hitfreshairagain Posted September 8, 2020 Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 Hi Everyone can anyone enlighten me to the answer ?.can my 13 year old stepson use a 20 bore that is on my certificate on private land . thanks in advance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob85 Posted September 8, 2020 Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 If you are with him at all times then I don't see a problem. On his own then no Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted September 8, 2020 Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 Legally, NO, not unless you actually hold the shooting rights to the land, not permission to shoot there, different thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted September 8, 2020 Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 (edited) Not strictly correct, Land Owner or his 'agent'. I was in a syndicate on a large estate, owned by a certain Lord. As he was unlikely to be out with us on a shoot day, it was acceptable for the 'Shoot Captain' to be classed as an 'Agent', to allow a non-certificate holder to shoot under supervision on a shoot day. This allowed young shooters to have a day, in the company of Dad. It may pay to have a word with your local Firearms Department though, it seems that currently, Chief Constables can make up the rules as they go along ? Edited September 8, 2020 by Westley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted September 8, 2020 Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 8 minutes ago, London Best said: Legally, NO, not unless you actually hold the shooting rights to the land, not permission to shoot there, different thing. Or the lender is the occupier and the borrower must remain in sight and sound of the lender Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hitfreshairagain Posted September 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 Perhaps the BASC will be able to help maybe I’ll call them tommorow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted September 8, 2020 Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 22 minutes ago, Westley said: Not strictly correct, Land Owner or his 'agent'. I was in a syndicate on a large estate, owned by a certain Lord. As he was unlikely to be out with us on a shoot day, it was acceptable for the 'Shoot Captain' to be classed as an 'Agent', to allow a non-certificate holder to shoot under supervision on a shoot day. This allowed young shooters to have a day, in the company of Dad. It may pay to have a word with your local Firearms Department though, it seems that currently, Chief Constables can make up the rules as they go along ? Totally correct Sir. I was trying to simplify it for the OP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkedUp Posted September 8, 2020 Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Westley said: Not strictly correct, Land Owner or his 'agent'. I was in a syndicate on a large estate, owned by a certain Lord. As he was unlikely to be out with us on a shoot day, it was acceptable for the 'Shoot Captain' to be classed as an 'Agent', to allow a non-certificate holder to shoot under supervision on a shoot day. This allowed young shooters to have a day, in the company of Dad. It may pay to have a word with your local Firearms Department though, it seems that currently, Chief Constables can make up the rules as they go along ? Correct, ‘or his agent’ 👍 Edited September 8, 2020 by WalkedUp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted September 8, 2020 Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 In this instance it would appear to be quite straightforward. If the OP is either the land occupier - eg, the tenant farmer - and/or the holder of the shooting rights if there are any, then we're good to go. Obviously, being the land owner would also qualify unless the land has one or more occupiers, ie, a tenant farmer and someone to whom the land owner has leased the shooting rights in which case he has no say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arjimlad Posted September 8, 2020 Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 The law changed on this so that you can lend a shotgun if you have written permission to do that. See here https://angliasporting.co.uk/general-news/borrowing-shotgunsfirearms/ & check out the links to BASC fact sheets. Makes it easier to do this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted September 8, 2020 Report Share Posted September 8, 2020 14 minutes ago, arjimlad said: The law changed on this so that you can lend a shotgun if you have written permission to do that. See here https://angliasporting.co.uk/general-news/borrowing-shotgunsfirearms/ & check out the links to BASC fact sheets. Makes it easier to do this. Yep, the occupiers now have the authority to delegate the permission albeit in writing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 But not to shoot at targets (ie clays) to do that you need an 11.6 exemption. the above is for live quarry and I think is the 11.5 exemption to the firearms act. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 1 hour ago, welshwarrior said: But not to shoot at targets (ie clays) to do that you need an 11.6 exemption. the above is for live quarry and I think is the 11.5 exemption to the firearms act. No, artificial targets are included. However, to this layman all this change to the law/act has done is muddy the waters. Previously, once you understood what 'occupier' meant all was clear. Now, read this: https://www.brownejacobson.com/training-and-resources/resources/legal-updates/2017/06/recent-changes-to-firearm-laws Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 2 hours ago, wymberley said: No, artificial targets are included. However, to this layman all this change to the law/act has done is muddy the waters. Previously, once you understood what 'occupier' meant all was clear. Now, read this: https://www.brownejacobson.com/training-and-resources/resources/legal-updates/2017/06/recent-changes-to-firearm-laws 11(6) has not been amended but 11(5) has been replaced by 11(A) I can’t see Artificial targets mentioned and it’s labelled Authorised lending and possession of firearms for hunting etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, welshwarrior said: 11(6) has not been amended but 11(5) has been replaced by 11(A) I can’t see Artificial targets mentioned and it’s labelled Authorised lending and possession of firearms for hunting etc See the 1st para' at 1), or probably better still: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1968/27/section/11A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 9 minutes ago, wymberley said: See the 1st para' at 1), or probably better still: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1968/27/section/11A Seen in Para 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 21 hours ago, hitfreshairagain said: Hi Everyone can anyone enlighten me to the answer ?.can my 13 year old stepson use a 20 bore that is on my certificate on private land . thanks in advance If you’d just got on with it and done it, like the vast majority of folk do, you wouldn’t be facing this quandary now! 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 Things have changed since I was 13 (1953) and I was now big enough to shoot my grandfathers 12 gauge. Back then I wandered over 220acres of our own land and another 180 acres belonging to my uncle and no one blinked and eyelid, even the local Bobby who would take a rabbit should I have one. Back to the future...................... the advice above is about right but anyone today who gives a shotgun to a 13 yr old an lets him loose on his own is going to be in big trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 23 minutes ago, Walker570 said: Things have changed since I was 13 (1953) and I was now big enough to shoot my grandfathers 12 gauge. Back then I wandered over 220acres of our own land and another 180 acres belonging to my uncle and no one blinked and eyelid, even the local Bobby who would take a rabbit should I have one. Back to the future...................... the advice above is about right but anyone today who gives a shotgun to a 13 yr old an lets him loose on his own is going to be in big trouble. I wasn’t suggesting letting him loose, regardless of what legislation states. I took my kids and nephews shooting with me from a very young age, under my supervision at all times. Common sense dictates, again, regardless of what legislation does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerCat Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 23 hours ago, hitfreshairagain said: Hi Everyone can anyone enlighten me to the answer ?.can my 13 year old stepson use a 20 bore that is on my certificate on private land . thanks in advance In a pigeon hide? Who would know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 52 minutes ago, GingerCat said: In a pigeon hide? Who would know? The attending officer when Joe Public calls in a “gunman”? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, London Best said: The attending officer when Joe Public calls in a “gunman”? Seriously? How is joe public going to know who is shooting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 2 hours ago, Scully said: I wasn’t suggesting letting him loose, regardless of what legislation states. I took my kids and nephews shooting with me from a very young age, under my supervision at all times. Common sense dictates, again, regardless of what legislation does. 100% agree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 1 hour ago, Scully said: Seriously? How is joe public going to know who is shooting? He won’t, but the officer might. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacko3275 Posted September 9, 2020 Report Share Posted September 9, 2020 (edited) It’s legal surely if you have permission to shoot on that land and your allowed to take someone with you Edited September 9, 2020 by Jacko3275 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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