Complete lock down in England

[oowee]

Listening to that t*** BJ and the bile was rising in my stomach. What a gob ***** its like having a rubber welly on the helm. I cannot believe that sane and rational people were drawn in by all the spouting garbage that comes from that man. What an appalling mess he has made of this situation. 

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, bavarianbrit said:

On 20th then driving back to Germany, that will be interesting as my wife has to go there for a planned operation to change her stents which cannot be postponed.

Hope you can get that OK, and as far as I have read there is (in the UK anyway) no restriction on attending any medical appointment.

[AVB]

3 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

Everyone to be careful and follow rules but people over 60 and those who are clinically vulnerable are being told to be especially careful

That is not the same as your earlier "And now the vulnerable don’t need to shield."

They are being told to shield "especially carefully"

I really don’t understand what the difference is between needing to be careful vs needing to be especially careful. But here is what the BBC states  

• Clinically vulnerable people are asked to be "especially careful" but people are not being asked to resume shielding

[ditchman]

8 minutes ago, bavarianbrit said:

Well I am in the middle of moving from one house in Dover to another in Dover planned day this morning was on 14th Nov, I cannot find anything on gov.org that allows or prohibits it so far.

On 20th then driving back to Germany, that will be interesting as my wife has to go there for a planned operation to change her stents which cannot be postponed.

when you find out ...let me know as i will be approaching a similar situation...regards estate agents/sales/moving ..

[JohnfromUK]

Just now, AVB said:

I really don’t understand what the difference is between needing to be careful vs needing to be especially careful. But here is what the BBC states  

• Clinically vulnerable people are asked to be "especially careful" but people are not being asked to resume shielding

I guess it is semantics, but to me shielding and being especially careful are much the same.

Key is that they have to take precautions

[oowee]

2 minutes ago, AVB said:

I really don’t understand what the difference is between needing to be careful vs needing to be especially careful. But here is what the BBC states  

• Clinically vulnerable people are asked to be "especially careful" but people are not being asked to resume shielding

Ask the Donkey that was on TV earlier. 

[Yellow Bear]

2 minutes ago, oowee said:

Ask the Donkey that was on TV earlier. 

No we are asking the "ALL KNOWING " civil servants, with rose tinted glasses

Edited October 31, 2020 by Yellow Bear

[bavarianbrit]

4 minutes ago, ditchman said:

when you find out ...let me know as i will be approaching a similar situation...regards estate agents/sales/moving ..

Getting all the carpets fitted on 14th Nov & a gas hob & oven around the same time.

2x masked robbers arriving in a luton van???

[AVB]

5 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

I guess it is semantics, but to me shielding and being especially careful are much the same.

Key is that they have to take precautions

In the first lockdown vulnerable people were told not to go out. Now they are being told that they can go out and meet no more than one person (same of everybody else) That to me is the difference. Now going out must increase the risk of infection and therefore more vulnerable people will become ill and die. If things are as dire as we are told then we aren’t they being told to shield? 

[treetree]

1 hour ago, Vince Green said:

Yes the law prevents me basic freedoms like driving at what speed I like, helping myself to things in shops, sticking my hand up the skirt of a woman on the bus and shooting at pigeons in the park.

your point is??

So are you saying that it is only the law that stops you from sticking your hand up the skirt of a woman on the bus?

There is good reason, whether it is common decency or health and safety why you should not do any of the things you cite.

Driving at high speeds or being irresponsible with a shotgun have a high likelihood of an incident occurring, with the severity of the incident bring high.

That can't be said about spending Christmas day with your brother.

[moondoggy]

3 hours ago, AVB said:

Nobody who has come into contact with me has died or even had the virus yet. 

How do you know?

[AVB]

2 minutes ago, moondoggy said:

How do you know?

1) because track and trace haven’t told me I have been in contact with anybody with it

2) I don’t have Covid 

3) I only know of three people who have had it and I haven’t been in contact with them. 

24 minutes ago, oowee said:

Listening to that t*** BJ and the bile was rising in my stomach. What a gob ***** its like having a rubber welly on the helm. I cannot believe that sane and rational people were drawn in by all the spouting garbage that comes from that man. What an appalling mess he has made of this situation. 

I think he should go and be replaced by Rishi. Not because of the blind hatred that you appear to have but because he has lost his bottle. 

[moondoggy]

7 minutes ago, AVB said:

1) because track and trace haven’t told me I have been in contact with anybody with it

2) I don’t have Covid 

3) I only know of three people who have had it and I haven’t been in contact with them. 

I think he should go and be replaced by Rishi. Not because of the blind hatred that you appear to have but because he has lost his bottle. 

Does track and trace monitor every door handle, items in shops, magazine, etc, etc, that you have touched?

You can’t possibly know that you don’t have COVID unless you are constantly being tested. You can have a test then contract COVID seconds later. That would not show up on the test.

[AVB]

Just now, moondoggy said:

Does track and trace monitor every door handle, items in shops, magazine, etc, etc, that you have touched?

You can’t possibly know that you don’t have COVID unless you are constantly being tested. You can have a test then contract COVID seconds later. That would not show up on the test.

True. But extremely unlikely.  The 'experts' say you need to be in close proximity ( < 2m) with somebody for 15 minutes for the virus to spread. 

