US Election Results!

[chrisjpainter]

Georgia on its recount now. All 5 million of them by hand! When it's proved Biden's won that state too, what's the betting Trump decides that maths is now working for the Democrats too and wants to abolish that?

[Rewulf]

40 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said:

 

Did anyone really query the actual vote count in Brexit? I don't believe so.

I dont believe I said that .

It was just everything else they not so much queried , but tried to demolish , using insult, lies, and propaganda worthy of any nazi/commie despot.

[Raja Clavata]

Just now, Rewulf said:

I dont believe I said that .

It was just everything else they not so much queried , but tried to demolish , using insult, lies, and propaganda worthy of any nazi/commie despot.

Bit extreme, but at least you covered the full political spectrum there 🤣

[Mice!]

8 hours ago, mick miller said:

As of this mornign JB sits on 259 vs DJT on 214. No clear mandate to call himself 'President-Elect', yet. However, the media for some strange reason appears to have crowned him already; that's not how the constitution works. Why is Biden and the Democratic party flat-out refusing to allow the results and ballots to be independently verified? It would clear this mess up.

This is whsts been throwing me, not all the results are in but a win is being claimed.

I'm wondering are the Democrats hoping that Trump concedes? Can't see it happening. 

And if they aren't allowing things to be verified then maybe they know something is fishy?

[12gauge82]

58 minutes ago, chrisjpainter said:

Georgia on its recount now. All 5 million of them by hand! When it's proved Biden's won that state too, what's the betting Trump decides that maths is now working for the Democrats too and wants to abolish that?

If that happens, trump should absolutely leave. At the end of the day, if the Democrats are sure they've won fairly, there's nothing for them to fear. 

[WalkedUp]

I may have been mistaken regarding BREXIT, however I honestly do not recall a campaign to say the vote was fraudulent. Yes lots of people said it was stupid/racist/etc and disagreed with the result, and wanted a different outcome either via a mad third referendum or a change of gov, but I do not recall a substantive argument that the vote was a lie. 

[12gauge82]

The remain side fro brexit claimed we needed a people's vote as those who voted leave will have died amongst all manner of things, not too different really if not worse. 

[WalkedUp]

10 hours ago, Demonic69 said:

I do! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegations_of_unlawful_campaigning_in_the_2016_EU_referendum

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/17/vote-leave-broke-electoral-law-and-british-democracy-is-shaken

Gina Miller?

They overspent, two people interviewed under caution, then it was forgotten about as the result was not in dispute. Hardly the same as Trump and the Republican Party calling in the cavalry!

[chrisjpainter]

1 minute ago, Mice! said:

This is whsts been throwing me, not all the results are in but a win is being claimed.

I'm wondering are the Democrats hoping that Trump concedes? Can't see it happening. 

And if they aren't allowing things to be verified then maybe they know something is fishy?

The news agencies call a state when their stats goblins decide that a candidate's lead cannot in all likelihood be overturned. It's done by working out what is left to count, from where and the size of the lead needed to be overhauled. as soon as they feel confident it can't be, the state's called. So far, none of them have been wrong. The 47 that have been called haven't changed since. We're waiting on Georgia, North Carolina and Arizona, which are all too close to call. Alaska's just been called. They've hit 75% of the expected turnout and Trump has almost an 18pt lead. Biden's hardly going to pull that back, especially in a state like Alaska. An election is really only called by proxy, one state will just happen to be the one that pushes someone over 270. This time it happened to be Pennsylvania, where Biden's lead is now well north of 48k. I can't say it's likely to be flipped now...

[mick miller]

The whole thing is a complete an utter fuster cluck. I have never seen the like.

[WalkedUp]

38 minutes ago, chrisjpainter said:

The news agencies call a state when their stats goblins decide that a candidate's lead cannot in all likelihood be overturned. It's done by working out what is left to count, from where and the size of the lead needed to be overhauled. as soon as they feel confident it can't be, the state's called.

The official result takes a long time. America has created this tradition of networks calling the result, with the network’s reputation at stake to be accurate against the commercial desire to be the first to announce. It’s a slightly mad highly “free market” system. 

However Rudy Guilliani made an amazing blunder the other day when he was giving a press conference and the result was announced whilst he was live - to paraphrase  “oh so just because it’s on TV is it true, so should we just ignore democracy and the law because the networks say so? The networks don’t decide elections, the courts do.” 🤣

He should have said “the people do” as that’s literally democracy. But he said courts because that’s the lawyer’s way of getting what you want. 

[chrisjpainter]

15 minutes ago, WalkedUp said:

The official result takes a long time. America has created this tradition of networks calling the result, with the network’s reputation at stake to be accurate against the commercial desire to be the first to announce. It’s a slightly mad highly “free market” system. 

However Rudy Guilliani made an amazing blunder the other day when he was giving a press conference and the result was announced whilst he was live - to paraphrase  “oh so just because it’s on TV is it true, so should we just ignore democracy and the law because the networks say so? The networks don’t decide elections, the courts do.” 🤣

He should have said “the people do” as that’s literally democracy. But he said courts because that’s the lawyer’s way of getting what you want. 

Yep! and all in the Four Seasons Landscape Garden company carpark, next to a crematorium and a sex shop because some spanner booked that and not the prestigious Four Seasons hotel! what a 'nana

[Mice!]

