FAC or 12ft/lbs

[Cawdor118]

Evening chaps, I'm considering a air gun for shooting in times of boredom (like now). I also have a farm i can use it on for rabbits, rats, crows etc etc. I know its a subjective thing to ask... so please don't loose the wool. Am i better with a sub 12ft/lbs .177 or should i go the whole hog and just get a FAC .22? What i don't want to happen, is i get something then find it boring straight away. 

I'm liking the look of FX air guns. 

 

Cheers 👍

[steve_b_wales]

I've got one of each. You can buy an FAC one with adjustable power. That may suit all your needs.

[Cawdor118]

1 minute ago, steve_b_wales said:

I've got one of each. You can buy an FAC one with adjustable power. That may suit all your needs.

Do you think it would be sensible to just go all out? I assume the likes of the FX is adjustable from 12-40ft/lbs for example? 

[steve_b_wales]

I'm not sure about the FX range of rifles. I've got a S410 Xtra, and it's pushing 28ft/lb which is ample. It's down to you really.

[enfieldspares]

Until I bought a PCP (BSA Scorpion T-10) I'd no idea about how accurate they were and how quiet. It was a revelation. They are excellent. The advantages of s1 FAC PCP air rifles are that they extend range. The disadvantages are that unless you've an open FAC that you are restricted to named land only. Both my BSA guns were sub 12 ft/lbs. Both Scorpion T-10 but one in .177 the other in .22. If you get a .177 get it fitted with a regulator. From what I've seen on various forums if you go the s1 FAC route then get a .22. If I were exclusively targeting rats and rabbits I'd ask others better knowledgeable than myself if there is merit in a s1 FAC .25? But whatever you do, sub 12 ft/lbs, s1 FAC, .177, .22 or .25 do get one that has a reliable magazine system and buy at least one extra magazine. I have four for my .177 Scorpion T-10 (I sold the .22 as no longer could justify two PCPs) and count the air charge left in it by counting magazine changes. It is easier than counting shots!

Edited March 26, 2020 by enfieldspares

[Arron yeates]

Id say how good of a shot are you and how far are you planning to shoot? With the right shot placement from a good shooter whether dependant a 60 yard /meter head shot is achievable with sub 12 and correct pellet once youve done your testing. Dont think that having a fac air rifle makes things any more accurate and easier to shoot as i dont think thats the case.

[Cawdor118]

27 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:

Until I bought a PCP (BSA Scorpion T-10) I'd no idea about how accurate they were and how quiet. It was a revelation. They are excellent. The advantages of s1 FAC PCP air rifles are that they extend range. The disadvantages are that unless you've an open FAC that you are restricted to named land only. Both my BSA guns were sub 12 ft/lbs. Both Scorpion T-10 but one in .177 the other in .22. If you get a .177 get it fitted with a regulator. From what I've seen on various forums if you go the s1 FAC route then get a .22. If I were exclusively targeting rats and rabbits I'd ask others better knowledgeable than myself if there is merit in a s1 FAC .25? But whatever you do, sub 12 ft/lbs, s1 FAC, .177, .22 or .25 do get one that has a reliable magazine system and buy at least one extra magazine. I have four for my .177 Scorpion T-10 (I sold the .22 as no longer could justify two PCPs) and count the air charge left in it by counting magazine changes. It is easier than counting shots!

Thanks a lot! I have an open ticket already so this isn't a problem. I assume i just submit a variation for a S1 Air rifle?

I had discounted .25 to be perfectly honest, i have hears .22 is loopy enough so .25 can only be worse?

 

13 minutes ago, Arron yeates said:

Id say how good of a shot are you and how far are you planning to shoot? With the right shot placement from a good shooter whether dependant a 60 yard /meter head shot is achievable with sub 12 and correct pellet once youve done your testing. Dont think that having a fac air rifle makes things any more accurate and easier to shoot as i dont think thats the case.

If course, i'm bang average. But i can hit a barn door when needed to 😅. I guess i presumed more power gives more down range energy and more chance of knocking things over. 

[Ultrastu]

Not necessarily. 

With fac air you can set the power to what every u want . (Id your gun can handle it ) so the trajectory of a 900 fps .177 is basically the same as a .22 at 900 fpe and a .25 at 900 fps .its just the usually heavier .25 pellet will have more energy .

37 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:

Until I bought a PCP (BSA Scorpion T-10) I'd no idea about how accurate they were and how quiet. It was a revelation. They are excellent. The advantages of s1 FAC PCP air rifles are that they extend range. The disadvantages are that unless you've an open FAC that you are restricted to named land only. Both my BSA guns were sub 12 ft/lbs. Both Scorpion T-10 but one in .177 the other in .22. If you get a .177 get it fitted with a regulator. From what I've seen on various forums if you go the s1 FAC route then get a .22. If I were exclusively targeting rats and rabbits I'd ask others better knowledgeable than myself if there is merit in a s1 FAC .25? But whatever you do, sub 12 ft/lbs, s1 FAC, .177, .22 or .25 do get one that has a reliable magazine system and buy at least one extra magazine. I have four for my .177 Scorpion T-10 (I sold the .22 as no longer could justify two PCPs) and count the air charge left in it by counting magazine changes. It is easier than counting shots!

This is a good post  .

[enfieldspares]

Quote

I guess i presumed more power gives more down range energy and more chance of knocking things over. 

The real world advantage of more power is that it gives increased velocity. This 1) flattens your trajectory and so makes your "point blank" longer and 2) also makes an error in estimating a range to a target less critical. What would be (by a incorrect range estimate of say thirty yards instead of actually thirty-five yards) a hit outside the lethal zone (or even a clean miss) on a squirrel's head with a sub 12 ft/lb rifle and a trajectory like a half brick with pellet Z...it would still be a hit still inside that lethal zone on the squirrel's head with a s1 FAC rifle and a trajectory like a crossbow bolt with pellet Z. Depending of course on your 'scope height above bore and/or zero distance.

