Pass through distance

[tonker]

I'm going to show my ignorance now, but can someone tell me the distance a Hornady 95gr sst or similar will travel after a pass through on a Roe say. I know there are variables like where you shoot and what you hit shoulder, ribs or just straight through clean, but I can't find the answer I need. I'll explain.I have just been given three farms to shoot for the deer. One on top of a hill which I don't think any shot is safe, and two on the levels.

Now when I say the levels I mean the levels. There are a few bushes that were once hedges over ryhne's but they are very few and far between (non existant really) nothing to put a high seat up against. A freestanding seat would stick out like a sore thumb. Hence my question as I will only be able to shoot off sticks. I know some will come on here and say only shoot with a safe backstop but I only have distance and no slopes to fire into. I will have a slight downward shot off sticks, but not much.

We all can miss at times which is another consideration.So does anyone know the answer to my question please?

Edited September 8, 2017 by tonker

[Fisheruk]

High seats will be your best bet on the flats. They will potentially travel further than you can see past hedges etc.

[Dekers]

The question is quite worrying, and there is no specific meaningful answer.

 

If you have ANY concerns (I note you mention missing as well) then you don't take the shot, or the 3 farms!

 

[powler]

Maybe try and build a back drop behind the hight seat so as hide yourself when you are sat in the seat, but like Dekers said if in doubt of your shot then you should not take it.

 

Mick

[Benthejockey]

i would imagine shooting on the hill could provide decent backstops. Shooting on the level means you're going to have to choose areas with backstops and shoot from an elevated position. A stack of bales might be a more discreet highseat. Shooting off a truck roof gives you a downward angle. If in doubt don't shoot. A hedge won't stop a bullet but if you walk around the ground you'll find places to shoot, nowhere is truly flat.

[tonker]

Thanks for the replies, they are all correct! but they all state what I already know and use in my everyday safety aspect of shooting.

To clarify, I can't drive the area, there are only bushes not hedges, The only way I could get a backstop is to use a high seat,

but the area is vast and the deer travel the whole area so I would probably need 40 high seats and then be in the wrong one,lol.

I can also see clearly as far as my eyes or bino's can pick up in a straight line with no obstacles,(and the deer would see me if their eyesight allowed).

Seems a shame to pass it up! I've shot for 40 yrs and have had some knowledgeable people read this topic.

It seems strange that none of us know the answer to this question.

Oh and Ben, when I say on the hill I mean right on the crown 360 degree views all round lovely views but impossible to shoot.

Probably why no-one shoots it or the moors, me included I think.

Edited September 9, 2017 by tonker

[Scully]

Cant say I've ever had a through and through shot on Roe, but I'm sure the possibility exists.

That doesn't negate the possibility of a miss of course.

If it can be proved, and is worth the hassle, that the deer are causing enough damage to be deemed pest proportions, then the only option I can think of is a shotgun. Strict criteria to be met of course.

As suggested, a high seat is your only other shootable option.

[clakk]

Tonker what about a portable high seat ,then u only need 1 and if its a bit of a faff a carp barrow or trolley to carry it

[Benthejockey]

I've got a portable high seat that cost me about £130 I think. It's a bit of a pig to carry about - it's supposedly easy to carry like a back pack but unless you've got 6ft wide shoulders it's never going to be comfy to carry. But I can put it up and down in a few minutes by myself. You could get another type that you can turn into a freestanding seat which although not ideal is going to be your best bet. Get some cameras out and find where the deer are travelling and then get some baits out. If you could back a seat up to one of these bushes then you'll be amazed how camouflaged you actually are. If the deer get used to a seat being out and are more occupied with a lick or something they won't see you and you'll only have to worry about the wind changing and them scenting you. Ground with deer is hard to come by and even if it takes a bit of hassle it's definitely worth persevering with.

[scotslad]

Is here no one u could take out with u and walk the farms and se wot safe shooting postions are??

Can u somehow attract deer/foxes into a safer shooting area

 

I'd say ur actual question is a wee bit pointless as there is so many varibles, the bullet could fly off at 90 degrees or any angle, depend on ur bullet choice (soft point or BT or any other), which will affect how ur bullet could deform but even that can vary from shot to shot even at the same distance. U also don't mention which calibre ur 95gr bullets is as it will affect the speed.

But the bullet will be deformed and should have passed a lot of energy into the beast so should be deccelarting quite quickly.

 

Really wot u need to be worrying about for every shot is if u miss not wether or not the bullet passes throu, ie ur good back stop in the line of fire plus a safe area all round, if u have that it doesn't really matter if ur bullet passes throu

 

I'd say most of the hills I've been on it would be unusual not to have some safe arcs of fire somewhere across the slope or in to a gully but it will depend on the actual hill and the size of ur ground.

 

I take it ur ground is cleared for ur rifle calibres unless u have an open ticket?

[tonker]

scotslad, I have had an open ticket for 35 yrs, .243 calibre. I agree with all you say, but no gullies up there, really is the dome of a hill, I think I'll pass it up, knew this all along in my head. as a clean miss would sail on out over the levels but some 300/400 ft higher.

Anyone saying they never miss is either telling lies or haven't shot enough. I think I'll pursue the high seats on the levels though. Cheers, I still think it strange that no-one knows the answer to the question, perhaps it's something I ought to do some

research on if I get some time.

