Another Gamekeeper At The Courts

[marsh man]

Another game keeper who was lucky , or unlucky depending on what way you look at it got less than he deserved , Matthew  Stroud  46 admitted illegally shooting and poisoning birds of prey , and also releasing 3500 pheasants into the wild contrary to the Wildlife And Countryside act 1981.

He admitted at Norwich Magistrates Court shooting five Buzzards and one Goshawk , the poisoning of another Buzzard , the laying of poison baits and in possession of poisons including Strychnine .

He received 12 month community order , was ordered to do 200 hours of unpaid work and was fined £692 for offences connected with raptor persecution .

I recon he got off light , What do you think ?

PS  You can see the story in today's Eastern Daily Press in you want to put up a link .

[enfieldspares]

Speaking, now, of OTHER cases unrelated to this that I have read of (rather that of this case) I always wonder if the person in the dock did these crimes..for that is what they are...of their own volition or whether there were other pressures?

[Pushandpull]

You can find this on edp24, raptor persecution etc. Just to clarify, the birds were released within a Special Protection Area (SPA). He is described as being self-employed so it's not clear if he was running the shoot or what.

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, what did his employers have to say about that, ? Did he loose his job, what ever one thinks about keeping game and killing birds that take chicks the law is the law and it's right he was prosecuted , 200 hours of community service ??, That's a long time going by when I was involved with this punishment, 

3 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, what did his employers have to say about that, ? Did he loose his job, what ever one thinks about keeping game and killing birds that take chicks the law is the law and it's right he was prosecuted , 200 hours of community service ??, That's a long time going by when I was involved with this punishment, 

Hello, seems to happen on Norfolk shoots ?? 

[Walker570]

It sounds as if he was running the shoot himself otherwise his employer would have been in the dock as well for allowing him to release those birds.  Personally I think he got off lightly.  It requires at least a possibilty of a few months away on  holiday...even suspended to stem these activities. 

[Poor Shot]

Completely unacceptable regardless of the circumstances or other pressures.

We cannot continue to carry out raptor persecution if we are to have any expectation that our sport will still be here in 10 years time.

Raptors take birds and raptor persecution is illegal end of story. We need to account for that in the numbers we are putting down and mitigate for it where possible.

If you're a shoot that still has pens that are uncovered then you've no right to complain that BOPs are taking the poults. If you're suffering massive losses when the birds are turned out then you need be implementing measures to make the ground more hospitable for the birds, more cover, netted feeding pens etc.

The idea that raptor persecution is acceptable is one of the only things that I'm glad to see (sort of) disappearing with the older generations.

[davewh100]

 very lucky to get away with what he got, should of gone to the big house

 

 

[marsh man]

2 hours ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, what did his employers have to say about that, ? Did he loose his job, what ever one thinks about keeping game and killing birds that take chicks the law is the law and it's right he was prosecuted , 200 hours of community service ??, That's a long time going by when I was involved with this punishment, 

Hello, seems to happen on Norfolk shoots ?? 

Not sure weather he was employed or running the shoot for a syndicate as he was self employed and he released 3500 which is a lot of birds for a small rough shoot or for a walk and stand , if he was looking to get around 60% returns then you are looking at about 2000 birds shot , the chap in question ran the shoot in the Thetford area which is renown for game shooting .

As for happening on Norfolk shoots , this could well be we have as many , if not more game shoots than any other county in the U K , not as many this year as a lot of shoots rely on early Partridge days and Partridge poults were very hard to come by . 

 

 

 

 

[Gas seal]

I know a lot of people read these forums that don’t shoot.  Did he do it for fun, he must have enjoyed it. Did he do it for cash, he must have spent the proceeds. This could be for the wildlife lawyers. If he released them thousands of non native pheasants without a license could he be ordered by a court to catch them all up and go to a place decided by them or kill the lot all at his own expense. This will be a good case for licensing shoots as this one would never operate again. Well done to all the people who brought him to court, it could have been the shooting people who caught him, someone must have known what he was doing it wasn’t a mistaken shot when out shooting. Or was he just the unlucky one. DEFRA should stop the shoot operating if they can. 

[Poor Shot]

1 hour ago, Gas seal said:

I know a lot of people read these forums that don’t shoot.  Did he do it for fun, he must have enjoyed it. Did he do it for cash, he must have spent the proceeds. This could be for the wildlife lawyers. If he released them thousands of non native pheasants without a license could he be ordered by a court to catch them all up and go to a place decided by them or kill the lot all at his own expense. This will be a good case for licensing shoots as this one would never operate again. Well done to all the people who brought him to court, it could have been the shooting people who caught him, someone must have known what he was doing it wasn’t a mistaken shot when out shooting. Or was he just the unlucky one. DEFRA should stop the shoot operating if they can. 

