410 2 3/4 or 3 inch

[captainhastings]

Thinking of getting a 410 and there is a cheapy one going for 50 quid. Is it a deal breaker as I expect it not to be 3 inch chamber. Bolt action I be leave. Just for squirrels and maybe the odd pigeon

[enfieldspares]

AFAIK there's only three choices in .410"? These are 2", 2 1/2" and 3". My advice? Future proof your gun by buying a 3". After all until needs must there's nothing to stop you using 2 1/2" cartridges in it other than giving it a good clean after use. 

[eddoakley]

3" cartridges are more commonly available but 2 1/2 are not exactly difficult to find.

If it's just for a bit of fun and you don't mind (the £50) if you don't use it then I wouldn't worry, just buy it.

 

Edd

[Ultrastu]

The 2.5 inch carts are generally useless.

Imo .if you buy it .it will probably stay in the cabinet taking up space and then after a while you will come to the conclusion that .410 is useless and want to sell it to make space .like the previous owner .BUT - if you buy a decent 3 inch chambered gun you may just really enjoy it and love it and become a .410 fan like walker myself amd others on this forum .realising what a great little gun a .410 can be and earning its place in your cabinet .

I wont be selling mine for a long time its a real keeper .and id happily loose all my other shottys of bigger cals before i lost my single shot .410 .

Get your choice right first time .

 

[captainhastings]

Cheers folks make sense

[Walker570]

Only thing I would add is save your £50 and look for a good 3 inch chambered gun, you then have the versatility. I shoot a Mossy moderated pumper and feed it everyhting from some seriously old 2 inch stuff for sorting tree rats in live catch cages to 3inch Fiocchi 6s for pigeons/crows over decoys.  My game gun is a Yilditz o/u and both are kepers.

[Ultrastu]

A 3 inch cart can carry around 19 grms which is a fair payload .more than enough for nicely decoying pigeons .i also use 16 grm of no6 and these work very nicely on a passing pigeon at 30 yds having a cheeky look at your pattern .but i wouldnt go below 16 grm as your getting to little shot for effective kills imo .

[Wingman]

But the cartridges cost an arm and a leg!

[Ultrastu]

Not really .

[bruno22rf]

If you're going to stuff 3" cartridges in the little thing all the time you might as well buy a 28G.

[enfieldspares]

10 hours ago, Ultrastu said:

Imo .if you buy it .it will probably stay in the cabinet taking up space and then after a while you will come to the conclusion that .410 is useless and want to sell it to make space .like the previous owner

The nub of it. What he says +1. It is that the variety of 3" cartridges gives far more versatility AND ABILITY to the gun. That's because even if it does not have a moderator fitted most subsonic cartridges are nowadays in 3" length cases. And even with no moderator they can offer some advantages one of which may be that as they are at a lower velocity they shoot a tighter pattern. As in 12 bore was the rationale behind so called wildfowlers' "low pressure/low velocity" loads of way back when. I found this on the internet. Oh and before I've even seen the video I predict that the crimp closure cartridges will perform best. Avoid whether 2" or 2 1/2" or 3" cartridges with the old fashioned roll turnover and overshot wad if you can.

 

Edited March 6, 2020 by enfieldspares

[theshootist]

I've done quite well with the 2.5" 14g Lyvale Express cartridges but I would agree that a 3" chamber is the way to go, unless the gun is very special. 

[Bobba]

Does anyone know please whether the chamber of the Webley and Scott 410 bolt action has the same chamber size across all like models or was there a choice? I ask because there's one unused in my cabinet and I know zero about it's specifications.. I picked it up some years back £40 in the hope that my grandson may be interested. Sadly not.

[Ultrastu]

18 minutes ago, bruno22rf said:

If you're going to stuff 3" cartridges in the little thing all the time you might as well buy a 28G.

Thats just silly .

 

 

[Farmboy91]

31 minutes ago, Bobba said:

Does anyone know please whether the chamber of the Webley and Scott 410 bolt action has the same chamber size across all like models or was there a choice? I ask because there's one unused in my cabinet and I know zero about it's specifications.. I picked it up some years back £40 in the hope that my grandson may be interested. Sadly not.

The sportsman came as a 3" 2 +1. As far as I know the other models were 2.5".

[lancer425]

8 minutes ago, Farmboy91 said:

The sportsman came as a 3" 2 +1. As far as I know the other models were 2.5".

When i was a kid, there was a old chap was a WW2 commando  used to be on a little shoot round here, he used to use a webley .410 bolt action repeater, think that must have been the sportsman mentioned above. He was amazing with that little thing walking up partridges, he could rattle off all three in no time. Which for a Bolt action shotgun was a surprise to everybody.

[Farmboy91]

41 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

When i was a kid, there was a old chap was a WW2 commando  used to be on a little shoot round here, he used to use a webley .410 bolt action repeater, think that must have been the sportsman mentioned above. He was amazing with that little thing walking up partridges, he could rattle off all three in no time. Which for a Bolt action shotgun was a surprise to everybody.

