Got a Notice of Intended Prosecution Dual purpose Vehicle - Help required

[Agriv8]

Just got a producer through doing 59 in a 60 MPH

My van is a Dual cab DCIV transit custom 290S so 4 doors and windows its under the weight for Dual purpose as its under the 2040 unladen weight. 

it is and always unladen as I use this as a family car ( not connected with any Trade or Work ) as I am office worker 

Anybody had this how it works to appeal ?

help gratefully received as always

Agriv8

 

 

 

[B725]

I am fairly sure that a van will always be classed as a van therefore their speed restrictions apply. 

[Newbie to this]

27 minutes ago, Agriv8 said:

Just got a producer through doing 59 in a 60 MPH

My van is a Dual cab DCIV transit custom 290S so 4 doors and windows its under the weight for Dual purpose as its under the 2040 unladen weight. 

it is and always unladen as I use this as a family car ( not connected with any Trade or Work ) as I am office worker 

Anybody had this how it works to appeal ?

help gratefully received as always

Agriv8

 

 

 

I think the weight capacity has to be under 2 tonnes if fully loaded to qualify for the same speeds as cars. It doesn't matter that it is not loaded, just that it has the capability to go over 2 tonnes.

How the vehicle is registered matters as well.

https://www.gov.uk/speed-limits

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/car-derived-vans-and-dual-purpose-vehicles/car-derived-vans-and-dual-purpose-vehicles

 

Edited September 17, 2020 by Newbie to this

[Mickeydredd]

so it has effectively nabbed you for doing 59 in a 50 then.

My mate got caught similarly doing 68 in a 70, he thought he could do 70mph

[Newbie to this]

2 minutes ago, Mickeydredd said:

so it has effectively nabbed you for doing 59 in a 50 then.

My mate got caught similarly doing 68 in a 70, he thought he could do 70mph

Only on motorways

[Agriv8]

I was under the impression wrongly that the following applied 

Parker website

https://www.parkers.co.uk/vans-pickups/advice/speed-limits/

 

quote

What about kombi and double-cab vans – what are the speed limits for vans with side windows?

This is perhaps the area where UK speed limit laws are greyest.

For while kombi vans, also known as double-cab vans, can qualify for dual-purpose status – subject to the 2,040kg unladen weight rule – their overtly van-like appearance has been known to cause confusion when it comes to police speed limit enforcement.

If you do feel you’ve been wrongly accused of speeding as a result, our best advice is to remain polite, explain your position clearly, and be prepared to appeal at a later date.

[Mickeydredd]

41 minutes ago, Newbie to this said:

Only on motorways

When we read up on the regs, there was nowhere he could do 70.  Top speed for the van was 60mph

[Newbie to this]

30 minutes ago, Mickeydredd said:

When we read up on the regs, there was nowhere he could do 70.  Top speed for the van was 60mph

If it is under 7.5 tonnes then motorway speeds are still 70, dual carriageways are 60, & single carriageways are 50

It's all here https://www.gov.uk/speed-limits

 

Edited September 17, 2020 by Newbie to this

[Rupert]

it is my understandind it relates to how the vehicle is classified on the V5, PLG then car limits apply and LCV lower standards are applied.

[Newbie to this]

8 minutes ago, Rupert said:

it is my understandind it relates to how the vehicle is classified on the V5, PLG then car limits apply and LCV lower standards are applied.

It's all on the government's website, if the Vehicle is capable of a total weight (so vehicle weight plus it's legal load capcity) of over 2 tonnes, doesn't matter if it is loaded or empty, then the Goods vehicle limits apply.

Edited September 17, 2020 by Newbie to this

[walshie]

It's not as easy as what it says in your logbook. Car speed limits apply if it's classed as a dual-purpose vehicle, but the definition of that is a real drag. My Hilux is under 2040 kg unladen and qualifies as a dual purpose vehicle as it has selectable 4WD. 

Yours would need to conform to the conditions of construction below:

I'd just send them a copy of this which can be found at https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1986/1078/regulation/3/made

dual-purpose vehicle

a vehicle constructed or adapted for the carriage both of passengers and of goods or burden of any description, being a vehicle of which the unladen weight does not exceed 2040 kg, and which either— (i) is so constructed or adapted that the driving power of the engine is, or by the appropriate use of the controls of the vehicle can be, transmitted to all the wheels of the vehicle; or (ii) satisfies the following conditions as to construction, namely— (a) the vehicle must be permanently fitted with a rigid roof, with or without a sliding panel; (b) the area of the vehicle to the rear of the driver's seat must— (i) be permanently fitted with at least one row of transverse seats (fixed or folding) for two or more passengers and those seats must be properly sprung or cushioned and provided with upholstered back-rests, attached either to the seats or to a side or the floor of the vehicle; and (ii) be lit on each side and at the rear by a window or windows of glass or other transparent material having an area or aggregate area of not less than 1850 square centimetres on each side and not less than 770 square centimetres at the rear; and (c) the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the back-rests of the row of transverse seats satisfying the requirements specified in head (i) of sub-paragraph (b) (or, if there is more than one such row of seats, the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the back-rests of the rearmost such row) must, when the seats are ready for use, be not less than one-third of the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the rearmost part of the floor of the vehicle.