Edited September 9, 2017 by tonker

[scotslad]

Sorry tonker I just presumed u must be more inexperienced with the question, I'd imagine u already know wot the answers are going to be and u've probably made the right decision not to shoot there. (I take it there are not many points where half way up u could get a shot back dropped against the higher hill slopes, but again will depend on the hill shape, plus if safe shots are so limited would be a pain stalking it seeing deer but never in a safe position. I could be frustrating and lead to u taking a shot u'd never normally consider)

 

 

I guess the reason there is no clear answer is there will be so many variables esp in a deer with bones etc.

2 shots aimed at same point at same range same bullet could give u completely different results if 1 clipped a rib or something (I've heard of chest shot deer having exit wounds through the front or even along back towards the a@@e) bullet would only have to strike 5mm away or deer/bullet strike at a slightly different angle

 

Really to study it u would use something like that ballistic jelly stuff so u have a constant medium that u can replicate accurately cos as u know even 2x100m similar broadside shots are never exactly the same.

If fired ur bullet into the jelly and then u can try altering ranges/bullet types. I've seen that Bruce Potts who rights for the ST doing similar things with ammo tests to test penetration and u can see the wound channel too

But even that while it should give u some results would only really be relevant for ballistic jelly when u add bones it would probably drop the distances again if u clipped 1

 

And the end of day really irrelevant as it will never travel as far or carry the same energy as the missed round that u have already risk assessed for just in case

Edited September 9, 2017 by scotslad

[activeviii]

I is one of then questions that cant be answered im afraid. you already said in the first post about the way the bullet reacts in the body. Was not to long a go someone in Poland was a back stop, and dead, for someone that shot a deer, bullet went through, as is should, and the poor cyclist took the bullet.

 

some times i think we all look for an answer that we really know isnt there.

 

is it really worth the risk, last light, cant see very well, someone behind the bush so you cant even get a thermal ping of them.

 

 

i have one place i shoot, on side of hill but houses are on the slope so cant, will not shoot that way. even though i have open ticket i still asked for the land to be checked, not for me, but for anyone else that take the land on. it is cleared for high set only and the high seats are only to be in 3 places. why? because some are deer or bust and need a step back to see problems.

i shoot plenty of deer of there but the game cameras helped me to build a pattern as to when the deer will be in these ares. sugar-beet, carrots and apples help as does the salt licks

[Walker570]

There is only one answer to your question and if you have as much experience as you say you have you will know that once that bullet leaves the end of the barrel it is it's own free agent, it can go anywhere. Therefore it is up to you to decide just how safe it is to yank the trigger. If, you have done enough you will know that there are days when you just have to walk away. I have been shooting SSTs now for a number of years and they are an excellent bullet, certainly in the three rifles I use them in, but it is absolutely impossible to answer your question as there are so many multiple variations.

 

IF IN DOUBT, DON'T.

[Savhmr]

If there isn't an adequate backstop, then I'd argue that the land isn't safe to shoot with any CF rifle, simple as that. If no high seat can be used, then really you have to question even contemplating shooting on such land at all. There was a farmer, early 70's living just outside of my original home town of Enniskillen who was shooting at a rabbit or something on a hill (shooting uphill I believe) and missed. The bullet travelled a hell of a long way and ended up hitting a young child in a neighbouring school play ground in the head. Nuff said. These shots are simply not worth the risk.

[ShootingEgg]

A flat shot and a miss would in theory hit the ground between 600-1000yrds but any angle up you're in trouble. At 45* it will travel upto 4miles. Then add in a hit with a bounce of a rib or two. You have NO safe shot on the levels unless you are shooting down into the ground out of a high seat or back of a truck, which isn't really going to be enough of an angle Imo.

Edited September 10, 2017 by ShootingEgg

[Dekers]

Thanks for the replies, they are all correct! but they all state what I already know and use in my everyday safety aspect of shooting.

To clarify, I can't drive the area, there are only bushes not hedges, The only way I could get a backstop is to use a high seat,

but the area is vast and the deer travel the whole area so I would probably need 40 high seats and then be in the wrong one,lol.

I can also see clearly as far as my eyes or bino's can pick up in a straight line with no obstacles,(and the deer would see me if their eyesight allowed).

Seems a shame to pass it up! I've shot for 40 yrs and have had some knowledgeable people read this topic.

It seems strange that none of us know the answer to this question.

Oh and Ben, when I say on the hill I mean right on the crown 360 degree views all round lovely views but impossible to shoot.

Probably why no-one shoots it or the moors, me included I think.

 

There isn't a meaningful answer to your question!!!!!!!

 

What am I missing, what have you been doing the last 35 years? I am truly amazed that after apparently 35 years with an Open .243 FAC you even asked it, also about missing?

 

Some land simply isn't suitable to shoot on, but frankly if this land is vast, as you suggest, just what is the issue?

[Scully]

 

There isn't a meaningful answer to your question!!!!!!! THIS

 

What am I missing, what have you been doing the last 35 years? I am truly amazed that after apparently 35 years with an Open .243 FAC you even asked it, also about missing?

.....and this.

[welshwarrior]

Can't give a meanful answer either as I've not seen the land. But sounds like you needs lots of high seats or feed station with back stops bulit in or it a no go.

[Paul223]

A blind rather than a high seat, like a high seat but free standing and boxed in, so no movement or silhouette from the shooter, and salt licks/carrots to draw the deer in

[Paul223]

Mel B's idea of self assembly scaffold looks just the job, easy to strip and move

 

 

https://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/339041-scaffold-tower-highseathide/?fromsearch=1