Cyclist

[Scully]

4 minutes ago, Stonepark said:

I wonder how many injuries could  be prevented by all car occupants wearing helmets (car accidents cause  more head injuries  - nornmally side window impact  than cycling accidents), and how many accidents/injuries could be prevented by all cars and motor bikes being Hi ViZ instead of black (difficult to see in twilight), silver/grey ( disappears in fog) etc etc.

If you want cylcists to meet the standards you raise, then it is only right and fair that you implement the same.

 

We could go the whole hog and restrict vehicles to the speed limit, stop making vehicles capable of exceeding 70mph, or govern all vehicles to 30mph, if it’s safety or injury you’re concerned with. 
I’m simply asking for something which ensures cyclists are answerable for flaunting the rules of the road. 

[GingerCat]

8 minutes ago, Stonepark said:

I wonder how many injuries could  be prevented by all car occupants wearing helmets (car accidents cause  more head injuries  - nornmally side window impact  than cycling accidents), and how many accidents/injuries could be prevented by all cars and motor bikes being Hi ViZ instead of black (difficult to see in twilight), silver/grey ( disappears in fog) etc etc.

If you want cylcists to meet the standards you raise, then it is only right and fair that you implement the same.

 

I have a cousin who is a dr. He calls all cyclists (motor or not) donercycles. His rationale is that the vast majority of organs come from them and not cars as most car crashes are not fatal or if fatal there is nothing to salvage. My experience of dealing with collisions mirrors his. 

I'm not sure why the hostility towards wearing a helmet, having insurance and passing a basic test is so high. Perhaps many would fail or be caught out by having an identifiable registration and fined as opposed to blasting through red lights at will and blaming it on the car. 

 

[strimmer_13]

3 hours ago, Newbie to this said:

Did I miss something? What the hell is a hover board, because in my head I want one if it's anything like marty mcflys 😂

[GingerCat]

37 minutes ago, strimmer_13 said:

Did I miss something? What the hell is a hover board, because in my head I want one if it's anything like marty mcflys 😂

Wanted 1 since I was about 6. One day.....

[12gauge82]

Well Reading this I wonder if all those calling for cycle licences feel the same about airgun licensing for the rest of the UK, you could apply most of the same arguments that airgun should be licensed like section 1 firearms are. 

I however feel society should be as free as possible and everyone shouldn't be punished for the idiots in life. 

[WalkedUp]

Volunteering for some flack here, I would like airguns licensed and not bicycles. However from my office yesterday I saw  over 25 cyclists cycling on the pavement at high speed. The vigilante in me wants to throw them under a truck but society has civilised me enough to know that is not acceptable or proportionate. 

It is the impunity with which cyclists break the law and endanger the public which upsets people. 

Edited October 8, 2020 by WalkedUp

[discobob]

I heard of a woman last night who has a disability electric scooter - she has to have it insured to use it - and regularly gets abuse from cyclists while she is using it to get about telling her that she shouldn't be on the road!!

[Newbie to this]

15 hours ago, strimmer_13 said:

Did I miss something? What the hell is a hover board, because in my head I want one if it's anything like marty mcflys 😂

It's one of those things that burns your house down whilst charging or burns you whilst using it, oh and it in no way hovers.

 

[243deer]

16 hours ago, Scully said:

We could go the whole hog and restrict vehicles to the speed limit, stop making vehicles capable of exceeding 70mph, or govern all vehicles to 30mph, if it’s safety or injury you’re concerned with.  

This is an excellent suggestion, had we had the technology 40 years ago my best mate would still be with us and would not have had his life cut short by a very ignorant car driver.

Whilst I am very pro everyone being able to use the roads safely at sensible speeds, with our ever increasing population our MP's do not seem to have kept up very well with the changing times. You could also say that they expect adults to act responsibly and within the law. However, when it comes to getting behind a wheel stress takes over and some folk cannot seem to help themselves treating our roads as a racetrack.

It probably is time that cyclists had to have identification and insurance so that the bad ones can be admonished as the standards of road use by quite a few are now very poor.

At the same time it is also incumbent on car drivers, that do not have a minute, to calm down  and realise that pedestrians, horse riders and cyclists were on our roads first so should be given respect.

Two near misses yesterday in 3 miles with my wife and I driving home from a walk in Thetford forest. 50mph as my truck is rated commercial in a 60mph limit - both Audis responsible came very close to taking out ourselves and the oncoming cars whilst they overtook dangerously - what is up with these car drivers - do they have a death wish - why should they be allowed to continuously drive like idiots - does the world revolve around them? 

Then I see a very similar attitude to being held up for a short while by some folk on here - I send my sympathies in advance to your families and particularly the families of those that you will undoubtedly kill.