The website for one or other 'scope maker once had a tool called "chairgun" that you can input pellet weight, 'scope height, pellet velocity and it then shows you your likely trajectory curve. That can help you very much decide the matter of what to buy.

 

Edited March 26, 2020 by enfieldspares

[strimmer_13]

Get sub. If you like it get a variation and supe it up. 

But

As a general rule fac guns you'll find cheaper tho in the same model, just look on gun star ect ect

Also I don't know about other makes but most fx guns have a power wheel with 3 settings - 12,9,6ftlb for each (sub 12ftlb/non fac) . Once at fac, you could probably get it set for 26,18,12 (complete guess but id set the lowest for 12 as its a good enough puncher at close range) but it would still be classed as a fac at 12, so restrictions would still apply unless its 'opened' on ticket. 

Edited March 26, 2020 by strimmer_13

[pork chop]

If ya going fac go .25 

 

[button]

Have you already got a Air weapon licence? If not go FAC, not worth the hassle of applying when you already have a FAC

[old man]

12 hours ago, steve_b_wales said:

I'm not sure about the FX range of rifles. I've got a S410 Xtra, and it's pushing 28ft/lb which is ample. It's down to you really.

👍

[Cawdor118]

5 hours ago, button said:

Have you already got a Air weapon licence? If not go FAC, not worth the hassle of applying when you already have a FAC

I have both already. 

11 hours ago, pork chop said:

If ya going fac go .25 

 

Why do you prefer it? 

[pork chop]

5 hours ago, Cawdor118 said:

I have both already. 

Why do you prefer it? 

Just hits do much harder,50oddftlb though to flatten out the .25.Do you need fac air ,no I’ve shot lots more with sub 12 

think out of all my guns I miss my .25impact the most .May be coming up for sale when all this virus stuff is over 

[Cawdor118]

Do i need a specific variation stating ".22 fac air" for a fac airgun or can i just get one? 

[pork chop]

3 minutes ago, Cawdor118 said:

Do i need a specific variation stating ".22 fac air" for a fac airgun or can i just get one? 

My force always wants a specific cal 

not just fac air ,don’t forget your mod .But if it’s in built as the impact you don’t need to but always best to cover ya backside

[ratass]

also got to think where else you gonna shoot eg not on the farm,fac an garden plinking don't mix and does the farm allow fac.

JB

[Cawdor118]

20 minutes ago, pork chop said:

My force always wants a specific cal 

not just fac air ,don’t forget your mod .But if it’s in built as the impact you don’t need to but always best to cover ya backside

No worries! 

 

 

2 minutes ago, ratass said:

also got to think where else you gonna shoot eg not on the farm,fac an garden plinking don't mix and does the farm allow fac.

JB

Yes the farm is 100% fine. The FX impact allows you to dial it right down to minimum 👍

[villaman]

I have FAC .25 impact pushing out 70 ftlbs with 34 gr pellet and spot on accuracy out to stupid ranges 

Also have a FAC .22 fx crown pushing out 40 ftlbs with H&N slug , these slugs are a game changer . Laser accuracy at 125 yards , take rabbits at this distance often with a straight kill . This gun is the one I take out of impact , CZ 457 .22lr and 17 HMR 

[Hamster]

There is no contest between sub 12 and anything else over, even 25 ft lbs is going to be noticeably more useful out in the field especially if your gun has the capability of power adjustment, also it’s at fac levels where some pellets can start to mushroom giving greater instant kills. 

[figgy]

It all depends on intended use. 

Short range around in farm buildings etc sub12, in .177 or .22, for out in fields for rabbits and corvids, FAC .25 Impact would be my choice with slugs.

[Ultrastu]

This is where the fac .177 can really span the gap between sub 12  and fac air .

I cant imagine anybody thinking a fac .25 cal  or even a fac  .22 with heavy pellets or slugs is a suitable tool for a walk around the barns  like wise in the open fields after rabbits a .22 sub 12 isnt the most effective of tools  due to its poor trajectory and wind drift  .

The fac  .177 with a standard 8.5 or bit heavier 10.5 grn pellet isnt gonna be too much around the barns and at 900 fps gives a very flat trajectory for rabbits in the open  .

It really runs the middle ground well interms of versatility  .

 

[enfieldspares]

I use Bisley Magnum in my sub 12 ft/lbs .177 BSA Scorpion T-10 (regulated by Phil Crampton at Ratworks) as I tested a box full of various pellets (including highly praised JSB Exact in 4.50, 4.51 and 4.52) and they gave the best accuracy of any of the pellets I tested. Bisley Magnum in .177 are 10 grains or so. In my sub 12 ft/lbs .22 BSA Scorpion T-10 (non-regulated as per factory specification) I used Bisley Long Range Gold pellets. These gave good accuracy but wouldn't penetrate inside of the skull of a squirrel side on. They'd hit the head and fracture the skull to give a "dead right there" kill. You can't kill deader than that. So no complaint but it signalled to me it therefore probably wouldn't shoot through the breast of a woodpigeon through to the lungs which is what I essentially wanted it for. This is the main reason when I needed to sell one of these two I sold the .22 and kept the .177. The old dictat ".177 for feather....22 for fur" still holds true.

Edited March 28, 2020 by enfieldspares

[villaman]

If it’s for barns then sub 12 in any cal would do the job , or FAC fx and dial it down .  I can have my crown running at 40 ftlbs and with in 40-50 seconds I can dial down to under 12 

so the best of both worlds , same with impact .25   Or .22