[ph5172]

If I recall the limits for dual purpose or car derived vans are an unladen maximum of 2000kg. 
 

there are also other bits such as windows in the load compartment and the such but the above still applies. 

It may be registered as a van  

should be an easy appeal if you send a picture of the motor plus the weight plate

 

Edited September 17, 2020 by ph5172

[walshie]

2 minutes ago, ph5172 said:

If I recall the limits for dual purpose or car derived vans are an unladen maximum of 200kg. 
 

there are also other bits such as windows in the load compartment and the such but the above still applies. 
 

so at 2048kg I’m afraid your driving a van 

Maximum unladen weight limit is 2040kg.

[Vince Green]

If i am right its based on how the vehicle was declared when first registered.

On 17/09/2020 at 17:48, Rupert said:

it is my understandind it relates to how the vehicle is classified on the V5, PLG then car limits apply and LCV lower standards are applied.

this

[southeastpete]

Oh ****. I drive my navara (3020kg unladen I believe and can carry a ton) to car speed limits! Had no idea cameras could differentiate between a truck and a car either...

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Whoops!

[TR1]

My understanding is .

Speed cameras refer to the DVLA database by registration. So the vehicle classification M1 (car) or N1 (lgv) is determined by first registration. 
LGV has the benefit of lower road fund license but the penalty of lower speed limits.

[walshie]

6 hours ago, southeastpete said:

Oh ****. I drive my navara (3020kg unladen I believe and can carry a ton) to car speed limits! Had no idea cameras could differentiate between a truck and a car either...

It must be the biggest Navara in the world to weigh 3T unladen.  And regular speed cameras can't differentiate between vehicles.

I'm not really sure why there is always this kerfuffle about what a dual purpose vehicle is. It's literally spelled out in black and white in the legislation I put in my post. i didn't make it up. I copied and pasted it from the Government website. 

 

[southeastpete]

10 hours ago, walshie said:

It must be the biggest Navara in the world to weigh 3T unladen.  And regular speed cameras can't differentiate between vehicles.

I'm not really sure why there is always this kerfuffle about what a dual purpose vehicle is. It's literally spelled out in black and white in the legislation I put in my post. i didn't make it up. I copied and pasted it from the Government website. 

 

Just googled it again, I got it wrong, it’s 3010kg

[Sprinter]

9 minutes ago, southeastpete said:

Just googled it again, I got it wrong, it’s 3010kg

I think you may have got it wrong again then, that would be gross vehicle weight? not kerb weight or unladen weight?

[southeastpete]

58 minutes ago, Sprinter said:

I think you may have got it wrong again then, that would be gross vehicle weight? not kerb weight or unladen weight?

So gross weight is with a full load? Ok, why don’t they just call it weight fully loaded or laden weight...

so the actual weight of the vehicle is a little over 2t then I guess

[fishingtex]

Your vehicle sounds like it fits into the dual purpose category as follows. Therefore the speed limits are the same as a car.

I have check my 19 plate Navara is normal car speed usage and not restricted.

 

Dual purpose vehicles

A dual purpose vehicle is a vehicle constructed or adapted for the carriage both of passengers and of goods and designed to weigh no more than 2,040 kg when unladen, and is either:

• constructed or adapted so that the driving power of the engine is, or can be selected to be, transmitted to all wheels of the vehicle

or

• permanently fitted with a rigid roof, at least one row of transverse passenger seats to the rear of the driver’s seat and will have side and rear windows - there must also be a minimum ratio between the size of passenger and stowage areas

[walshie]

47 minutes ago, fishingtex said:

Your vehicle sounds like it fits into the dual purpose category as follows. Therefore the speed limits are the same as a car.

I have check my 19 plate Navara is normal car speed usage and not restricted.

 

Dual purpose vehicles

A dual purpose vehicle is a vehicle constructed or adapted for the carriage both of passengers and of goods and designed to weigh no more than 2,040 kg when unladen, and is either:

• constructed or adapted so that the driving power of the engine is, or can be selected to be, transmitted to all wheels of the vehicle

or

• permanently fitted with a rigid roof, at least one row of transverse passenger seats to the rear of the driver’s seat and will have side and rear windows - there must also be a minimum ratio between the size of passenger and stowage areas

How very dare you put up easy to read and understand actual facts? We don't do that here.

We prefer conjecture, hearsay and opinions to muddy the water and make the most simple thing a real palaver. 

[fishingtex]

Sorry

[Jaymo]

What’s your VED rate and then you have the answer