Retsdon Posted October 11, 2018 Report Share Posted October 11, 2018 18 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said: just allowed to crawl away and go back under the stone he deserves to be under. I imagine he'll be living with it for the rest of his life. Or perhaps not maybe. I'd actually think better of him were he to come out and say that he should have done something (anything) to try and seize the initiative from the murderer but that in the moment his resolve or whatever failed him. Of course, we're all human so let's not get too busy piling stones to throw here, but I can't help feeling that his lack of initiative is being compounded by his refusal to admit or acknowledge any kind of mistake. The one was a spur of the moment thing, the other is a calculated defence of a morally indefensible omission and is far worse really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longstrider Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 (edited) I think the photo mock-up says it all... https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/3326831/met-chief-is-mocked-up-with-white-feather-of-cowardice-and-faces-call-to-resign-after-failing-to-go-to-aid-of-murdered-pc-keith-palmer/amp/ P.S. Don't judge me on the source. It was the first linkable copy of it I could find through Google) Edited October 12, 2018 by Longstrider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 (edited) Double post!? Edited October 12, 2018 by panoma1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 21 hours ago, Retsdon said: I’ve got two colleagues with me who are traumatised, so we moved out.’ That's desperate stuff really.What does 'traumatised' (sic) mean here? They were shocked? scared? paralyzed? what? For me, the most damning thing about Mackay isn't that he failed to leap out of the car and tackle the attacker man on man, it's that he was incapable of making a positive decision (even if it was the wrong one) whilst under pressure. Instead he opted for no decison, because being scared and locking the car doors and driving off isn't a decision of any kind at all. As a middle-aged chief constable it's perhaps unreasonable to expect him to fight with his bare hands against a terrorist armed with two knives. But it's certainly not unreasonable to expect him to SHOW SOME INITIATIVE when the proverbial hits the fan. He didn't. He went into mental paralysis and justified it afterwards. In my book that means he's not leadership material and should be sacked. Initiative? I don't know the circumstances but maybe using the car he locked himself into, as a weapon against the murdering *******! Was a possibility? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted October 12, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 One question i have, what was the acting head of the MET doing in a car with no communications equipment. Not that that's a excuse, what were they going to do hit him over the head with a radio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 If he sits down and reads what he has said that in a moment of crisis - he was bothered that his shirt sleeves were too short, he had no radio and the terrorist had given him one of his special "looks" - I hope he hangs his head in shame. He really ought to do so. As for the Met letting him retire, without facing any action - pathetic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 Utterly disgraceful behaviour. Sadly he will, as is usual be allowed to slip away with all of his entitlement still intact? No one other than the little person is ever held account? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebarrels Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 On 08/10/2018 at 21:11, TIGHTCHOKE said: It is also very easy to sit at your computer and ask "what would you do honestly" Honestly I would have gone to his aid! I don't always agree with you TC but I agree with you 100% on this. Watching a colleague die and do nothing,not an option I'm afraid! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walshie Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 I see that awful creature Cressida **** has jumped to his defence. No doubt she would do exactly the same. The thin blue line just got thinner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 14 minutes ago, walshie said: I see that awful creature Cressida **** has jumped to his defence. No doubt she would do exactly the same. The thin blue line just got thinner. Think about it, several high ranking officers have gone public in their support, they have to to reinforce their own positions at the top. A sorry state of affairs, white feathers all round! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 1 hour ago, walshie said: I see that awful creature Cressida **** has jumped to his defence. No doubt she would do exactly the same. The thin blue line just got thinner. Well "he would, wouldn't he" as Mandy Rice-Davies once famously said! Lol! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TriBsa Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 1 hour ago, walshie said: I see that awful creature Cressida **** has jumped to his defence. No doubt she would do exactly the same. The thin blue line just got thinner. No surprise there, most of her utterances seem to be denials in the face of reality. The upper echelons of the PC Police didn't get there by being good coppers, they tow the political line. They have no moral compass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 1 hour ago, walshie said: I see that awful creature Cressida **** has jumped to his defence. No doubt she would do exactly the same. The thin blue line just got thinner. When you are on the 'greasy pole', you need to ensure those around you are firmly anchored to the pole because when the time is right - you use them like a rung on a ladder. People at this level are only interested in the politics (climb the greasy pole - only progress upwards - collect gongs and awards at standard intervals, look out for others you can use to ascend the pole) and economics (i.e. my salary and pension is bigger than yours). There is no interest in 'the public', public opinion, or those working hard around the bottom of the pole. Sadly - it is the same in most organisations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 I liked James Anderton, when he was Chief Constable of GMP. I didn't agree with some of his utterances, but overall he was a top flight Policeman, who was a genuine innovator. I genuinely believe that James Anderton would have got out of the car and led from the front. Sadly, he was too outspoken to get the top job in the Met. They could do with him now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 36 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: When you are on the 'greasy pole', you need to ensure those around you are firmly anchored to the pole because when the time is right - you use them like a rung on a ladder. People at this level are only interested in the politics (climb the greasy pole - only progress upwards - collect gongs and awards at standard intervals, look out for others you can use to ascend the pole) and economics (i.e. my salary and pension is bigger than yours). There is no interest in 'the public', public opinion, or those working hard around the bottom