d foxxer Posted January 24, 2017 Report Share Posted January 24, 2017 hi all just want to ask the question about pattern testing I shoot sporting clays mainly and I want to pattern test some 28g 7.5 carts what is the ideal distance to shoot at the plate from which in this case would be a 30" circle with a dot in the centre my choke is fixed at 1/4 and 3/8 a fella told me 16 yds I thought it a bit close but would like to hear from people on here your thoughts please cheers foxxer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnphilip Posted January 24, 2017 Report Share Posted January 24, 2017 16 yards will help with gun fit for every inch you are of center of target you alter gun 1/16 of an inch , hence 16 yards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted January 24, 2017 Report Share Posted January 24, 2017 25-30 yards would be my best guess. I am never really sure why people spend time patterning cartridges. You would need to photograph the results of each shell, refresh the pattern plate and then compare all the results, at a later time. How many shells would you need to pattern - 1, 10 25, etc. Unless you are going to do this with every shell you ever buy - and then stick to the optimum - it seems a waste of shells. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted January 24, 2017 Report Share Posted January 24, 2017 I think pattern results can show up interesting and useful information. I would pattern test at 30-40 yards for clays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeShot Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) Here is how I see it. There are close (20 yds-) to far (40 yds+) targets. Using sensible choke (1/4 - 1/2) most modern cartridges will pattern just fine between 25-35 yds. It is at -20yds (some) and at +40yds (more) differences appear. At the end one finds a general cartridge/choke combination that covers either close/mid or mid/far targests and will try to fill the missing void of close or far cartridge. So looking fo "close" carridge I pattern it at 20yds while looking for "far" cartridge I pattern it at 40 yds. Edited January 25, 2017 by FreeShot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 I think pattern results can show up interesting and useful information. I would pattern test at 30-40 yards for clays. This. . As Gordon says though, a pattern plate (steel) can be time consuming. It is much easier if you get a large piece of cardboard and paper targets. Either, tape the board to the plate (this helps prevent pellet bounce) followed by the paper which you simply change after each shot and review it at your leisure later, or, simply use the cardboard as the plate. For practical purposes, 6 shots from a previously fired barrel will suffice but do not be tempted to discard one if it looks exceptionally dense or sparse and take the average. Provided the gun has some choke, it can be handy to draw 2 circles - after you've deduced the pattern centre - one at 20" and the other at the 30 and note the pellet counts in each. The total number will give you the choke that the gun/cartridge is throwing. But I'll bet that the number in the 20" circle is greater than that of the 20 to 30" ring even though the latter has a far greater area. Consequently, whereas the 30 is designed simply for convenience and as a standard for assessing choke performance, it does not mean that it is the effective area as it will be obvious that if you pick a cartridge with your required pellet count in the centre of the pattern which caters for your preferred maximum range, between the 20 and 30" you progressively move into the realms of chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeker Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) I was lend a "pattern gauge" once. It was a 30" wire ring with a 15" inner ring joined with wires @ 10, 2 and 6. Playing with Pythagoras all 4 segments are of equal area . Centre the densest part of the pattern in the inner 15" circle- count holes and see where the fringe of the pattern is densest. Not sure what I learned other than that the upper segment seemed to get more of the outliers that the lower, and that maybe O level maths might have been made more practical with shotgun testing included. And the mystery that if are there fewer holes on the sheet that in the cartridge load where do the others go? And even over the 15" ring the chance factor increases. Edited January 25, 2017 by seeker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 I was lend a "pattern gauge" once. It was a 30" wire ring with a 15" inner ring joined with wires @ 10, 2 and 6. Playing with Pythagoras all 4 segments are of equal area . Centre the densest part of the pattern in the inner 15" circle- count holes and see where the fringe of the pattern is densest. Not sure what I learned other than that the upper segment seemed to get more of the outliers that the lower, and that maybe O level maths might have been made more practical with shotgun testing included. And the mystery that if are there fewer holes on the sheet that in the cartridge load where do the others go? And even over the 15" ring the chance factor increases. Yep, it's simply down to what would be an acceptable degree. For general live quarry use the 20" is probably fair enough, but I could well imagine that a top class trap shooter would be looking hard at the 10" centre core. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 wymberley - perhaps I should have posted what you did - it seems more common-sense than mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 I use a couple of bamboo canes about 6 ft,and some cheap wrapping paper,bigger the better. Tape one end of the paper to one cane,then roll the paper on to the cane,when its nearly rolled up tape the other end to the other cane. Take it to where you want to pattern ,at whatever range, unroll ,stick in the ground and make some clay sized blobs ,using a black marker or aerosol . I tend to pattern at 25 yds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougall Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 30 yards typically.as you have fixed chokes maybe try a couple of different cartridges as these are your only 'variable'. 1/4 & 3/8ths perfect for sporting clays in my view so no prob with current choking.... 16 yards is to see if gun fits/mount ok...try not to aim like a rifle,just mount and fire......obviously if you miles away then further investigation requried! we introduced pattern sheets at our clay club and they are all of a sudden v popular.....problem is everybody thinks their gun shoots the best patterns!! the only clear change folk seem to make is between cartridge companies rather than choke/gunfit etc..and I must confess I think the resulting over analysis does'nt help much..