Diesel Particulate Filters - Can I live with one?

[blowin]

Hello Gents. One for the mechanics/motor enthusiasts.

 

My wife needs a new car to drive our 3 kids and dog around in. Average use is getting the kids to school (5 minutes into the village on country roads twice a day), running various errands (4-6 15-20 minute journeys a week) and then occasional family outings (maybe a couple of 45+ minute journeys a month).

 

We're out in the sticks so these journeys are fairly speedy and uninterrupted.

 

Having test driven a bunch of options, the S-Max Diesel 2.0 is her definite favourite. However, we've been warned that new diesels with particulate filters can be a problem if they don't get out on the motorway regularly.

 

The obvious solution is to buy a petrol but there are very few about so it would mean spending an extra £5k+ and (probably) settling for a slightly under-powered engine.

 

Everything I've read says that modern diesels are not good for 'short journeys and stop start urban driving' - which isn't very helpful when making my decision because that's not what we do BUT as I've outlined, most of our journeys are short and from a cold start.

 

Any advice/opinions welcome. Many thanks.

[Dave-G]

The 45 minute trips should be sufficient to give the system a chance to clear out the particulates OK.

 

If it has a turbo don't drive it like a grandparent, try to be a slightly competitive driver with it.

[Rupert]

You give journeys in minutes can you give miles?

 

Bear in mind additional service cost and fuel being 4p a liter more expensive currently and the premium over petrol models to purchase.

[Westward]

The usual recommendation to get the DPF hot enough to burn the soot down to ash is10 minutes at 2000rpm+ at least once per month. I've never figured out if that has to be all at once or if the 10 mins can be achieved piecemeal - or if cold weather makes any difference. A local garage offers a DPF conditioning service where they hook up a diagnostic to the OBD port and run the engine for an hour at 2500 rpm. You can also find additives on fleaBay to help manage the DPF burn down.

 

I hate stinking, rattling, noisy, harsh sluggish diesels with a passion, always have, but I can't argue with 70mpg and ****** all road tax.

[hawkfanz]

my mate next door had a zafira with said problem was advised to use this cleaning stuff you sqirt in it,,,guess what engine wouldn,t shut down,reved its nuts off and done the cylinder head or the block oil in water then it never ran again went tro scrap yard like that.

[hawkfanz]

in answere to westward my 140bhp deisel is no slowcoach.it happily cruises at 70mph at 2000 rpm and returns 50 mpg all the time i suggest you try out a modern deisel.

[Royboy]

my mate next door had a zafira with said problem was advised to use this cleaning stuff you sqirt in it,,,guess what engine wouldn,t shut down,reved its nuts off and done the cylinder head or the block oil in water then it never ran again went tro scrap yard like that.

Did he squirt it through the intake ?

The dpf cleaner I use is worth and you squirt it into the dpf its self and it's never failed me.

If you squirt anything into intake it's going to rev its nackers off

[TIGHTCHOKE]

I wouldn't buy another deisel car with the new load of regulations on the horizon.

[Rewulf]

Not all modern diesels have DPF s.

The Renault/Nissan 1.5 Dci used in Meganes ,Clios ,Quashqais amongst others doesnt have one,puts out 105-120 BHP ,and with 60+ mpg and very low or no tax,its easy to see why its such a well used engine.

 

For the type of driving you do ,I would definitely not be buying a car with a DPF.

Its alright saying it needs 10 mins at 2000 revs to keep it clean,in practice I would say it needs far more than that.

[Dave-G]

I wouldn't buy another deisel car with the new load of regulations on the horizon.

Where can I read up about that please?

[ben0850]

Best thing to keep your Diesel happy is to avoid supermarket fuel. I've run a Volvo D2 for four years now and it's a cracking motor but one whiff of supermarket diesel and it's like a sack of spanners, like it's missing and eventually limp mode will kick in until the fuel filters changed. Avoid supermarket fuel and chuck a wynns cleaner in now and again.

[bisondan]

My Freelander 2 has a DPF, when I bought the car they advised to give it a good boot for half an hour, once a month.

 

I use it once or twice a week for clay shooting, some journeys will be up to 90 miles each way and on motorways so for me it's easy to give it a bit of tanking every now and then.

 

Someone I work with had a BMW 3-Series and was getting to work and back along back-roads and barely getting above 50, eventually his DPF warning light came on and he had to take it to a rolling road place where they hammered it to try and get it cleared.

[Lord O War]

I would be tempted to go petrol, especially as diesel is the new destroyer of the world so expect road tax etc to go up and for city bans on diesel cars.

