Barrel pitting

[Hicky]

I’ve come across a bargain at my local gunshop. However it has a slight pitting in the barrel, is it anything to worry about generally?

thanks 

[Scully]

If it’s just slight and I really really wanted the gun then it wouldn’t bother me. 
Two things to consider; would you be happy putting steel through it, ( regardless of the pitting ) and how the pitting would affect its resale. 

[Gunman]

7 minutes ago, Hicky said:

I’ve come across a bargain at my local gunshop. However it has a slight pitting in the barrel, is it anything to worry about generally?

thanks 

Depends on what the gun is , how much , how deep the pitting its wall thickness , proof status and what you are going to use it for .

So the answer to your question is without it being checked by a competent person there is no fixed answer .

[Hicky]

Aya magnum, £145 1200kg cm/sq. I was planning on using it for wildfowling as many on here have. The gunshop informed me of the issue but said it’s nothing serious. I’ve yet to see it. 

[Old Boggy]

If this is the one being sold by Gryphon Sporting, I can assure you that Alan, the proprietor, is a most sincere, honest and helpful guy to buy from and of course, as the law dictates, would not sell any gun that is out of proof.

OB

[Hicky]

It isn’t, it’s a beaver tail type. 

[holloway]

12 minutes ago, Old Boggy said:

If this is the one being sold by Gryphon Sporting, I can assure you that Alan, the proprietor, is a most sincere, honest and helpful guy to buy from and of course, as the law dictates, would not sell any gun that is out of proof.

OB

Ditto ,he even delivered one to me ,I always check his stock before anyone else's.The Aya of his looks good value for a cheapy.

13 minutes ago, Hicky said:

It isn’t, it’s a beaver tail type. 

That is a very common gun ,lots about with no question marks.

[benbobailey]

46 minutes ago, Hicky said:

I’ve come across a bargain at my local gunshop. However it has a slight pitting in the barrel, is it anything to worry about generally?

thanks 

Hello, I would not consider firing a gun with barrel pits. The pits may have weakened the wall strength although the gun is still in proof. Why risk a dangerous incident for a bargain, there are thousands of cheap side by side for sale. This is my opinion, and that of many other experienced shots and gun trade personnel to whom I have spoken. Regards

Edited April 18, 2021 by benbobailey

[ditchman]

i know it sounds stupid but are you sure  it is pitting....i bought a sxs a long while ago ...the sellar said it had slight pitting...took it to my gunsmith....he (i think) lapped it out and polished it.........hey presto ..it was gone...

if you buy and sell guns regular...might be worth buying a half decent endoscope

[enfieldspares]

I cannot agree with BENBOBBAILEY on the issue of safety for the reasons below.

GUNMAN has the matter spot on when he says: Depends on what the gun is , how much , how deep the pitting its wall thickness , proof status and what you are going to use it for . So the answer to your question is without it being checked by a competent person there is no fixed answer .

Pitting is only an issue (as far as safety is concerned) if it has compromised the wall thickness of the barrel to below a "safe" thickness. Thus pitting in, say, a Greener GP will be cosmetically irritating but not as such a safety concern. Pitting however in a Boss may be a safety concern as the Greener has barrel walls like scaffold tubes in thickness whereas the Boss (even when new) had barrel walls that were by reputation the thinnest of all the "best gun" London makers.

Pitting directly in front of the forcing cone may, again, be less of a concern than pitting halfway up the left barrel directly where your left hand is positioned when shooting the gun. So it is very much "how much" "how deep" and I'd beg to add to that also "where it is".

Therefore in any gun with barrels that have a good wall thickness pitting will not, unless it is deep, be a cause for concern at all from a safety viewpoint. The real concern I'd have (especially in English guns) is this.

Is this pitting in fact what can STILL be seen after the barrels have been re-bored to remove the worst of the pitting that was there and what can be seen is what remained after that rebore?

This then can become perhaps a safety issue as the barrels will now be thinner overall than originally and in some cases now rendered thin enough that a subsequent dent cannot be successfully raised. So if dented subsequently to that initial rebore they now then are fit only for scrapping. And/or if further pits develop the thing has no more metal left in the remaining wall thickness to be rebored.

However I do agree with BENBOBBAILEY in his sentiment that it is a buyer's market and it may be better to pass this gun by. If OTOH the OP decides not to pass it by I'd expect its price to be a full 50% discount on the price of that of the same gun without pits. 

Edited April 18, 2021 by enfieldspares

[Hicky]

Ok, thank you for the input.

