Urban foxes

[NatureBoy]

3 hours ago, Bobba said:

Help me with this one please. I know that under Schedule 9 of the CWA it is illegal to catch and release grey squirrels because they are not an indigenous specie. But foxes are. And I've always believed that catching and releasing foxes as an indigenous was legal. So, where is it stated that doing so is illegal? Reference to appropriate legislation would underpin your statement. Thanks.

It's illegal under the CWA to deliberately cause distress and suffering to any animal. Releasing urban foxes into an alien environment often occupied by resident foxes  does this. With poor hunting, survival instincts they don't last long. Killed/injured by local foxes, badgers, dogs, starve or shot when they become a problem. RSPCA say same and it's not them doing it. One time they even put up a reward of £1000.00 for info on anyone doing it. Pest controllers in north London were charging £3k per fox for live capture and removal. Richard Negus done a investigative artical on it in shooting times a little while back. We have had them with limbs and bits missing. Neutered dogs, signs of being shaved and opp scars. Mange and  patches where they have been treated for mange. Often out break in mange in local population and sometimes domestic dogs when dumping takes place.

Why you ask Bobba? Any info thoughts on it or knowledge of who may be doing it? They clearly have very little knowledge of wildlife or care about the balance of rural environment or the foxes once released.      NB 

 

[walshie]

There is no specific legislation to say trapped foxes can't be released. I suppose it could be argued that relocating them causes distress or suffering, but I doubt that could ever be proven, as "distress or suffering" is subjective and in this case, definitely not deliberate.

I've shot many foxes myself that have had medical treatment from operations to broken bones, so someone has paid for the treatment and released them. Whether it's an animal welfare group or the RSPCA (even though they say they don't do it) they are killing them with supposed kindness. Released foxes don't last long.

With regards to shooting them in your garden, I shot at least 50 in my back garden in the last year I lived in London, either in a cage trap or from the bedroom window. 

[Vince Green]

It is totally legal to release foxes. In many ways the only way to deal with it. Thats what all the pest controllers I know do with them.. They only take them a couple of miles up the road 

Fire a gun in a built up area such as london at your peril. Your choice, I have no interest if you do or you don't but I wouldn't risk it,

Edited August 3, 2020 by Vince Green

[washerboy]

I've taken foxes alive, it would cause stress to the animal taking it out if a trap to dispatch it but It can be done. 

Could you not use a bolt gun? 

[Townie]

Had a quick look at cage traps and hushpower .410s and I was surprised how expensive. The paving slabs seem to have dealt with them digging up the cat, so I may just stick with the pile of stones by the back door that I use to throw at them. 

[Bobba]

10 hours ago, NatureBoy said:

Why you ask Bobba? Any info thoughts on it or knowledge of who may be doing it? They clearly have very little knowledge of wildlife or care about the balance of rural environment or the foxes once released.      NB 

Hi NB. Thanks for your reply.  My interest stems from a discussion with a mate who shot a mangy one scrounging around a farmyard. We concluded that it wasn't illegal. So, when you said it was I was confused. Hence my post.

I note your interpretation of the CWA. However, I share Walshie's view. And, had the Government been able to rely on legislation then their Guidance Note would no doubt have referred to it. I'm reassured by the comments of others that my original thoughts were on the right lines ie it's legal. Not that I intend to catch and release.

[southeastpete]

12 hours ago, Spr1985 said:

Oh my apologies,  Shall I assume that you didn’t read the sub heading  “you must:” which at point three clearly states “humanely kill any fox you catch whilst it’s in the trap or snare”  it is quite clear to me that if you capture a fox in a trap or Snare that you must humanely despatch it 🤷‍♂️

Ah, well the bits I was referring to weren’t under that heading. But I read it more as if you are going to kill it in the trap or snare, it must be done humanely...

[Spr1985]

5 hours ago, southeastpete said:

Ah, well the bits I was referring to weren’t under that heading. But I read it more as if you are going to kill it in the trap or snare, it must be done humanely...

Fair play after having re read it and the point that was made further up about it being titled “guidance” I can see it from both point of view 👍🏻

[Vince Green]

On 03/08/2020 at 18:48, Bobba said:

Help me with this one please. I know that under Schedule 9 of the CWA it is illegal to catch and release grey squirrels because they are not an indigenous specie. But foxes are. And I've always believed that catching and releasing foxes as an indigenous was legal. So, where is it stated that doing so is illegal? Reference to appropriate legislation would underpin your statement. Thanks.

