U.k held to ransome

[AVB]

20 minutes ago, Mr_Nobody said:

Because we pay France £110 million p/a to stop them?

 

I thought that was for managing the camps at Sangate and elsewhere. If I was France and I came across somebody wanting to leave I wouldn’t stop them. If the boot was on the other foot we wouldn’t be clambering to keep them here would we. 

[Gordon R]

Either we make a serious attempt to stop the influx or we will be swamped, with even more criminals than we already have. You can't sustain the level of criminality we are currently absorbing.

Edited August 12, 2020 by Gordon R

[Vince Green]

1 hour ago, AVB said:

.The only solution is to process their asylum claim quickly and then deport them back to, I assume, France. But then Human Rights lawyers become involved and it becomes lengthy. 

We can't deport them back to France because France have been careful not to document them. If they document them they have to keep them

1 hour ago, AVB said:

I thought that was for managing the camps at Sangate and elsewhere. If I was France and I came across somebody wanting to leave I wouldn’t stop them. If the boot was on the other foot we wouldn’t be clambering to keep them here would we. 

The French did not manage the camp at Sangat, the Red Cross did

Edited August 12, 2020 by Vince Green

[12gauge82]

The solution seems simple, change the law, if their seen coming from France, drop them straight back, make the UK a undesirable location and if all else fails, give them an overseas island, we've got plenty dotted about, only once someone is proved beyond reasonable doubt to be a genuine refugee should they be allowed to remain on UK mainland. That would be problem solved, all that stands in the way, are politicians unwilling to do it.

[norfolk dumpling]

Apparently we have agreed to a further £30m! And I understand - see my earlier post - unaccompanied under 18s are our responsibility and we support them until they are 25. Under 16s are fostered -at huge expense - so the £30m is a good deal if the Frogs 'stem the tide'

Edited August 12, 2020 by norfolk dumpling

[TIGHTCHOKE]

1 minute ago, norfolk dumpling said:

Apparently we have agreed to a further £30m! And I understand - see my earlier post - unaccompanied under 18s are our responsibility and we support them until they are 25. Under 16s are fostered -at huge expense - so the £30m is a good deal if the Frogs 'stem the tide'

Don't hold your breath!

[NoBodyImportant]

You guys are lucky to have a channel as a barrier.  Plus several nice countries to settle in before you even get to the channel.  

[Fuddster]

I don't mind taking our share of genuine refugees-families,lone kids etc but every dingy I see being unloaded seems to contain only males in late teens through to 20 plus?

One of our local 4 star hotels is currently housing a lot of men in this age range. 

I'm surprised BJ hasn't got a bit more vocal of gripping this one.

f.

 

[Taileron]

On 10/08/2020 at 08:24, hodge911 said:

All this and how many uk soldiers who put their lives on the line (many losing their life leaving loved ones )are living in cardboard boxes under bridges ect can't get a penny in help .

Because the UK military is totally undervalued, and contrary to popular belief not a huge amount of the UK population actually give a T*** about service men/women. I can say that in all honesty as I have just turned over 30+ years in the service. The situation with the Afghan terps is utterly shameful, I worked daily with them and they were putting Their country first, not ours, yes they were paid, but the risks they took (and are still taking) were and are huge.

My Sqn did 13 years continual duty in Afghan alone, that’s the same people either on Ops back from Ops or prepping from Ops, for 13 years. The broken people/families/loss of life I saw in that time. The reward we received ( not that we ever wanted one ) terrible pay, station closed down and redundancy. Many people think we are paid well ( compare like for like ranks with the USAF ) the same people think we get a “gold plated pension”....that went in 2015 and married quarters are free, nope that’s not true either.

I know several people with severe mental health problems who served and were just booted out the door when they began struggling.

Im jumping ship soon as my loyalties have been tested to and beyond my limits.

 

Feel better now😂

 

[Vince Green]

23 minutes ago, Taileron said:

Because the UK military is totally undervalued, and contrary to popular belief not a huge amount of the UK population actually give a T*** about service men/women. I can say that in all honesty as I have just turned over 30+ years in the service. The situation with the Afghan terps is utterly shameful, I worked daily with them and they were putting Their country first, not ours, yes they were paid, but the risks they took (and are still taking) were and are huge.

My Sqn did 13 years continual duty in Afghan alone, that’s the same people either on Ops back from Ops or prepping from Ops, for 13 years. The broken people/families/loss of life I saw in that time. The reward we received ( not that we ever wanted one ) terrible pay, station closed down and redundancy. Many people think we are paid well ( compare like for like ranks with the USAF ) the same people think we get a “gold plated pension”....that went in 2015 and married quarters are free, nope that’s not true either.

I know several people with severe mental health problems who served and were just booted out the door when they began struggling.

Im jumping ship soon as my loyalties have been tested to and beyond my limits.

 

Feel better now😂

 

I know exactly what you mean. When my mate left the army he was sent on a two week welding course.

My friend in USA, his son joined the US Navy as an unqualified 17 year old. He came out with a degree in Aeronautic Engineering and all his papers qualifying him to work on civilian Boeing passenger jets..

