Lloyd90 Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Farmers protesting at certain super markets in various places pending a price drop, giving them 23p a litre. Should we pay more for milk ? Should we pay the same but the super markets pay them more ? Should farmers who can't run a farm in profit consider a different career path ? All genuine questions I am wondering. Link - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-33751573 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 No Yes Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 I don't think there is a simple answer for many reasons, but supermarkets can be extraordinarily aggressive and exploitative in how they set prices. I buy my milk direct from the dairy and get it delivered twice a week as I am happy to pay a bit more and cut out the middle men distributors and the supermarkets. I also try to do the same with fresh veg for the same reasons. I like having local producers and will aim to support them. We do have an over supply issue with milk just now and it is a commodity like any other so there will be winners and losers when it is traded and ultimately that means production needs to scale back and if that is uneconomical for some to sustain then they will fail. Farmers cannot expect to be subsidised by the consumer or retailer to continue producing a product in surplus, but equally they should not be shafted by the purchasing power of the supermarkets either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
millrace Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 dont produce whats not needed then complain when prices drop due to over supply,,and most certaintly dont look for a handout to get by its a buisness stand on your own or get out simple,, now before i get abuse i run a small construction buisness and bust myself all through a recession now for 7 yrs to try and get a wage and let me tell you in northern ireland there is not that much of an improvement as yet now have i got any help or handout NO....so why should they,,,,,makes me annoyed that there are many industries struggling just to get by stay afloat etc and as soon as the farmer gets cut its time for a subsidey, nope its time to be realistic change or sell simple dont ask for free cash no one else can get.................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweedledee Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 We all need farmers three times a day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 One of the problem is that the farmers can't just stop producing milk tomorrow then start up again when the price is better and the super markets know it, if the price of grain falls they can just keep it in the shed to some extent and then sell at a better price Pulls cheap imports from countries that have lower cost through cheaper fuel and feed and lower animal husbandry standards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashman Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Farmers protesting at certain super markets in various places pending a price drop, giving them 23p a litre. Should we pay more for milk ? Should we pay the same but the super markets pay them more ? Should farmers who can't run a farm in profit consider a different career path ? All genuine questions I am wondering. Link - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-33751573 Do you have an opinion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 We all need farmers three times a day. Some would argue why do we need farmers when we've got super markets! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 One of the problem is that the farmers can't just stop producing milk tomorrow then start up again when the price is better and the super markets know it, if the price of grain falls they can just keep it in the shed to some extent and then sell at a better price Pulls cheap imports from countries that have lower cost through cheaper fuel and feed and lower animal husbandry standards spot on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Do we want to loose all agriculture and import everything? As if we keep going letting the supermarkets dictate prices that's the way it's going Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peck Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 dont produce whats not needed then complain when prices drop due to over supply,,and most certaintly dont look for a handout to get by its a buisness stand on your own or get out simple,, now before i get abuse i run a small construction buisness and bust myself all through a recession now for 7 yrs to try and get a wage and let me tell you in northern ireland there is not that much of an improvement as yet now have i got any help or handout NO....so why should they,,,,,makes me annoyed that there are many industries struggling just to get by stay afloat etc and as soon as the farmer gets cut its time for a subsidey, nope its time to be realistic change or sell simple dont ask for free cash no one else can get.................... The thing with dairy farmers is that they have a 4 year lead in time until production of milk, they cannot just say like you could oh i think i will have a month off, drop the tools in the van, lock it and come back in a month and start again. Farmers have hundreds of thousands of pounds worth on stock and infrastructure that has to be used every day, The supermarkets and multinational dairies have the dairy farmers by the short and curlies and do dictate prices. Take for instance Muller Dairy, spend millions each year on advertising, how much milk is there in a Muller yoghurt? well lets say you can get 10 yoghurts from a litre of milk, the farmer gets approx 25p litre for his milk, Muller sells 1 youhurt for approx 50p the actual milk content of that yoghurt is 100ml multiply that by 10 and Muller is selling that farmers 1 litre of milk for £5-00 plus he has taken off the cream and made butter from it and sells that also. I do not think farmers should be subsidised but neither should they be exploited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peck Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Some would argue why do we need farmers when we've got super markets! cant believe i just read this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd90 Posted August 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Do you have an opinion? I think if you can't make a business work then perhaps its time to get out. I also think that supermarkets are exploitative of labour and farmers and these huge corporations would step on anyone without remorse to make a £. I don't like the thought that we as a country should be so reliant upon importing our food (and milk) from other countries, as should we ever need to be more self reliant, we can't just flip a switch and start producing more instantly. I also don't know massive amounts of background info regarding how it came to this, so initially refrained from calling farmers idiots who wanted a hand out, or hard done by workers who are being exploited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew f Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Farmers protesting at certain super markets in various places pending a price drop, giving them 23p a litre. Should we pay more for milk ? Should we pay the same but the super markets pay them more ? Should farmers who can't run a farm in profit consider a different career path ? All genuine questions I am wondering. Link - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-33751573 30p a litre is what we get from Sainsbury at work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the enigma Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Protesting outside supermarkets is going have little, if any impact, on the current situation. The reality is that we are at the mercy of the global market. Reduced demand from China for milk powder, the