Defra propose gamebird releasing licence around protected sites

[greylag]

Wild Justice have done a good job on us by grabbing headlines in the press.Packham is expert at doing this as he has access to the press.Reading the news sheets you would think they have had all games shooting stopped.This is where the organisations fall down,they must get our side of the argument into the mainline press not just local publications.

Lol lolWild Justice have done a good job on us by grabbing headlines in the press.Packham is expert at doing this as he has access to the press.Reading the news sheets you would think they have had all games shooting stopped.This is where the organisations fall down,they must get our side of the argument into the mainline press not just local publications.

Lol lolWild Justice have done a good job on us by grabbing headlines in the press.Packham is expert at doing this as he has access to the press.Reading the news sheets you would think they have had all games shooting stopped.This is where the organisations fall down,they must get our side of the argument into the mainline press not just local publications..

Sorry about posting three times ,fat fingers.

[Fellside]

JohnfromtheUK, I feel your pain and frustration and wish you all the luck in the world. 
 

The main problem with your case - and all of this - is the lack of public awareness about the massive wildlife benefits which shooting secures. We all know this but the general public, in the main, do not. Bureaucrats are members of the public and often lack any real countryside management depth. 

[JohnfromUK]

19 minutes ago, Fellside said:

JohnfromtheUK, I feel your pain and frustration and wish you all the luck in the world. 
 

The main problem with your case - and all of this - is the lack of public awareness about the massive wildlife benefits which shooting secures. We all know this but the general public, in the main, do not. Bureaucrats are members of the public and often lack any real countryside management depth. 

Firstly, thank you!

I agree on your point.  My 'rant' is really more the frustrations from multiple bureaucracy that is taking over my life!  Part of living in the country and owning your own place should enable you to enjoy it how you like (within reason of course).

Breakfast this morning was interrupted (after the pheasant release needing licensing bombshell) by water cascading down the wall - leaves blocking gutter.  It was cleaned out on Tuesday, but living under a sycamore - which I would like to take down - gutters can get blocked in days.  I have been refused permission (I live in a conservation area, so need permission to do any work on larger trees).  Elsewhere on my property (the SAC part actually), I have had a  different government body (Natural England) trying to get me to fell sycamores as they are non native and can dominate as they are fast growers and suppress the slower growing native species.  Access is difficult (steep and among other trees) and therefore costly - but that is of course my problem, not theirs.

I would like to have fitted larger more free flowing gutters - but I have what I have because the house is listed - and I have to have the same style of gutter (I do already have the maximum flow capacity of this type).  Various covers/leaf protections have been tried, but the sycamore's combination of seeds and leaves is a difficult one to resolve.

It has been one of those days when the interfering fingers of bureaucracy have been particularly irritating - however I am going too far off topic for this thread, so I will shut up!

Edited October 31, 2020 by JohnfromUK

[greylag]

28 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

Firstly, thank you!

I agree on your point.  My 'rant' is really more the frustrations from multiple bureaucracy that is taking over my life!  Part of living in the country and owning your own place should enable you to enjoy it how you like (within reason of course).

Breakfast this morning was interrupted (after the pheasant release needing licensing bombshell) by water cascading down the wall - leaves blocking gutter.  It was cleaned out on Tuesday, but living under a sycamore - which I would like to take down - gutters can get blocked in days.  I have been refused permission (I live in a conservation area, so need permission to do any work on larger trees).  Elsewhere on my property (the SAC part actually), I have had a  different government body (Natural England) trying to get me to fell sycamores as they are non native and can dominate as they are fast growers and suppress the slower growing native species.  Access is difficult (steep and among other trees) and therefore costly - but that is of course my problem, not theirs.

I would like to have fitted larger more free flowing gutters - but I have what I have because the house is listed - and I have to have the same style of gutter (I do already have the maximum flow capacity of this type).  Various covers/leaf protections have been tried, but the sycamore's combination of seeds and leaves is a difficult one to resolve.