 

[benbobailey]

1 hour ago, enfieldspares said:

I cannot agree with BENBOBBAILEY on the issue of safety for the reasons below.

GUNMAN has the matter spot on when he says: Depends on what the gun is , how much , how deep the pitting its wall thickness , proof status and what you are going to use it for . So the answer to your question is without it being checked by a competent person there is no fixed answer .

Pitting is only an issue (as far as safety is concerned) if it has compromised the wall thickness of the barrel to below a "safe" thickness. Thus pitting in, say, a Greener GP will be cosmetically irritating but not as such a safety concern. Pitting however in a Boss may be a safety concern as the Greener has barrel walls like scaffold tubes in thickness whereas the Boss (even when new) had barrel walls that were by reputation the thinnest of all the "best gun" London makers.

Pitting directly in front of the forcing cone may, again, be less of a concern than pitting halfway up the left barrel directly where your left hand is positioned when shooting the gun. So it is very much "how much" "how deep" and I'd beg to add to that also "where it is".

Therefore in any gun with barrels that have a good wall thickness pitting will not, unless it is deep, be a cause for concern at all from a safety viewpoint. The real concern I'd have (especially in English guns) is this.

Is this pitting in fact what can STILL be seen after the barrels have been re-bored to remove the worst of the pitting that was there and what can be seen is what remained after that rebore?

This then can become perhaps a safety issue as the barrels will now be thinner overall than originally and in some cases now rendered thin enough that a subsequent dent cannot be successfully raised. So if dented subsequently to that initial rebore they now then are fit only for scrapping. And/or if further pits develop the thing has no more metal left in the remaining wall thickness to be rebored.

However I do agree with BENBOBBAILEY in his sentiment that it is a buyer's market and it may be better to pass this gun by. If OTOH the OP decides not to pass it by I'd expect its price to be a full 50% discount on the price of that of the same gun without pits. 

Hello Enfield spares, Whilst I gave my honest opinion and thought on the matter, I do submit I have no great engineering experience or qualification. You and everyone else  of course,are perfectly entitled to express their own view on the subject. However, I stand by my statement that I would not consider firing a pitted barrel. Best regards and safe shooting to all.

[London Best]

2 hours ago, benbobailey said:

Hello Enfield spares, Whilst I gave my honest opinion and thought on the matter, I do submit I have no great engineering experience or qualification. You and everyone else  of course,are perfectly entitled to express their own view on the subject. However, I stand by my statement that I would not consider firing a pitted barrel. Best regards and safe shooting to all.

Sir, could I respectfully ask how much experience you have with shotguns?

[Gunman]

May I point out in my original comment I was somewhat vague in comment . 

This was because there was very little information as to what the gun in question was .

A point I have made many times and asked people to give as much information as possible when asking questions .

If it is being sold by a reputable dealer who can give you all the information you need including wall thickness ,bore sizes ,proof size ,etc. then on inspection YOU decide if the pitting is acceptable to you ie. minor surface pits then it may well  be OK , as many guns are shot every day with some pitting in the bores .

If you are not sure then no matter how cheap walk away .

 

 

[benbobailey]

44 minutes ago, London Best said:

Sir, could I respectfully ask how much experience you have with shotguns?

Hello London Best, I have held my shotgun certificate continuously since 1970 and firearms a year or so later.  Since my service in the armed forces ,where my interest really took hold, I have been  heavily involved in fieldsports, particularly game shooting, and have been lucky enough to encounter many knowledgeable folk. I now am more content working dogs.Thanks for your interest, regards

[London Best]

@benbobailey, thanks for the reply. I was merely curious as I thought your initial comment strange for most with experience. I was obviously wrong!

[benbobailey]

43 minutes ago, London Best said:

@benbobailey, thanks for the reply. I was merely curious as I thought your initial comment strange for most with experience. I was obviously wrong!

London Best, I don't find it at all strange to err on the side of caution re firearms. After the forces I was employed at Nobel Explosives(ICI) and safety was paramount. At no stage have I claimed superior knowledge but answered the query honestly ie "I" wouldn't use with pits ( too many unknown variables). We all have our own opinions and ideas , and I am happy to listen to all views.  Let's hope we all have a better season this year and I hope Hicky finds a suitable gun. Regards

Edited April 18, 2021 by benbobailey
Spelling

[London Best]

Yes, we can certainly agree that we hope we all have a better season this year. Hope you enjoy it as much as I am determined to do. Kind regards.

[benbobailey]

17 minutes ago, London Best said:

Yes, we can certainly agree that we hope we all have a better season this year. Hope you enjoy it as much as I am determined to do. Kind regards.