All the pest controllers round here, including the council ones release the foxes they catch. They advertise it as humane, its a big selling point. If you want to get a council contract the councils usually insist on humane. Very few pest controllers are interested in foxes, its too time consuming compared with the money they can make from rodent infestation. They can make hundreds of pounds a day from rodents with little effort, the rodents kill themselves 

Anyway, it would be difficult for a pest controller to legally kill a fox and expensive to dispose of the carcass. Three miles up the road and job done

If you are going to put them in the back of your vehicle put something like a good plastic sheet down first, they stink

Edited August 4, 2020 by Vince Green

[WalkedUp]

An old boy I knew when I was at school with his son used to claim to trap them in urban areas and then drive them to the middle of open pasture and course his two dogs on them one-by-one. Almost certainly illegal and he said it stank but nonetheless he seemed to love it. The dogs were GWPs not lurchers which always surprised me. I’m sure it would be exciting but I am slightly repulsed by the thought of such a protracted death, in my opinion a trapped animal should be dispatched quickly and efficiently to cause minimum distress. I am very pro fox hunting but it is about the hunt not the baiting. 

[NatureBoy]

Some interesting comments! RSPCA will say it illegal hence they offered reward for info! Weather or not it is! I find it bizarre that some folk involved in shooting and pest control think it ok to catch up urban foxes and dump in them in the countryside. Not only just making them someone elses problem they have little regard for there welfare. Causing havoc on shoots and the balance of local wildlife. Just more work/pest control for us that have to deal with them. Not On! If you think dumping them 2 miles up the road works you are wrong and know or care little about foxes. They probably home before you are! A fox will travel many miles in a night.         NB    

[Fisheruk]

Dump 3 miles up the road is just stupid, a fox will travel 10 times that distance back home. If you have a problem don’t pass it on. If you don’t want to dispatch it yourself ask for someone on here  to help you. I’m sure that you will find someone. If I were local to you I certainly would.

[Walker570]

On 03/08/2020 at 19:05, AVB said:

I saw a TV documentary once about a pest controller. He was shooting loads of urban foxes in peoples’ gardens.  Silenced .22 (I assume) and you didn’t hear a thing. 

Done it quietly many times from upstairs windows to bait. A couple in very small gardens.  It needs a bit of long term planning with baiting and obviously great care with the shot.

The live catch cage is also good but be careful if you dispose with a 22RF as they have a reputation for bouncing, so set the cage on some soft ground with a safe background.

[Vince Green]

3 hours ago, Fisheruk said:

Dump 3 miles up the road is just stupid, a fox will travel 10 times that distance back home. If you have a problem don’t pass it on. If you don’t want to dispatch it yourself ask for someone on here  to help you. I’m sure that you will find someone. If I were local to you I certainly would.

I'm more than capable of dispatching a fox but a commercial pest controller is not. He's just a man in a van, his need is just to get rid of the thing as quickly as possible. Foxes are not homing pigeons, three miles up the road in the back of a van and they don't come back.

In urban areas another one will soon take their place

[NatureBoy]

He is NOT a pest CONTROLLER if he is dumping urban foxes. His ignorance is simply making them someone else long term control problem for his quick gain!  Causing havoc and spreading disease in the countryside. Stress and suffering to the fox.  As Fisheruk says i would rather dispatch for them than  they releasing. Shouldn't be hard to sort . . . . How do you know they don't come back? Do you tag or ear mark them? Three miles is nothing to a fox. Would have no trouble finding way back, just like dogs and cats can. . . . Dispatch yes!  But releasing needs to stop!         

[blackbird]

On 03/08/2020 at 12:18, Townie said:

We have a couple of very bold urban foxes that I suspect are being fed. One was about to walk into our house before I chased it off recently. Final straw last night when they very nearly resurrected our poor old cat who was buried a couple of weeks ago. I've since covered the spot with a few paving slabs we had around.  

My ideal solution would be lead based, but that's not practical as we live in an urban area.

Any ideas to persuade them that they're not welcome?

Solution, 

problem no1 = fox nearly walked in to your house  answer = keep doors shut.

problem no2 = fox digs up dead cat. answer = dig a deeper hole in the first place or cover area with as you did with slabs or chicken wire.

 Outcome = no need to shoot the foxes as you live in urban area  only takes one person to phone the police & you WILL get the armed response knocking your door = you don’t loose your ticket. 👍
 

Your problem is the idiots that are feeding the foxes. 

Edited August 6, 2020 by blackbird

[bumpy22]

1 hour ago, blackbird said:

Solution, 

problem no1 = fox nearly walked in to your house  answer = keep doors shut.

problem no2 = fox digs up dead cat. answer = dig a deeper hole in the first place or cover area with as you did with slabs or chicken wire.

 Outcome = no need to shoot the foxes as you live in urban area  only takes one person to phone the police = you don’t loose your ticket. 👍
 

Your problem is the idiots that are feeding the foxes. 

Most sensible answer 

[Townie]

Ha ha, yes! Thank you Blackbird, quite right. That's what we've done, but I was out for revenge and chucking stones at them doesn't really do it for me!