It has been one of those days when the interfering fingers of bureaucracy have been particularly irritating - however I am going too far off topic for this thread, so I will shut up!

I do feel for you, dealing with government offices is a nightmare,you fill in one form and another suddenly appears,the country will sink under a paper mountain. The majority of people against our way of life wouldn't now a partridge from a budgie or a sycamore from an ash.This is why the various organisations must get ou there and bang the drum in the press.One man who does rattle cages is Robin Page ,he is about everything in the countryside,perhaps not big shoots but certainly the smaller enterprises like yours and many many more around the country.

[rbrowning2]

4 hours ago, Fellside said:

There’s a lot of doom and gloom with the usual predictable BASC bashing here. 
 

Of course Avery et al will claim a victory - that’s just how it works. However, they never got their 5km exclusion zone...... did they. When the licences come on stream  (which they will), then if a local syndicate is releasing small numbers anyway, they should be compliant by default, and therefore not be impacted.
 

Actually it may work to our advantage, and been a clever move by DEFRA,  as I understand it DEFRA by taking this action has ended the need for the Judicial Reveiw which may have yielded far more constraints, like the 5km exclusion zone, plus possibly now much harder for any further legal challenges. Even the licensing looks like a stop gap by DEFRA as they obtain more data and looks like it will work on the same principles as the General Licences. Time will tell but let’s hope it may not be as bad as some fear.

 

 

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, rbrowning2 said:

Actually it may work to our advantage, .......

I hope you are right

[stagboy]

1 hour ago, rbrowning2 said:

Actually it may work to our advantage, and been a clever move by DEFRA,  as I understand it DEFRA by taking this action has ended the need for the Judicial Reveiw which may have yielded far more constraints, like the 5km exclusion zone, plus possibly now much harder for any further legal challenges. Even the licensing looks like a stop gap by DEFRA as they obtain more data and looks like it will work on the same principles as the General Licences. Time will tell but let’s hope it may not be as bad as some fear.

 

 

Spot on.

[NatureBoy]

Agree! DEFRA and GWCT's recent science based reviews made interesting reading and have shown the pro's and con's of pheasant/partridge release and shooting balance each other out. Generally benefiting many other species and habitats as we know. Avery trying to clam a win is just weak cherry picking negative spin to try and keep there followers on board and of cos CP is going to pop up and try and claim some glory/ attention. as he does. They got no evidence to argue against it. I think a lot more people seeing through there repetitive bull and agenda now. . . . .   Strange there's been no dead/shot /tagged raptors or critters in traps or hanging on gates found lately to? So conveniently turn up when only when it suits them. Usually weeks after the event and look so fresh and photogenic. Freezer fresh maybe?  Rumour heard they have been warned?           NB

[Terry2016]

20 hours ago, enfieldspares said:

I'm sure that another...what's it cost now...£3,000 on a driven day at Catton Hall for those same MPs that went last year, and the year before, and the year before, etc., etc., etc....will sort it all out.

I think you are right they will ... 

Because if they do not .... no one will .

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, NatureBoy said:

have shown the pro's and con's of pheasant/partridge release and shooting balance each other out.

Reminds me of David Bellamy's personal investigation about 30 or 40 years ago.  His conclusion (as a non shooting man who started mildly 'anti') was that overall, the pro's just had the advantage (and he loved eating the game).

[Terry2016]

Things to note

• This is only a proposal ( noting agreed as yet ) 
• The shooting organisations will work with DEFRA to have an input if such systems do come into play the same as they are doing with the GL
• Wild justice have conceded their JR of game bird release. (shows there case was weak)
• The evidence by BASC, GWCT and Natural England shows very little negative impact 
• If shoots are over stocking and causing a negative impact they shouldn't be (we do not want them they will damage the future of shooting) 
• Natural England already have the powers to issue stop notices on shoots and undertake impact assessments 

This is by no way a win for wild justice - its is exactly what they do not want "shooting is carrying on".  