[Nmb]

I'm a mechanic and we do get the odd problem with them. I kept an old pre particulate filter mondeo on the road for years until I was confident that they were not going to cost me a fortune!

From my expereince if you have one reasonable length of journey every few weeks and give it some wellie now and again you won't have any problems.

When we have cars in with dpf problems we park them outside and regenerate them via a diagnostic computer. This basically involves the computer revving the hell out of the engine for 40 mins which generally clears them.

[Hendrix's rifle]

Dpfs are shocking. Expensive to replace when they go wrong and servicing the oil is a nightmare. If you can do high milage in one then buy one, if your only doing a few miles a week then I wouldn't bother getting one. I've done a fair few Dpfs now and the worst ones I've seen are the Ford ones. What a nightmare. The worst bit is though because ford are funny with there ecu's they can't be removed and mapped out easily. A lad I know drives his connect approx 100 miles a day delivering and if the drivers change gear when the light comes on (about 2200rpm) it takes a matter of weeks for the light to come.on and go into limp mode. Again, if you can give it a foot full for Atleast half an hour a month then enjoy mpg you get out of it. If not, don't bother. Regens arnt as simple as some have made it out to be (forced regens that is) I know for the early saabs they can be regenerated by holding at 4000rpm for 15 mins or something daft whereas the new audi's need to be driven for 20 mins under maximum load (4th gear with your foot down preferably up a big Hill ) the Nissan 2lt Dpfs are about 1500 quid to replace when they go wrong.... the audi's are more 2 grand...

[HDAV]

Second gear service......... Dual carriageway boot it in second for a few miles regularly and get the exhaust nice and hot and burn it off before it's a problem.

 

Sounds like what you need is a hybrid..... Electric to do the school run and a bit more poke for the longer runs.

 

http://www.motors.co.uk/car-43640887/0/sp

 

2.0 hdi for when you need some poke but electric for the short local trips to the school win win???

Edited December 13, 2016 by HDAV

[figgy]

Just get the exhaust taken off, the top of the dpf cut open remove the dpf and re-weld up,job jobbed. For very little outlay.

[Royboy]

Just get the exhaust taken off, the top of the dpf cut open remove the dpf and re-weld up,job jobbed. For very little outlay.

I was reading a couple of weeks ago that they might be bringing into the MOT a way of testing if the DPF has been removed ? Not sure if it true

[figgy]

I was reading a couple of weeks ago that they might be bringing into the MOT a way of testing if the DPF has been removed ? Not sure if it true

 

Don't see how that is possible as it don't work like a cat. Think the way they are putting more and more expensive bits that done work on diesels trying to clean them up, will make more people go back to petrol cars. When i eventually change my diesel Audi i think it will probably be for a petrol as i dont do the mileage i used to and for the odd long road trip whats another £20 or so in fuel.

[Royboy]

 

Don't see how that is possible as it don't work like a cat. Think the way they are putting more and more expensive bits that done work on diesels trying to clean them up, will make more people go back to petrol cars. When i eventually change my diesel Audi i think it will probably be for a petrol as i dont do the mileage i used to and for the odd long road trip whats another £20 or so in fuel.

I wouldn't have a modern Diesel engine given to me, there nothing but trouble, it was the other way round at one point !

[Rupert]

I was reading a couple of weeks ago that they might be bringing into the MOT a way of testing if the DPF has been removed ? Not sure if it true

Yep, they look for the welds.

[fruity]

Yep, they look for the welds.

On a high percentage of vehicles the dpf cannot been seen to check for welds , the only way would be to remove undertrays etc to view the dpf , which will never happen in mot legislation .

[Royboy]

I'm a tester my self but not sure how it would be checked, maybe they will be able to get a pressure reading somehow ? We shall see anyhow.

God I hate MOT testing ! The most boaring job in the world !

[martyn2233]

Remove it mor failure https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-rules-for-mot-to-test-for-diesel-particulate-filter

[Westward]

in answere to westward my 140bhp deisel is no slowcoach.it happily cruises at 70mph at 2000 rpm and returns 50 mpg all the time i suggest you try out a modern deisel.

My diesel is a modern one. It's a nice car in many ways but it's a diesel and it's still noisy, rattly, smelly, unresponsive, primitive and very rough compared with a modern petrol engine. And it's not easy to do the DPF burn down legally because I have to run at over 70mph to get sufficient revs. If I knew when the stupid thing wanted to do the burn I'd drive it in 4th just to keep the revs up. My next car will be a modern petrol one and I'll be hanging out the flags when the diesel one goes.