1 hour ago, chrisjpainter said:

The news agencies call a state when their stats goblins decide that a candidate's lead cannot in all likelihood be overturned. It's done by working out what is left to count, from where and the size of the lead needed to be overhauled. as soon as they feel confident it can't be, the state's called. So far, none of them have been wrong. The 47 that have been called haven't changed since. We're waiting on Georgia, North Carolina and Arizona, which are all too close to call. Alaska's just been called. They've hit 75% of the expected turnout and Trump has almost an 18pt lead. Biden's hardly going to pull that back, especially in a state like Alaska. An election is really only called by proxy, one state will just happen to be the one that pushes someone over 270. This time it happened to be Pennsylvania, where Biden's lead is now well north of 48k. I can't say it's likely to be flipped now...

I can understand them calling states when the margin is obvious but when it's less than a percentage point they must know its going to be challenged?

Still its different than Covid. 

[grrclark]

1 hour ago, mick miller said:

The whole thing is a complete an utter fuster cluck. I have never seen the like.

The count is like this every election in the US.  The TV networks call out the result once it is all but certain, then weeks later the vote is certified after all the checks and balances have been completed.  This has to happen by the end of the 2nd week in December i think.

The only thing that is really very different this time around is Trump's histrionics.

[chrisjpainter]

26 minutes ago, Mice! said:

I can understand them calling states when the margin is obvious but when it's less than a percentage point they must know its going to be challenged?

Still its different than Covid. 

It's going to be challenged, but less than a percentage point is a vast number of votes. Currently, 0.7% in Pennsylvania represents 50k votes. They called it when the gap was about 30k and 0.3% . Assuming there is no election fraud (there has never been anything on that scale ever before in the US), you have to think, 'could someone have made 30,000 mistakes? No...probably not!' So you call it, because the alternative is so wildly unlikely that it'd be daft not to - all that is assuming you take out the possibility of mass fraud. I don't think there was, but in terms of the stats behind calling a state, it doesn't actually matter, whether fraudulently gained or not, the numbers would be solid for enough of a degree of certainty to call it.

[Demonic69]

12 hours ago, WalkedUp said:

They overspent, two people interviewed under caution, then it was forgotten about as the result was not in dispute. Hardly the same as Trump and the Republican Party calling in the cavalry!

My original point is that the remainers bitched and moaned about the result, trying everything they could to overturn it. Legal challenges, the whole "they were lied to so it's not fair" bit, trying to get it blocked in parliament, trying to get it ignored completely as it was not legally binding etc. It's not a like for like scenario, but the behaviours are similar as originally pointed out. While they haven't demanded a recount (they certainly would should some discrepancies have shown up) they've demanded, over and over, that there be another vote. Is that what Trump should do then?

[WalkedUp]

Trump will get another vote in 4 years 👍

I’m not saying the behaviour of some remainers was not negative, but it didn’t attempt to undermine the nature of the democratic process. 

[12gauge82]

57 minutes ago, Demonic69 said:

My original point is that the remainers bitched and moaned about the result, trying everything they could to overturn it. Legal challenges, the whole "they were lied to so it's not fair" bit, trying to get it blocked in parliament, trying to get it ignored completely as it was not legally binding etc. It's not a like for like scenario, but the behaviours are similar as originally pointed out. While they haven't demanded a recount (they certainly would should some discrepancies have shown up) they've demanded, over and over, that there be another vote. Is that what Trump should do then?

Absolutely spot on, the remainers tried every trick in the book to undermine the democratic referendum result. 

[Demonic69]

40 minutes ago, WalkedUp said:

Trump will get another vote in 4 years 👍

I’m not saying the behaviour of some remainers was not negative, but it didn’t attempt to undermine the nature of the democratic process. 

Do you reckon he'll hang around? I've a feeling the Reps will go with someone a bit less polarising, but with a similar message. A PoC could win them a lot of votes I think. The Vice interview was interesting, with most of the black people they had on the panel saying they voted for Obama because he was black, some only changing their minds about him after 4 years of no improvements for blacks in the US.

[JohnfromUK]

3 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Absolutely spot on, the remainers tried every trick in the book to undermine the democratic referendum result. 

That would also be my view.

[Stonepark]

The problem is in the USA the remoaners (democrats) have declared victory through the MSM and are desperately trying to get everyone to believe that they achieved the victory before the scorecard is fully tallied and results confirmed and that no cheating took place.

 

[chrisjpainter]

3 minutes ago, Stonepark said:

The problem is in the USA the remoaners (democrats) have declared victory through the MSM and are desperately trying to get everyone to believe that they achieved the victory before the scorecard is fully tallied and results confirmed and that no cheating took place.

 

This is how it's always done, regardless of whether it's a Dem or Rep. It's what Trump did the previous election, after all...

[mick miller]

12 hours ago, grrclark said:

The count is like this every election in the US.  The TV networks call out the result once it is all but certain, then weeks later the vote is certified after all the checks and balances have been completed.  This has to happen by the end of the 2nd week in December i think.

The only thing that is really very different this time around is Trump's histrionics.

And Hillary had none. Sheesh, she had a face like a smacked **** for four years and threw as much invented muck as she could through the courts. My, some memories are short. 

[chrisjpainter]

1 minute ago, mick miller said:

And Hillary had none. Sheesh, she had a face like a smacked **** for four years and threw as much invented muck as she could through the courts. My, some memories are short. 

She did at least concede defeat by phone on the night it was called. She didn't give a concession speech until later because she hadn't got one written (oops!).

[12gauge82]

3 minutes ago, chrisjpainter said:

She did at least concede defeat by phone on the night it was called. She didn't give a concession speech until later because she hadn't got one written (oops!).

And I think that's where trump needs to be careful, if he doesn't flip the vote or at least show there was widespread voting irregularities, his credibility is gone. If however he proves he was right it's going to send shock waves through America and beyond and he'll certainly go up in my estimations, I can't see it happening, but only time will tell.