I would like one myself but when I was looking they were all stupid money so I ended up with the Belgian folder instead. 

I'd like to have seen that, reminds me of the old Lee Enfield minute 😂 

If now I went for a .410 it would be a 3" O/U just for th versatility.

[lancer425]

9 minutes ago, Farmboy91 said:

I would like one myself but when I was looking they were all stupid money so I ended up with the Belgian folder instead. 

I'd like to have seen that, reminds me of the old Lee Enfield minute 😂 

If now I went for a .410 it would be a 3" O/U just for th versatility.

Only ever had four .410s in my whole life. A bolt action webley had it as a youngster used eley fourlong 4s in it all the time never hit anything flying with it ever. About 15 i had a stevens single hammer2.5 inch . Sold that 80s for a el chimbo double 3 inch. that malfunctioned a spring broke i think , be 86 ish i chopped it in on another gun took a loss.  And about early 90s i got my current spanish single hammer 3 inch  just like a non folding thing, i shoot it well and why i hung on to it its full choke 28 inch barrel. very plain colour hardened action and not a lot else.

[Farmboy91]

2 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

Only ever had four .410s in my whole life. A bolt action webley had it as a youngster used eley fourlong 4s in it all the time never hit anything flying with it ever. About 15 i had a stevens single hammer2.5 inch . Sold that 80s for a el chimbo double 3 inch. that malfunctioned a spring broke i think , be 86 ish i chopped it in on another gun took a loss.  And about early 90s i got my current spanish single hammer 3 inch  just like a non folding thing, i shoot it well and why i hung on to it its full choke 28 inch barrel. very plain colour hardened action and not a lot else.

Yeah don't get time wrong I've found even my 2.5 extremely handy I've the last 8/9 months when I have been able to shoot my 12, been using 14 Eley trap and they work well out to 20-25 yards.

I would like an O/U at some point but it doesn't look like it's going to be viable now.

[243deer]

I use more 2" cartridges than any other size - for ratting and feral control in barns they are ideal plus a 3" chambered mosberg moderated .410 pump can carry one 3" in the chamber and 2 3" cartridges in the tube - you do the maths for how many 2" cartridges it will take.

I use 3" subsonics for humane dispatch

[Farmboy91]

30 minutes ago, 243deer said:

I use more 2" cartridges than any other size - for ratting and feral control in barns they are ideal plus a 3" chambered mosberg moderated .410 pump can carry one 3" in the chamber and 2 3" cartridges in the tube - you do the maths for how many 2" cartridges it will take.

I use 3" subsonics for humane dispatch

I think that's along the same lines as the 12b 3.5" pumps. Licensing know they will hold more than 2 in the mag if your using 2.5" carts, but its only illegal/ section 1 if you actually put them in it.

Wouldn't risk it personally though.

Edited March 6, 2020 by Farmboy91

[Centrepin]

My grandson uses 2" cartridges for statics and the odd easy clay. My daughter 2 1/2" for Clay's and I've just started using 3" for pigeon and magpies. All through same gun, all work fine. 

[bruno22rf]

"Silly"? Stu, Do explain. Why buy a small gauge gun then have to use Magnum cartridges to deliver a decent payload - the 28G throws 19gms (your average .410 3" load) with ease as well as producing a far better pattern.

[enfieldspares]

Quote

"Silly"? Stu, Do explain. Why buy a small gauge gun then have to use Magnum cartridges to deliver a decent payload - the 28G throws 19gms (your average .410 3" load) with ease as well as producing a far better pattern.

A secondhand .410" is less expensive to buy, much much less expense, usually comes in a style such as single barrel, or moderated, or folding that a 28 bore doesn't and finally usually weighs less. That's three reasons. A used .410" in either side by side or O/U is hugely less expensive than a similar specification used 28 bore. And finally most gunshops will have .410" on the shelf (even if notn the exact "recipe" you'd prefer) many many won't ever have 28 bore as it is effectively dead stock and tied up capital.

[Farmboy91]

10 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:

A secondhand .410" is less expensive to buy, much much less expense, usually comes in a style such as single barrel, or moderated, or folding that a 28 bore doesn't and finally usually weighs less. That's three reasons. A used .410" in either side by side or O/U is hugely less expensive than a similar specification used 28 bore. And finally most gunshops will have .410" on the shelf (even if notn the exact "recipe" you'd prefer) many many won't ever have 28 bore as it is effectively dead stock and tied up capital.

To be honest when I was looking a while back, specifically at o/u's there was all of about £50 difference in prices between the two at the cheaper end of the scale.

Have to agree with @bruno22rfGiven the choice between the two if your looking at magnum loads surely it's no different to the 12/20 bore. 

Cartridges are on the expensive side no matter which one you shoot?

I'd really like an o/u .410 and as I posted above if I had one it would be a 3" but I think a 28b would probably be a better buy.

Edited March 6, 2020 by Farmboy91