of the pole. Sadly - it is the same in most organisations. Then they are awarded gongs such as an OBE for their "service".........OBE stands for Other Bu55ers Efforts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 2 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: When you are on the 'greasy pole', you need to ensure those around you are firmly anchored to the pole because when the time is right - you use them like a rung on a ladder. People at this level are only interested in the politics (climb the greasy pole - only progress upwards - collect gongs and awards at standard intervals, look out for others you can use to ascend the pole) and economics (i.e. my salary and pension is bigger than yours). There is no interest in 'the public', public opinion, or those working hard around the bottom of the pole. Sadly - it is the same in most organisations. Unfortunately this is how I see it also. They seem to have no idea ( or are indifferent to ) how the public perceive them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotslad Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 3 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: When you are on the 'greasy pole', you need to ensure those around you are firmly anchored to the pole because when the time is right - you use them like a rung on a ladder. People at this level are only interested in the politics (climb the greasy pole - only progress upwards - collect gongs and awards at standard intervals, look out for others you can use to ascend the pole) and economics (i.e. my salary and pension is bigger than yours). There is no interest in 'the public', public opinion, or those working hard around the bottom of the pole. Sadly - it is the same in most organisations. I'd say thats the case in almost all aspects of the civil service/government type jobs, no matter how badly or how often they sccrew up never seem to be sacked, just moved on to the next project and then everyones surprised when its also a 'screw up' I do really feel sorry for 'proper' polis men/women nowadays and probably more so for the older generation who got there experience when polis where still respected and doing the job came before meeting targets and tickking boxes How are met coppers ever meant to trust there bosses again when they have pretty much said sitting in a car watching a collegue get stabbed was the right thingto do? Surely not good for moral? Many beat cops could have the treat of knife attack on a pretty regular basis as well as many other professions (teachers ER staff and bouncers) and the golden rule is always back up ur mates/collegues no matter wot. Ps also how has this been kept so quiet for so long? I take it he has ben attempting to do is job as normal all this time. In this day of social media its quite amazing this story never got out long before now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westward Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 7 hours ago, Gordon R said: I liked James Anderton, when he was Chief Constable of GMP. I didn't agree with some of his utterances, but overall he was a top flight Policeman, who was a genuine innovator. I genuinely believe that James Anderton would have got out of the car and led from the front. Sadly, he was too outspoken to get the top job in the Met. They could do with him now. Anderton started out as a beat constable and worked his way up. A totally different animal from the target driven, box ticking, politically correct pygmies we have running the force these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted October 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 (edited) Good luck the the now head of the MET C ****, another 10 hours ago, walshie said: I see that awful creature Cressida **** has jumped to his defence. No doubt she would do exactly the same. The thin blue line just got thinner. She and other senior officers can defend him all they want. The fact is rank and file officers will have no confidence or respect for him, and the ones now defending him. Edited October 13, 2018 by ordnance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 18 minutes ago, ordnance said: Good luck the the now head of the MET C ****, another She and other senior officers can defend him all they want. The fact is rank and file officers will have confidence or respect for him, and the ones now defending him. I suspect that rank and file coppers will stick the knife in to certain high ranking senior officers............because they know how most of them got their jobs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted October 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 8 minutes ago, panoma1 said: I suspect that rank and file coppers will stick the knife in to certain high ranking senior officers............because they know how most of them got their jobs! The senior officers will be backing him in public, and stabling him in the back behind closed doors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
100milesaway Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 On 09/10/2018 at 20:24, Gordon R said: Having done some more reading and studying the diagram - charting the movements / events, I am even more appalled that he left. No thought of sounding the horn - even if to momentarily startle the killer, no attempt to run him over, knock him off his feet, open a window and shout. He was in his shirt sleeves - no radio (presumably no phone either), two traumatised colleagues to think about. No - a PC said he ought to leave and he readily accepted the advice. Pedal to the metal - safety beckons. Whilst those who are in the Police or retired will have a better grip of the situation, I have seen very little support for his actions - most Police seem to think it was dereliction of duty. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
100milesaway Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 How about Mr White feather handing over his unearned pension to the dead officers wife and family...... That should even things up a bit.. There was nothing to stop him ordering his driver to run the terrorist over he didn't need to leave his nice warm car.. There is not one beat bobby that could look up to this cowardly person..He should be publically be stripped of all his accolades and his pension. from Auntie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted October 15, 2018 Report Share Posted October 15, 2018 On 13/10/2018 at 19:40, Westward said: Anderton started out as a beat constable and worked his way up. A totally different animal from the target driven, box ticking, politically correct pygmies we have running the force these days. The system only lets the genuine, effective and conscientious rise so far as the real politico elite are then worried that their world is under threat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted October 15, 2018 Report Share Posted October 15, 2018 9 minutes ago, old man said: The system only lets the genuine, effective and conscientious rise so far as the real politico elite are then worried that their world is under threat? I fear this is true in all public service employment!.....donkeys leading lions comes to mind! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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