If you need licence for your shoot and you cannot justify / evidence best practice well you probably shouldn't have one, but we are not there yet .. lets not all get too excited Blaming the GWCT, NGO, CA or BASC 

lets see what happens.

Edited October 31, 2020 by Terry2016

[grahamch]

When oh when will be be rid of the Packham wuk fit and his cronies? Its not a month since he had articles in the sporting press. Shame on the idiot editors who entertained him. 

[ShootingEgg]

47 minutes ago, grahamch said:

When oh when will be be rid of the Packham wuk fit and his cronies? Its not a month since he had articles in the sporting press. Shame on the idiot editors who entertained him. 

Exactly this. Comes out saying lets work together then spouts all this with his mate avery

[oowee]

7 hours ago, rbrowning2 said:

Actually it may work to our advantage, and been a clever move by DEFRA,  as I understand it DEFRA by taking this action has ended the need for the Judicial Reveiw which may have yielded far more constraints, like the 5km exclusion zone, plus possibly now much harder for any further legal challenges. Even the licensing looks like a stop gap by DEFRA as they obtain more data and looks like it will work on the same principles as the General Licences. Time will tell but let’s hope it may not be as bad as some fear.

 

 

This ^^^^^ We need to stop burying our heads in the sand, regarding theimpact on the environment of our activities, be it non toxic, shooting seasons for mammals or the release of game birds. Shooters need to wake up to the fact that we need to take more responsibility for the environment we love.

 

Edited October 31, 2020 by oowee

[mick miller]

The problem is, and I'm surprised you're all missing it, is that despite the fact that pheasant shooting may be allowed to continue, this 'success' underlines the perceived negative environmental impact of shooting in the publics mind. 

However you choose to view it, this is a win for wild justice. 

 

 

[oowee]

18 minutes ago, mick miller said:

The problem is, and I'm surprised you're all missing it, is that despite the fact that pheasant shooting may be allowed to continue, this 'success' underlines the perceived negative environmental impact of shooting in the publics mind. 

However you choose to view it, this is a win for wild justice. 

 

 

I see it more as a win for the wider environment lobby. It's part of the sea of change of public opinion to all things environmental. Much of the shooting fraternity is rooted in the past and distant history, of a life long gone and as a result struggle to accept the change coming along the tracks. 

[Fellside]

9 hours ago, oowee said:

I see it more as a win for the wider environment lobby. It's part of the sea of change of public opinion to all things environmental. Much of the shooting fraternity is rooted in the past and distant history, of a life long gone and as a result struggle to accept the change coming along the tracks. 

I would like to respectfully disagree. The environmental movement embraces the notion of local sustainable food. Only circa 5% of the UK population are veggie. There is therefore plenty of scope for game management - and all of its habitat benefits for wildlife - to be carried along by the ‘green wave’. After all you can’t find a bird much more ‘free range’ than a pheasant.
 

Given good practice and the correct message, shooting could (and should) provide a good fit within the environmental movement. I don’t obviously refer to the animal rights extremists here, but more to the average member of the public with a green conscience. 

[Conor O'Gorman]

Some FAQs from BASC here:
https://basc.org.uk/game-bird-releasing-faqs/
 

Following the announcement that Defra has concluded its review into releasing game birds on and around protected sites BASC has issued the following FAQs.

What is Defra’s position?

Subject to a consultation Defra intends to introduce a new interim licensing regime for the 2021 releases of common pheasant and red-legged partridge within European protected sites and a 500m buffer zone around these sites. This will enable them to rule out the possibility of any adverse effect on protected sites while gathering more information where evidence gaps exist.

Defra also intend to make improvements to the Animal and Plant Health Agency (APHA) poultry register and have advised that they are going to review and improve the existing consenting regime and monitoring of these sites.

What protected sites are we talking about?

It’s not all protected sites, just those which are of European importance. They are called Special Protection Areas, which are for birds, and Special Areas for Conservation, which cover habitats and other animals. They cover around 5% of England.