The last two years of his service was spent doing crossover training with Boeing. He was not unusual

Edited August 13, 2020 by Vince Green

[Vince Green]

On 12/08/2020 at 15:38, AVB said:

I don’t see why it is France’s problem to stop them leaving. It is our problem to stop them crossing our border but that becomes difficult when they are in a boat and once in British waters we have an obligation to help any vessel in distress, which they would inevitably claim to be. 
 

The only solution is to process their asylum claim quickly and then deport them back to, I assume, France. But then Human Rights lawyers become involved and it becomes lengthy. 

But why doesn't France just grab them and turn them around? Why doesn't Germany? Why doesn't Italy? or Spain or Portugal? or Greece? Hungary tried to build a fence and got called every name under the sun.

This is is where the EU is a firkin joke. Unified, consistent and tough measures at the point of entry are what's required. If every country  patrolled the Med and turned all the boats back to north africa every day it would be job done.

And it would be a lot easier because (together) we could intimidate the North African countries into taking them back. It may not be ethical but when you are some of the biggest economies in the world you have to flex your muscles 

It shouldn't be our job to protect the channel from France's failure to address its problem

Edited August 13, 2020 by Vince Green

[oowee]

48 minutes ago, Vince Green said:

But why doesn't France just grab them and turn them around? Why doesn't Germany? Why doesn't Italy? or Spain or Portugal? or Greece? Hungary tried to build a fence and got called every name under the sun.

This is is where the EU is a firkin joke. Unified, consistent and tough measures at the point of entry are what's required. If every country  patrolled the Med and turned all the boats back to north africa every day it would be job done.

And it would be a lot easier because (together) we could intimidate the North African countries into taking them back. It may not be ethical but when you are some of the biggest economies in the world you have to flex your muscles 

It shouldn't be our job to protect the channel from France's failure to address its problem

😶

On 12/08/2020 at 11:27, Scully said:

I heard a former refugee on the radio yesterday, who now works as an interpreter for immigrants, who claimed that many are fleeing war/civil unrest/persecution etc, and that’s fine and understandable, but why do they insist on coming to England ( don’t bother I know the answer ) when policy dictates they seek refuge in the first safe country they enter.

Perhaps if we could find a way of returning them to France, France may try a bit harder to prevent them getting into THEIR country. 

Who's policy? They simply don't have to claim at and they don't.

[Scully]

7 hours ago, oowee said:

😶

Who's policy? They simply don't have to claim at and they don't.

I have no idea, I thought asylum was supposed to be sought in the first safe country they found. 
I don’t really care about people coming here if they do it legally, but illegal entrants should be returned ASAP. 

[Vince Green]

9 hours ago, oowee said:

😶

Who's policy? They simply don't have to claim at and they don't.

Asylum shopping is the practice by asylum seekers of applying for asylum in several states or seeking to apply in a particular state after transiting other states. The phrase is used mostly^{[dubious – discuss]} in the context of the European Union and the Schengen Area, but has been used by the Federal Court of Canada.^[1]

One of the objectives of Police and Judicial Co-operation in Criminal Matters is to prevent asylum shopping.^[2] The Dublin Convention stipulates that asylum seekers are returned to the country where their entry into the union was first recorded and where they were first fingerprinted. Another objective of this policy is to prevent asylum seekers in orbit, i.e., to prevent the continual transfer of asylum seekers between countries trying to get others to accept them.^[3]

To avoid abuses, European law, the Dublin Regulation, requires that asylum seekers have their asylum claim registered in the first country they arrive in,^[4] and that the decision of the first EU country they apply in, is the final decision in all EU countries. However, among some asylum seekers, the fingerprinting and registration is vehemently resisted in countries that are not considered asylum-seeker friendly, as they often wish to apply for asylum in Germany and Sweden where benefits are more generous.^[5]

Some asylum seekers report burning their fingers so they can evade the fingerprint record control in Italy and apply for asylum in a country of their choice.^[6] The fingerprint record, known as the Eurodac system, is used to intercept false or multiple asylum claims.^[7] In Ireland, two-thirds of failed asylum seekers were found to be already known to the British border authorities, a third of the time under a different nationality, such as Tanzanians claiming to be fleeing persecution in Somalia.^[8]

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, did you hear what Macron stated now we have put France on the list of countries any one returning from is to self isolate ? 

[Vince Green]

3 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, did you hear what Macron stated now we have put France on the list of countries any one returning from is to self isolate ? 

No what did he say?

[oldypigeonpopper]

5 minutes ago, Vince Green said:

No what did he say?

Hello, he threatens reciprocal measures what ever that means, we don't get many French on holiday in uk, oh only illegal immigrants 🤔

[bwana]

On 12/08/2020 at 17:41, 12gauge82 said:

The solution seems simple, change the law, if their seen coming from France, drop them straight back, make the UK a undesirable location and if all else fails, give them an overseas island, we've got plenty dotted about, only once someone is proved beyond reasonable doubt to be a genuine refugee should they be allowed to remain on UK mainland. That would be problem solved, all that stands in the way, are politicians unwilling to do it.

Rockall springs to mind.

[12gauge82]

11 hours ago, bwana said:

Rockall springs to mind.

While that would certainly deter them I don't think it's big enough 🤣