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 Throughout my shooting career I have tried not to think too much about cartridges and patterns. Being short in the grey matter department I just felt that over thinking the issue was bound to cause problems and I have desisted - so far. A month ago I bought a new gun and having fired a few shots at pigeons I was convinced that there must be a bend in the barrels of something approaching a right angle. In order to see where 240 pellets were going I fixed up six A4 pieces of paper on a large stack of bales and measured 40m and fired six shots with my usual cartridges with half choke. The results were alarming. The most pellet strikes counted was nine, the least one. My conclusions? I am going blind, I am over thinking the issue and the bend in the barrels must be more than I originally thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonepark Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 If sporting clays, I would pattern at 40 yards (i.e.) the maximum range (and therefore likely to be the worst pattern). You should be looking for 217 and 228 pellets respectively in 30 inch circle. I use picnic table roll (40 inch wide and pennies per yard when bought bulk) as my recording medium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) You are not really looking at the pattern its more about looking at the lack of pattern. Seeing how many holes there are in there big enough to let a clay (or a bird) through. It is an education and everybody should do it. Lining paper is cheap, keep your results and you can come back to them again. see how the pattern is at various distances but 40yds is the text book range Edited January 25, 2017 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevo Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 Here you go. This was on a proper 30" patten board. But like others have said a nice bit of cardboard or wall paper is fine Gun used. Beretta 692 trap Fixed choke Cartridge 28 grm hull comp X 16 yards bottom barrel gives me an idea of gun fit. https://www.dropbox.com/s/3sjw97ndsgg1bvm/Photo%20Dec%2026%2C%208%2059%2031%20PM%20%281%29.jpg?dl=0 40 yards top barrel gives me an idea of patern at range for ABT Also patern height. Which in this case a nice 60/40 https://www.dropbox.com/s/vlmz4hqsl8ja8go/Photo%20Dec%2026%2C%208%2059%2014%20PM.jpg?dl=0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David.Evans Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 Steve Can you buy tho pattern targets from any where ? Atb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevo Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 Steve Can you buy tho pattern targets from any where ? Atb Yeah I'm sure you can. Not sure where though. I just grab a few from clay grounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d foxxer Posted January 25, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 thankyou gents for your input I work in traffic management and have a big easle type frame the sort yo see big roadwork signs pinned on them which I can use to tack paper on or even a big round sign masked out with road spray paint as it dries rapidly can walk It out my garden into my meadow so ideal for that part I have been using the cheapest carts I can find ie claybusters rio eley first and fiocchi tt1 as I am not a good shot but have improved a bit over the last few months on the once fortnightly shoot I now average 50% which is an improvement from when I first started my worst was 4 out of 60 which was embarrassing after many many years as a rifleman I still find it hard to follow thru the clay sometimes stopping the gun before I let fly and end up shooting behind a lot of them ........so its off to try some patterning for me at least my old new gun seems to fit me better oh and j dog my grey matter is shorter than yours ....trust me lol cheers foxxer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 Years ago, when I was about 18, I worked at Holland and Holland's shooting ground in Northwood Middx. You would be amazed how much time the factory blokes would spend on the pattern plates testing new guns to make sure the barrels were shooting to the same place. I remember well one of the old fellas telling me "NO shotgun shoots both barrels to the same places except by chance and that doesn't happen very often. Quite a lot of barrels were sent back to be re-soldered, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 I pattern at 35yrds because that is about the average I am going to be shooting at birds. I'm looking for a tidy pattern in a thirty inch circle. I have not found it a waste of time as it allowed me to rate different cartridges both pattern and penetration. At the moment I just use paper on a ply back board. Some old wall paper works fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted January 26, 2017 Report Share Posted January 26, 2017 Here you go. This was on a proper 30" patten board. But like others have said a nice bit of cardboard or wall paper is fine Gun used. Beretta 692 trap Fixed choke Cartridge 28 grm hull comp X 16 yards bottom barrel gives me an idea of gun fit. https://www.dropbox.com/s/3sjw97ndsgg1bvm/Photo%20Dec%2026%2C%208%2059%2031%20PM%20%281%29.jpg?dl=0 40 yards top barrel gives me an idea of patern at range for ABT Also patern height. Which in this case a nice 60/40 https://www.dropbox.com/s/vlmz4hqsl8ja8go/Photo%20Dec%2026%2C%208%2059%2014%20PM.jpg?dl=0 Stevo, Simply out of interest were those cartridges fibre or plastic wadded? Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevo Posted January 26, 2017 Report Share Posted January 26, 2017 (edited) Stevo, Simply out of interest were those cartridges fibre or plastic wadded? Cheers wymberley. They where plastic 7.5 Your have to excuse the 40 yrd one. I slightly pulled to the left. It was done at the end of the day after about 150 targets and I was about knackerd. I just wanted to have a look at patterns. Personally I was really happy with them for such a cheepish shell. Edited January 26, 2017 by stevo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted January 26, 2017 Report Share Posted January 26, 2017 wymberley. They where plastic 7.5 Your have to excuse the 40 yrd one. I slightly pulled to the left. It was done at the end of the day after about 150 targets and I was about knackerd. I just wanted to have a look at patterns. Personally I was really happy with them for such a cheepish shell. Many thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnphilip Posted January 26, 2017 Report Share Posted January 26, 2017 Stevo, Simply out of interest were those cartridges fibre or plastic wadded? Cheers Great report and gun looks spot on .thanks for sharing this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d foxxer Posted January 26, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2017 Great report and gun looks spot on .thanks for sharing this my thoughts as well thanks stevo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.