Where can I find a map of them?

The governments interactive map service Magic Maps.

What does BASC think?

We do not think a licencing system is justified by the evidence and that is why our reaction on the weekend was sceptical. The licence details will be subject to open consultation. We have demanded the following.

• The shooting organisations must be fully involved with the consultation.
• Defra, rather than Natural England, should implement any new licence.
• The legislation for any interim licensing system should have the termination date clearly specified.
• The conditions on any licence should be the GWCT’s rules for releasing, which are already the basis of self-regulation in game shooting.
• Any licensing system must be in place by 1 February 2021 to allow shoots to plan for the season. If this is not possible the system should be delayed until 2022.

What part has BASC played in Defra’s gamebird review and the Judicial Review brought by Wild Justice?

BASC has been heavily involved fighting for a sensible outcome for shooting and conservation.

BASC is an interested party in the judicial review brought by Wild Justice. The Countryside Alliance, the National Gamekeepers Association and the Game Famers’ Association are also interested parties and we have worked together on this issue. It was this judicial review that prompted Defra to conduct their review into releasing game birds on and around protected sites.

We have ensured shooting is represented in the legal proceedings by an expert QC and legal team and we have provided evidence and witness statements to support the QC in making the clear case why this action should be dismissed. BASC has used money from its fighting fund to pay for this representation of members’ interests and shooting generally.

BASC also worked with Natural England to fund a review on the impacts of releasing gamebirds which was conducted by Game and Wildlife Conservation Trust and the University of Exeter. The review catalogued all the known evidence and supplied several recommendations for moving our knowledge base forward.

This review, Ecological Consequences of Gamebird Releasing and Management on Lowland Shoots in England, is a key piece of evidence Defra used to underpin their position to rebut Wild Justice’s proposal for a 5km restriction on all game bird releasing from European Protected Sites to a 500m general licence enabling gamebird release whilst Defra and Natural England complete assessments.

Defra have chosen to put their statements into the public domain at https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/review-of-gamebird-releases-on-and-around-european-protected-sites

Is Defra’s proposal shoot licensing?

No, the proposal is currently to license the release of pheasants and red partridges on and within 500m of European protected sites.

Is game bird releasing going to be banned in the England?

No. Subject to a consultation process the Government intend to make it illegal to release pheasants and red legged partridges on and within 500m of European protected sites. but they then intend to issue a general licence to permit their release (provide the conditions on any licence are complied with) in this area. This may seem pointless, but it provides Defra and Natural England time to assess the impacts of release without stopping it taking place whilst they do this. Outside of these sites and 500m from them there should be no change.

Is this going to disrupt the 2021 season?

In their statement Defra have said “We will continue to engage and consult with industry in order to minimise any disruption.” BASC will ensure to keep them to their word to minimise any disruption.

Were BASC consulted on this decision considering their involvement with the evidence review and the judicial review?

No. Defra chose not to consult with either BASC, Countryside Alliance, National Gamekeepers Organisation or the Game Farmers’ Association before making their announcement for this general licence arrangement.

What is BASC’s view on gamebird releasing?

BASC is fully supportive of the GWCT rules of releasing gamebirds (Link) that underpin the Code of Good Shooting Practice and the British Game Alliance standards.

BASC believes all efforts should be afforded to mitigating against any potential negative impacts and boosting the positive impacts of gamebird release.

Accomplishing these aims will maximise shootings’ net positive impact on the environment and add to its positive contributions to the rural economy and social and well-being importance for participants. Following best practice is an action everyone can do. Every BASC member is sent a copy of the Code of Good Shooting Practice when their membership renews and this is the core text for shoots to understand and abide by.

How might the general licence system work?

If a general licence system is implemented, anyone releasing gamebirds within 500m of European sites will be able to continue to release gamebirds in line with the conditions set out in the licence. Like controlling some pest species on a general licence , there will not be a need to apply for the licence, but you are required to abide by the conditions within the licence. For anyone who wants to take action outside of the general licence, then they would have to apply for an individual licence.