👍

[mossy835]

i had an old hammer gun s/s, years ago full of pitting and used it for years,worked fine, just buy it,

Edited April 18, 2021 by mossy835

[Hicky]

Gents, thank you for the continued contribution. I decided to pass on the gun and bought a Zabala 3 1/2" chamber SxS Steel proofed for not a great deal more.

I cannot for the life of me see any marks to show what model and after having a quick google I assume the company has gone bump. Great condition and it takes Beretta chokes should I need spares. Is there a website I could check the serial number against?

Thanks

[ditchman]

i used to shoot and pick up at Henham park...2 shoots a week 2-300 bird days including ducks and partridge over Blythburgh (now Latitude festival)....the shoot was run by richard scarlett and the keeper was micky spool   (chopper spool)...

on the beaters day micky used to bring out his old sxs ......everytime he had a shot a puff of smoke came out sideways....eventually richard scarlett got fed up with micky try to kill himeself and took the gun off him and gave him a gun from his collection.....micky was a bit unhappy as he had the gun for many decades....i saw the gun and the only reason the puff of smoke didnt come out the left hand side was because micky a few years before that had taken it down to the blacksmith to have a patch brazed on...which held.......

i think marsh man know the shoot i was on....also the head of BASC Anglia region used to shoot there regular.........them suffolk boys are suffin else bu..

[wymberley]

On 18/04/2021 at 11:07, enfieldspares said:

I cannot agree with BENBOBBAILEY on the issue of safety for the reasons below.

GUNMAN has the matter spot on when he says: Depends on what the gun is , how much , how deep the pitting its wall thickness , proof status and what you are going to use it for . So the answer to your question is without it being checked by a competent person there is no fixed answer .

Pitting is only an issue (as far as safety is concerned) if it has compromised the wall thickness of the barrel to below a "safe" thickness. Thus pitting in, say, a Greener GP will be cosmetically irritating but not as such a safety concern. Pitting however in a Boss may be a safety concern as the Greener has barrel walls like scaffold tubes in thickness whereas the Boss (even when new) had barrel walls that were by reputation the thinnest of all the "best gun" London makers.

Pitting directly in front of the forcing cone may, again, be less of a concern than pitting halfway up the left barrel directly where your left hand is positioned when shooting the gun. So it is very much "how much" "how deep" and I'd beg to add to that also "where it is".

Therefore in any gun with barrels that have a good wall thickness pitting will not, unless it is deep, be a cause for concern at all from a safety viewpoint. The real concern I'd have (especially in English guns) is this.

Is this pitting in fact what can STILL be seen after the barrels have been re-bored to remove the worst of the pitting that was there and what can be seen is what remained after that rebore?

This then can become perhaps a safety issue as the barrels will now be thinner overall than originally and in some cases now rendered thin enough that a subsequent dent cannot be successfully raised. So if dented subsequently to that initial rebore they now then are fit only for scrapping. And/or if further pits develop the thing has no more metal left in the remaining wall thickness to be rebored.

However I do agree with BENBOBBAILEY in his sentiment that it is a buyer's market and it may be better to pass this gun by. If OTOH the OP decides not to pass it by I'd expect its price to be a full 50% discount on the price of that of the same gun without pits. 

Yes, but only if you insist on looking. Mine had more craters than the moon  so simply ignored them.

[mel b3]

5 hours ago, ditchman said:

i used to shoot and pick up at Henham park...2 shoots a week 2-300 bird days including ducks and partridge over Blythburgh (now Latitude festival)....the shoot was run by richard scarlett and the keeper was micky spool   (chopper spool)...

on the beaters day micky used to bring out his old sxs ......everytime he had a shot a puff of smoke came out sideways....eventually richard scarlett got fed up with micky try to kill himeself and took the gun off him and gave him a gun from his collection.....micky was a bit unhappy as he had the gun for many decades....i saw the gun and the only reason the puff of smoke didnt come out the left hand side was because micky a few years before that had taken it down to the blacksmith to have a patch brazed on...which held.......

i think marsh man know the shoot i was on....also the head of BASC Anglia region used to shoot there regular.........them suffolk boys are suffin else bu..

That's made me chuckle. It's on a par with the guy that brought his car into the garage for me to mot,  and he'd repaired a flexible rubber brake pipe with insulation tape 😅.

[ditchman]

46 minutes ago, mel b3 said:

That's made me chuckle. It's on a par with the guy that brought his car into the garage for me to mot,  and he'd repaired a flexible rubber brake pipe with insulation tape 😅.

ive seen sills on a car filled with concrete.............that never going to rust