Likely doing it to help protect his investment in the birds and the shoot.

At £50 + VAT per bird, If a single goss takes (or otherwise causes the death of) 1-2 birds a day for the 8 or so weeks that they're in the release pens and a further 2 birds per week when they're turned out that's about 150 birds or about £9k in turnover lost. That's only per one BOP living on the shoot as well.

None of that excuses what he did though.

Personally, I'd much rather invest a further £5-10k in covering the pens with netting and improving the ground for the birds than gaining a criminal conviction. 

I would have thought that his SGC and FAC were immediately revoked never to be granted again. Livelihood lost.

[marsh man]

31 minutes ago, Poor Shot said:

Likely doing it to help protect his investment in the birds and the shoot.

At £50 + VAT per bird, If a single goss takes (or otherwise causes the death of) 1-2 birds a day for the 8 or so weeks that they're in the release pens and a further 2 birds per week when they're turned out that's about 150 birds or about £9k in turnover lost. That's only per one BOP living on the shoot as well.

None of that excuses what he did though.

Personally, I'd much rather invest a further £5-10k in covering the pens with netting and improving the ground for the birds than gaining a criminal conviction. 

I would have thought that his SGC and FAC were immediately revoked never to be granted again. Livelihood lost.

So if the birds were released on land where they shouldn't had been , then I take it that nobody would be allowed to shoot them even if they had the sporting rights ? , or would they have had the sporting rights in the first place on land that was under the Wildlife And Countryside Act and as Pushandpull stated a Special Protection Area ( S P A ) ?

[Gas seal]

Hi birds of prey live in the wild they don’t live on a shoot. I don’t think these people should be called game or poultry keepers. Looking at the cost of the pheasants quoted by poor shot the people who attended the shoots that kill birds of prey should abandon them. Any genuine shooting people shouldn’t go anywhere near these shoots let them keep their sporting rights because they are far from sporting. More of these people will be prosecuted, but the shooting people can stop this happening. Look at the money pheasants and other game cost and the penalties for killing birds of prey. The best penalty is that no one turned out to shoot. The birds should be left alone and for the birds of prey. 

[scolopax]

Just plain dumb. Firstly what he did, and secondly seemed to make to no effort to hide the evidence. The investigators even found shot buzzards around his release pens.  SSS.

[Gas seal]

It could be complacency, I own the land or shooting rights and I can do what I want. I’m sure more cases like this are coming up in the courts. With the price of pheasants we might see the return of man traps. Again well done to the people who caught him.

[Pushandpull]

His phones, firearms, and other equipment have been confiscated and destroyed which is a significant additional penalty.

[Krico woodcock]

Can there be too many birds of prey in one area??, or does nature deal with high numbers? I'm just curious. I remember driving up through Scotland years ago,  and the amount of buzzards was ridiculous. They were on every fence post,  every tree, too my uneducated eyes, seemed like unnatural numbers. 

Edited October 8, 2022 by Krico woodcock

[London Best]

21 minutes ago, Krico woodcock said:

Can there be too many birds of prey in one area??, or does nature deal with high numbers? I'm just curious. I remember driving up through Scotland years ago,  and the amount of buzzards was ridiculous. They were on every fence post,  every tree, too my uneducated eyes, seemed like unnatural numbers. 

There are certainly too many Red Kites where I stalk in the Chilterns. 
They are the commonest bird in the area.

[old'un]

43 minutes ago, London Best said:

There are certainly too many Red Kites where I stalk in the Chilterns. 
They are the commonest bird in the area.

They will tell you its natures balance, numbers go up and down with food supply, what they neglect to add is the unnatural amount of food put out for them.

[Gas seal]

Having his equipment confiscated is the lawful consequences, he will also prohibited from using any general licence. Are there any consequences from the shooting people and any of the field sports. When these criminals are convicted what do people think of the shooting people .The numbers of buzzards and other birds of prey have increased in the country ,nature will have an effect on birds of prey numbers. The numbers of pheasants reported to be released is 50 million. That’s a lot of food for any predators and will mean more will breed. Just look at the old shooting books and what was killed to keep game safe. Marsh man asked did he get off light. I don’t know or really care it’s what the law decide . Its just another stick to use against us,It’s the shoots where this happens get off light. Or just unlucky.

[Rim Fire]

1 hour ago, old'un said:

They will tell you its natures balance, numbers go up and down with food supply, what they neglect to add is the unnatural amount of food put out for them.

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