salary. I am not taking a big drop to do it. ill come round and do your wife lawn for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anser2 Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 (edited) Scully, I have got my facts right. Farage’s great great grandfather was German who's parents came to London in the 1860s , his gran mother comes from a French family so his claim to be English is to say the least a little shaky and at best only three generations English , if you can become English in 3 generations. He may shoot but his letter to the CA is not very wildlife friendly indeed he does not agree with secondary testing of existing farm chemicals just because the EU want it law , even though it can be years before the toxic property of some chemicals becomes evident. As for reading the daily mail you have to be joking along with most of the tabloids most of what is written is to say the least sketchy about the truth , after all in tabloids circles it’s a paper never been one to let the truth get in the way of a a good story . Edited April 8, 2015 by anser2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FalconFN Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 I know many people seem to think the Lib Dems are out for the count but I have a sneaky suspicion we may see another Tory/Liberal coalition as many people will 'play safe' and vote for the incumbent government. It could just as easily go Labour's way though but I don't think many in England will be comfortable with a coalition with the SNP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anser2 Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Scully, I have got my facts right. Farage’s great great grandfather was German who's parents came to London in the 1860s , his grand mother comes from a French family so his claim to be English is to say the least a little shaky and at best only three generations English , if you can become English in 3 generations. How can someone who is of immigrant stock be so against immigrant coming in today even though under he own proposals his would not reach the criteria to be allowed in as they were penniless. He may shoot but his letter to the CA is not very wildlife friendly indeed he does not agree with secondary testing of existing farm chemicals just because the EU want it law , even though it can be years before the toxic property of some chemicals becomes evident . These chemicals may or may not be having an effect on quarry species. As for reading the daily mail you have to be joking along with most of the tabloids most of what is written is to say the least sketchy about the truth , after all in tabloids circles it’s a paper never been one to let the truth get in the way of a good story . And Welsh as for asking your candidates their stance on shooting? My local Mp does not shoot , but gave considerable time and effort contacting the DEFRA minister and supporting a local wildfowling club that was threatened by loss of ground by Natural England. The club won the day in part thanks to his efforts so my )- is a guy who just plays lip service to support shooting , he puts his money where his mouth is so will get my vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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