[Fisheruk]

I had just finished two weeks self isolating, then into two weeks lockdown here in Wales. Most of my work and office is in England, so I think I’m off until 2nd December!.

 

[Gordon R]

Quote

You can’t possibly know that you don’t have COVID unless you are constantly being tested. You can have a test then contract COVID seconds later. That would not show up on the test.

Therein lies the real problem. 

[Mice!]

54 minutes ago, bavarianbrit said:

Well I am in the middle of moving from one house in Dover to another in Dover planned day this morning was on 14th Nov, I cannot find anything on gov.org that allows or prohibits it so far.

On 20th then driving back to Germany, that will be interesting as my wife has to go there for a planned operation to change her stents which cannot be postponed.

That all sounds essential to me?

[Mice!]

49 minutes ago, oowee said:

Ask the Donkey that was on TV earlier. 

Well that's about the clearest he has spoken tonight,  I'd love to know what else you think he should be doing? What miraculous thing he should come up with that France, Germany,  Belgium etc haven't thought of.

42 minutes ago, AVB said:

In the first lockdown vulnerable people were told not to go out. Now they are being told that they can go out and meet no more than one person (same of everybody else) That to me is the difference. Now going out must increase the risk of infection and therefore more vulnerable people will become ill and die. If things are as dire as we are told then we aren’t they being told to shield? 

It was all very new during the first lockdown,  now the only reason to go out for someone vulnerable is shopping,  and everyone should be wearing a mask in the shops, I'd say if you can't wear a mask then don't go the shops.

45 minutes ago, treetree said:

That can't be said about spending Christmas day with your brother.

Unless your brother has been going the pub every weekend carrying on like nothing is going on,  getting drunk without a care like you could in 2019?

[oowee]

1 minute ago, Mice! said:

Well that's about the clearest he has spoken tonight,  I'd love to know what else you think he should be doing? What miraculous thing he should come up with that France, Germany,  Belgium etc haven't thought of.

 

Simple. Something to believe in. Wobbling here there and everywhere with no spine or conviction to encourage coerce or compel or lead by example has resulted in everyone doing what they want.

No one believes what they are being told and more importantly WE do not own the solution. No belief in a common goal = do what you like.

Look at the vagaries of the message. There is no leadership!!!!!!!!!

[ordnance]

30 minutes ago, AVB said:

True. But extremely unlikely.  The 'experts' say you need to be in close proximity ( < 2m) with somebody for 15 minutes for the virus to spread. 

Make your mind up, i thought you think social distancing does not effect virus spreading. 

[AVB]

3 minutes ago, ordnance said:

Make your mind up, i thought you think social distancing does not effect virus spreading. 

The ‘experts’ say it does. I didn’t say it didn’t. I simply stated that the downturn in cases coincided with the onset of Summer and the increase coincides with the onset of Winter. Which is also the case with colds, flu and other respiratory illnesses. 

[fern01]

3 hours ago, JohnfromUK said:

If the police do their job - which is policing the law, I for one have no problem.  If that is done even handedly, politely where possible and fairly - I can't see any cause for complaint.

What is not so palatable (for me) is when the police selectively enforce the law, or do it crudely and rudely - and put their own interpretations on it.  For example - I had no complaint about the principle of them acting on the church service in Wales the other day - but they did it in a poor manner .......... and what would they have done had it been a mosque?

They were there but conveniently turned a blind eye to the hundreds at the protest / prayer meeting on Friday outside the French Embassy, no masks, no social distancing at all. Videos on U Tube

[Mice!]

23 minutes ago, oowee said:

No one believes what they are being told and more importantly WE do not own the solution. No belief in a common goal = do what you like.

I think part of the problem has been too many different restrictions in different places.

I'm happy knowing family and friends have been going along with whatever the local restrictions were.

Anyone I don't know,  lads at work have all been kept at distance,  this was the message space!!

[oowee]

1 minute ago, Mice! said:

I think part of the problem has been too many different restrictions in different places.

I'm happy knowing family and friends have been going along with whatever the local restrictions were.

Anyone I don't know,  lads at work have all been kept at distance,  this was the message space!!

I have no doubt you and me and others are following whatever it is we are supposed to follow. Unfortunately there are two many things to do differently depending on where you are based and the examples being set by politicians, sportsman, et al means we do not own the solution.

If the Govt had got together a cross party, cross UK working group together with proper  simple clear messaging much of this could have been avoided. The arrogance, flatulence and lack of attention to detail characteristic of our donkey is writ large for all to see and the general public is paying the price for his inadequacy.

 

[Mice!]

19 minutes ago, oowee said:

the Govt had got together a cross party, cross UK working group together with proper  simple clear messaging much of this could have been avoided. The arrogance, flatulence and lack of attention to detail characteristic of our donkey is writ large for all to see and the general public is paying the price for his inadequacy.

Why the need for a cross party working group? It's bad enough having 4 different lots of rules being put out there, Gov trying to get the economy going whilst putting in place local lockdowns to bring the rate down,  I couldn't imagine a cross party group achieving anything. 

The lockdown should have come earlier,  perhaps a Northern lockdown instead of messing around with different areas, maybe then it wouldn't have needed a total lockdown,  but plenty of businesses will still be in work, hopefully things get brought back under control with the months closure.