[silver pigeon69]

6 hours ago, 12gauge82 said:

Well Reading this I wonder if all those calling for cycle licences feel the same about airgun licensing for the rest of the UK, you could apply most of the same arguments that airgun should be licensed like section 1 firearms are. 

I however feel society should be as free as possible and everyone shouldn't be punished for the idiots in life. 

The only flaw in your argument is that people are calling for Licences for Cycles that are used in public areas, whereas airguns aren't. I would like cyclist to be identifiable and licensed/registered if used on a public highway/area. If used on private property, like airguns or other vehicles they would not need to be.

[12gauge82]

4 hours ago, silver pigeon69 said:

The only flaw in your argument is that people are calling for Licences for Cycles that are used in public areas, whereas airguns aren't. I would like cyclist to be identifiable and licensed/registered if used on a public highway/area. If used on private property, like airguns or other vehicles they would not need to be.

But airguns are often used in public places which endangers members of the public, if they were licensed and anyone with one identifiable it would stop people getting away with breaking the law with one. 

[12gauge82]

22 hours ago, GingerCat said:

I have a cousin who is a dr. He calls all cyclists (motor or not) donercycles. His rationale is that the vast majority of organs come from them and not cars as most car crashes are not fatal or if fatal there is nothing to salvage. My experience of dealing with collisions mirrors his. 

I'm not sure why the hostility towards wearing a helmet, having insurance and passing a basic test is so high. Perhaps many would fail or be caught out by having an identifiable registration and fined as opposed to blasting through red lights at will and blaming it on the car. 

 

I don't follow your thought process, the number of serious or fatal accidents to those other than the cyclist themselves is relatively low. 

By your reasoning why isn't everyone identifiable, I don't ride a pedal bike, but I don't want to live in a world where the law abiding majority are regulated to death due to a idiotic minority, particularly when the person likely to suffer from idiotic behaviour, is the person responsible. 

[GingerCat]

2 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

I don't follow your thought process, the number of serious or fatal accidents to those other than the cyclist themselves is relatively low. 

By your reasoning why isn't everyone identifiable, I don't ride a pedal bike, but I don't want to live in a world where the law abiding majority are regulated to death due to a idiotic minority, particularly when the person likely to suffer from idiotic behaviour, is the person responsible. 

You deal with a cyclist wiped out by a car or lorry and see if you change your mind. 

[silver pigeon69]

5 hours ago, 12gauge82 said:

But airguns are often used in public places which endangers members of the public, if they were licensed and anyone with one identifiable it would stop people getting away with breaking the law with one. 

BUT they are not allowed to be used in public places except by authorised licensed persons.

So your argument confirms what i am saying that if used in a Public place, like a cycle they should be licensed.

Anyone seen using one (air rifle) in public gives the Police the right to stop and request to see the Licensed permission.

[12gauge82]

5 hours ago, GingerCat said:

You deal with a cyclist wiped out by a car or lorry and see if you change your mind. 

Maybe that explains your view point and my condolences, it's not a nice thing to have to deal with. 

However my point is valid, the reason cars are so regulated and hgvs more so is a mixture of harm caused when things go wrong and likleyhood of it happening often. With cyclist's that test is not met to the same extent of either of those modes of transports, its not even close and is probably closer to being a pedestrian than a car in that respect. 

2 minutes ago, silver pigeon69 said:

BUT they are not allowed to be used in public places except by authorised licensed persons.

So your argument confirms what i am saying that if used in a Public place, like a cycle they should be licensed.

Anyone seen using one (air rifle) in public gives the Police the right to stop and request to see the Licensed permission.

We're splitting hairs now and going off topic but you get my point, unnecessary regulation oftern affects law abiding people more than the offenders, which shares a parallel with the shooting community when many are calling for ever stricter regulations. 

[silver pigeon69]

5 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

 

We're splitting hairs now and going off topic but you get my point, unnecessary regulation oftern affects law abiding people more than the offenders, which shares a parallel with the shooting community when many are calling for ever stricter regulations. 

I agree, however i feel that Cyclists should be accountable/recognisable in some way and that it is a necessary regulation. If you drive in London, then you will clearly see the vast majority of cyclist flouting most of the rules.

[GingerCat]

22 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

 

However my point is valid, the reason cars are so regulated and hgvs more so is a mixture of harm caused when things go wrong and likleyhood of it happening often. With cyclist's that test is not met to the same extent of either of those modes of transports, its not even close and is probably closer to being a pedestrian than a car in that respect. 

 

Cyclists are far more at risk and currently totally unregulated. They have no protection and no responsibilities. That cannot be right can it? When it goes wrong for them it goes very wrong very quickly. Their crumble zone is normally their head through a windscreen.  Helmets should be mandatory. 