Russian ban on food imports along with the current strength of sterling are all having a major impact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Not particularly concerning milk but why are farmers markets so horrendously expensive? Much more expensive than the shops and supermarkets! Farmers sell direct to the public so cut out the middle men (shops and Supermarkets) thereby saving all the transportation costs and the supermarkets profits!......it seems a bit greedy it certainly doesn't add up! Regarding the price of milk, a farmer near to where I live produces and sells his own milk, if he were to sell it to the general public at the same or close to the same price as the cost in the supermarkets I would buy it from him, but he keeps all the difference in profit between the wholsale and full retail price for himself............again seems a bit greedy to me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrowningB525 Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 (edited) Farmers protesting at certain super markets in various places pending a price drop, giving them 23p a litre. Should we pay more for milk ? Yes Should we pay the same but the super markets pay them more ? If possible. I don't see it happening though. Supermarkets pretty much sell milk as a loss leader already. Should farmers who can't run a farm in profit consider a different career path ? It's not that black and white unfortunately. You can drastically cut costs, but welfare will suffer. You cna poerate factory farms where the cows never see grass, it's cheaper than conventional farming. Is it ethical? All genuine questions I am wondering. Link - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-33751573 I grew up on a small dairy farm. Unfortunately, there was no money in it any more and the business folded. It really is time that people actually valued things instead of looking at the cost. Supermarkets have created a race to the bottom. Not particularly concerning milk but why are farmers markets so horrendously expensive? Much more expensive than the shops and supermarkets! Farmers sell direct to the public so cut out the middle men (shops and Supermarkets) thereby saving all the transportation costs and the supermarkets profits!......it seems a bit greedy it certainly doesn't add up! Regarding the price of milk, a farmer near to where I live produces and sells his own milk, if he were to sell it to the general public at the same or close to the same price as the cost in the supermarkets I would buy it from him, but he keeps all the difference in profit between the wholsale and full retail price for himself............again seems a bit greedy to me! It's not "normal" farmers at these events. It is usually "artisanal" producers etc. It would be good to go to a "farmers market" and there be a farmer selling something such as carrots from a trailer for pence a kilo. Farmers markets are to cater for yuppies more than normal people. The farmer will have to do additional work, so he isn't pocketing the whole difference. You are paying for a fresh product. Edited August 3, 2015 by BrowningB525 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew f Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Not particularly concerning milk but why are farmers markets so horrendously expensive? Much more expensive than the shops and supermarkets! Farmers sell direct to the public so cut out the middle men (shops and Supermarkets) thereby saving all the transportation costs and the supermarkets profits!......it seems a bit greedy it certainly doesn't add up! Regarding the price of milk, a farmer near to where I live produces and sells his own milk, if he were to sell it to the general public at the same or close to the same price as the cost in the supermarkets I would buy it from him, but he keeps all the difference in profit between the wholsale and full retail price for himself............again seems a bit greedy to me! Farmers are in yearly contracts which they cant back out of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 cant believe i just read this. Some one posted a link on here a few weeks ago where some idiot was saying that we shouldn't kill animals for food if we wanted to eat meat we should get it from a shop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the enigma Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 dont produce whats not needed then complain when prices drop due to over supply,,and most certaintly dont look for a handout to get by its a buisness stand on your own or get out simple,, now before i get abuse i run a small construction buisness and bust myself all through a recession now for 7 yrs to try and get a wage and let me tell you in northern ireland there is not that much of an improvement as yet now have i got any help or handout NO....so why should they,,,,,makes me annoyed that there are many industries struggling just to get by stay afloat etc and as soon as the farmer gets cut its time for a subsidey, nope its time to be realistic change or sell simple dont ask for free cash no one else can get.................... A lot of construction firms were glad of farmers' money when the bubble burst. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 It really is time that people actually valued things instead of looking at the cost. Supermarkets have created a race to the bottom. It's not "normal" farmers at these events. It is usually "artisanal" producers etc. It would be good to go to a "farmers market" and there be a farmer selling something such as carrots from a trailer for pence a kilo. Farmers markets are to cater for yuppies more than normal people. The farmer will have to do additional work, so he isn't pocketing the whole difference. You are paying for a fresh product. Good post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 I feel that this topic has the potential to produce more ***** than my beasts ever could.And by those who know nothing of the workings of a farm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keg Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 +1 And let's not forget about the french and the CAP which was invented solely for the benefit of french farmers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd90 Posted August 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 I feel that this topic has the potential to produce more ***** than my beasts ever could.And by those who know nothing of the workings of a farm. +1 And let's not forget about the french and the CAP which was invented solely for the benefit of french farmers. Please enlighten us, the reason I made this thread was to discuss it and learn a bit more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 I grew up on a small dairy farm. Unfortunately, there was no money in it any more and the business folded. It really is time that people actually valued things instead of looking at the cost. Supermarkets have created a race to the bottom. It's not "normal" farmers at these events. It is usually "artisanal" producers etc. It would be good to go to a "farmers market" and there be a farmer selling something such as carrots from a trailer for pence a kilo. Farmers markets are to cater for yuppies more than normal people. The farmer will have to do additional work, so he isn't pocketing the whole difference. You are paying for a fresh product. Ive sold at farmers markets and the high price has a lot to do with economies of scale. a small farmer does not have the equipment of a large farmer and is more labour intensive, (but without the overheads) the trick is to get the right balance and produce something the public are prepared to pay a premium for, for instance not just milk but to turn the milk into cheese, supermarkets are exploitative of course, and we like to pay as little as we can, go figure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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