Will those covered by this licensing system still have to register on the poultry register?

Yes, you must register on the Poultry Register if you keep 50 or more pheasant or partridge anywhere in the UK. There are concerns that not all shoots do this. Make sure you and those you know with shoots register their game birds releases on the poultry register.
Poultry (including game birds): registration rules and forms

Why do Defra feel it is necessary to bring in licensing of gamebird release near to these sites?

Defra’s gamebird review has been ongoing for over a year now. It is Defra’s opinion that they cannot be certain as to the impacts of gamebird release on every European Protected Site at this moment but as a short term measure a licenced system will allow Natural England time to complete the required assessments.

Defra feel that the evidence from its review indicates that the negative impacts of gamebird release are likely to be minimal or none when 500m from the release pens. They are also of the view that compliance with the GWCT principals embedded in the code of good shooting practice (of a maximum of 1000 birds per hectare of pen in general woodland or 700 birds per hectare of pen in sensitive woodland) limits negative impacts on flora and nutrient enrichment to the pen itself and 15m from it.

Why is it temporary?

As soon as Natural England can quantify the impact of gamebird release on designated sites the general licence will be void as the consenting process will adequately cover the issue.

When will it be the interim general licence begin?

Defra intend to initiate the interim general licensing process for the 2021 season. BASC are pressing them to have this in place by 1st February 2021 so that affected shoots can plan for their season without the uncertainty of awaiting the licence details.

What consultation will be undertaken on these proposals?

Defra intend to undertake a public consultation. With a short timeframe BASC has already begun lobbying that these interim measures are reasonable and workable.

[Conor O'Gorman]

Update below:

Wild Justice ‘would not have been successful’, Judge says

Shooting organisations have reacted positively to the publication of court papers that suggest Wild Justice’s Judicial Review on releasing gamebirds near to designated sites would not have been successful if heard.

As interested parties, the British Association for Shooting and Conservation, Countryside Alliance, Game Farmers’ Association and National Gamekeepers Organisation worked together to ensure Wild Justice were unsuccessful in their request to have a stop notice placed on all gamebird releases up to 5km away from designated sites such as Special Protection Areas (SPAs) and Special Areas of Conservation (SACs).

After dismissing Wild Justice’s subsequent attempt to claim £35,000 costs for the case it instigated, the judge in the matter was critical of the group’s behaviour in the latter stages of the legal process.

Justice Holgate criticised Wild Justice for their “unacceptable” failure to deal with the content of a witness statement submitted by Defra in August which discussed the findings of their 18-month evidence-gathering review of gamebird releasing and outlined subsequent steps that would be taken by Defra and Natural England (NE).

Justice Holgate also cast doubt on the validity of the case brought by Wild Justice, who were claimants (C) against Defra and the Secretary of State for the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs.

He added: “It does not appear to me from the material before me (which includes the results of the review) that C would have been successful on the issue.”

And in direct relation to Wild Justice’s application to receive costs, Justice Holgate said: “Plainly, it cannot be said that C has been wholly or even substantially successful in relation to its claim as originally pleaded.

“I am inclined to the view that it would not have been successful… …I am left with the firm impression that the application for costs did not grapple with the real issues from the outset and should not have been made.”

A spokesperson for the shooting organisations said: “The costs order by Justice Holgate has vindicated our hard work and the original decision by the organisations to fight Wild Justice to ensure that we could become involved in the legal hearings.

“As interested parties, we were able to submit witness statements and support Defra to ensure that shooting’s voice was heard.

“It was reassuring to see the Judge set out the shortcomings of Wild Justice’s case in his rejection of their application for costs.”

“As a group of organisations, we now move on to focus on the Government’s proposed interim licensing scheme for gamebird release in and near to certain protected sites. We are determined that the legitimate game management interests of our members are safeguarded from threats, wherever they come from.”