They are not easily seen due to their profile and the facts drivers are looking for cars and not bikes. Hi viz should be mandatory. 

When they ride through red lights and the like they are unaccountable. Registration should be mandatory. 

When it goes wrong they are left with serious injuries that incurs cost, to themselves and others,  Insurance should be mandatory. 

[12gauge82]

1 hour ago, GingerCat said:

Cyclists are far more at risk and currently totally unregulated. They have no protection and no responsibilities. That cannot be right can it? When it goes wrong for them it goes very wrong very quickly. Their crumble zone is normally their head through a windscreen.  Helmets should be mandatory. 

They are not easily seen due to their profile and the facts drivers are looking for cars and not bikes. Hi viz should be mandatory. 

When they ride through red lights and the like they are unaccountable. Registration should be mandatory. 

When it goes wrong they are left with serious injuries that incurs cost, to themselves and others,  Insurance should be mandatory. 

They are but it is overwhelmingly their risk, I do not believe we should go around banning things or criminalising people for a risk where they overwhelmingly carry the vast majority for. It could also be argued that much of that risk is offset by the health benefits. 

I am genuinely not a cyclist, I just feel very strongly that government should interfere as little as possible in people's lives, I don't think anyone would want to live in a nanny state.

1 hour ago, silver pigeon69 said:

I agree, however i feel that Cyclists should be accountable/recognisable in some way and that it is a necessary regulation. If you drive in London, then you will clearly see the vast majority of cyclist flouting most of the rules.

I can't really comment on London as I aviod the place like the plauge other than for a few nights out and weekends away. 

[Raja Clavata]

I'll probably get flamed for this (what's new) but I know from experience that it is sometimes safer to "bend the rules" on red lights when on a bike. There are various reasons for this.

I also recall an article that suggested more female cyclists get squashed as a percentage compared to males and this was partially attributed to the fact that women typically adhere more strictly to the rules.

I'd add that there is a difference between bending rules and having zero regard for them and am aware numerous people riding bikes have the latter mentality.

My son just reminded me that a pedestrian called us both idiots the other week when we stopped abruptly to changing lights on a pedestrian crossing, I wonder what she'd have made of us going straight through the lights.

Two changes to legislation I would like are:

1) make wearing a helmet a legal requirement - the number of people I have seen over the years riding bikes with the helmet attached to their rucksack is astonishing.

2) make it a legal requirement to report any and all collisions between cyclists and pedestrians.

[AVB]

1 hour ago, Raja Clavata said:

I'll probably get flamed for this (what's new) but I know from experience that it is sometimes safer to "bend the rules" on red lights when on a bike. There are various reasons for this.

I also recall an article that suggested more female cyclists get squashed as a percentage compared to males and this was partially attributed to the fact that women typically adhere more strictly to the rules.

I'd add that there is a difference between bending rules and having zero regard for them and am aware numerous people riding bikes have the latter mentality.

My son just reminded me that a pedestrian called us both idiots the other week when we stopped abruptly to changing lights on a pedestrian crossing, I wonder what she'd have made of us going straight through the lights.

Two changes to legislation I would like are:

1) make wearing a helmet a legal requirement - the number of people I have seen over the years riding bikes with the helmet attached to their rucksack is astonishing.

2) make it a legal requirement to report any and all collisions between cyclists and pedestrians.

I don’t agree with point 1. I also don’t agree with compulsory motorcycle helmets and car seatbelts. Would I wear one, absolutely, but don’t believe it is the states job to enforce. 

[12gauge82]

14 minutes ago, AVB said:

I don’t agree with point 1. I also don’t agree with compulsory motorcycle helmets and car seatbelts. Would I wear one, absolutely, but don’t believe it is the states job to enforce. 

Spot on. 

[silver pigeon69]

3 hours ago, Raja Clavata said:

I'll probably get flamed for this (what's new) but I know from experience that it is sometimes safer to "bend the rules" on red lights when on a bike. There are various reasons for this.

 

Can you explain how please? 

[WalkedUp]

Yes it is. The state has put a lot of effort and money into making you a productive member of society for the first 20 odd years of your life. Each early death of working age citizens hits our GDP. 

[silver pigeon69]

Raja -Or give some examples?

 

Edited October 9, 2020 by silver pigeon69

[Yellow Bear]

20 hours ago, silver pigeon69 said:

I agree, however i feel that Cyclists should be accountable/recognisable in some way and that it is a necessary regulation. If you drive then you will clearly see the vast majority of cyclist "bending" most of the rules.

Sorry I felt it needed correction. Where I now reside there are few lights but I still see cyclists daily that "bend the rules".