See: https://basc.org.uk/wild-justice-would-not-have-been-successful-judge-says/

[Fisheruk]

14 minutes ago, Conor O'Gorman said:

Update below:

Wild Justice ‘would not have been successful’, Judge says

Shooting organisations have reacted positively to the publication of court papers that suggest Wild Justice’s Judicial Review on releasing gamebirds near to designated sites would not have been successful if heard.

As interested parties, the British Association for Shooting and Conservation, Countryside Alliance, Game Farmers’ Association and National Gamekeepers Organisation worked together to ensure Wild Justice were unsuccessful in their request to have a stop notice placed on all gamebird releases up to 5km away from designated sites such as Special Protection Areas (SPAs) and Special Areas of Conservation (SACs).

After dismissing Wild Justice’s subsequent attempt to claim £35,000 costs for the case it instigated, the judge in the matter was critical of the group’s behaviour in the latter stages of the legal process.

Justice Holgate criticised Wild Justice for their “unacceptable” failure to deal with the content of a witness statement submitted by Defra in August which discussed the findings of their 18-month evidence-gathering review of gamebird releasing and outlined subsequent steps that would be taken by Defra and Natural England (NE).

Justice Holgate also cast doubt on the validity of the case brought by Wild Justice, who were claimants (C) against Defra and the Secretary of State for the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs.

He added: “It does not appear to me from the material before me (which includes the results of the review) that C would have been successful on the issue.”

And in direct relation to Wild Justice’s application to receive costs, Justice Holgate said: “Plainly, it cannot be said that C has been wholly or even substantially successful in relation to its claim as originally pleaded.

“I am inclined to the view that it would not have been successful… …I am left with the firm impression that the application for costs did not grapple with the real issues from the outset and should not have been made.”

A spokesperson for the shooting organisations said: “The costs order by Justice Holgate has vindicated our hard work and the original decision by the organisations to fight Wild Justice to ensure that we could become involved in the legal hearings.

“As interested parties, we were able to submit witness statements and support Defra to ensure that shooting’s voice was heard.

“It was reassuring to see the Judge set out the shortcomings of Wild Justice’s case in his rejection of their application for costs.”

“As a group of organisations, we now move on to focus on the Government’s proposed interim licensing scheme for gamebird release in and near to certain protected sites. We are determined that the legitimate game management interests of our members are safeguarded from threats, wherever they come from.”

See: https://basc.org.uk/wild-justice-would-not-have-been-successful-judge-says/

Very positive result, onwards and upwards.

[Fellside]

Great! 
we just have to ensure that Defra’s interim licence - re the 500 metre zone - is workable. 

[old'un]

 

I watched Country File this Sunday gone, it was all about the environment and tree planting, it had a group of kids planting trees, they were asked what it meant for the environment and the animals that relied on woodland for habitat, the program also included Brian May giving his two penneth, what came across to me was how these people are clouding the water between the environment and the protection of animals, they are trying to tie the two together to get more support from kids and the public at large, saying things like “we need to protect the environment and all the animals that live there if we are to make a better future for all of us”

think if May could have got away with it he would have told the kids, “we need to stop all these people with guns killing all our wildlife to protect the environment” they are without a doubt trying to use the green issue to further their agenda.

[PeterHenry]

Great news - I have yet to see (the usually quite speedy) Dr Avery post anything about it yet.

[rbrowning2]

1 hour ago, PeterHenry said:

Great news - I have yet to see (the usually quite speedy) Dr Avery post anything about it yet.

Even if he does he will twist it to a WJ victory and how BASC are miss reporting it.

[PeterHenry]

10 minutes ago, rbrowning2 said:

Even if he does he will twist it to a WJ victory and how BASC are miss reporting it.

I'm not really sure how he could twist not being awarded costs, and a judge saying the action would have been unsuccessful as a win. I known he has a knack for self promotion, but I think even that may be stretched a little thin in this case.