Putin announces 'military operation' in Ukraine.

[Rewulf]

2 hours ago, Dave-G said:

I'm wondering if most of us just assumed Cretin implied nuclear when he threatened words to the effect of retaliation with something not seen before - maybe he's thinking chemical or biological.

Maybe hes thinking of releasing a 'deadly' flu virus against the rest of the world , that barely affects his own people , but forces everyone else to hide in their homes , not go to work , crash their economies , become paranoid about their health , and enables world governments to bring in draconian laws , with forced vaccination ?

Nah , thats so far fetched , its ridiculous  would never work .

[Dave-G]

27 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Maybe hes thinking of releasing a 'deadly' flu virus against the rest of the world , that barely affects his own people , but forces everyone else to hide in their homes , not go to work , crash their economies , become paranoid about their health , and enables world governments to bring in draconian laws , with forced vaccination ?

Nah , thats so far fetched , its ridiculous  would never work .

Lol, but Covid was just the R&D practice run. 

[Rewulf]

1 minute ago, Dave-G said:

Lol, but Covid was just the R&D practice run. 

Many a true word said in jest mate .

[Smokersmith]

On 24/02/2022 at 13:19, Smokersmith said:

Clearly a plan to weaken the West through the Chinese virus and strike before we recover 😜

Posted the above on Feb 24th … surprisingly it’s taken a month for the “free thinking folks” to come to say it out loud🤣

[Rewulf]

6 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

Posted the above on Feb 24th … surprisingly it’s taken a month for the “free thinking folks” to come to say it out loud🤣

I never spotted it , but if you want the credit for thinking it first ..... OK then !!

Welcome brother , to the lodge of the tin foilers , wear your hat with pride 

On a more serious note, why would they not , if they could get away with it, distraction techniques , including hacking, sleepers and 5th column style tactics are all considered credible  means of waging pre war these days ?
So to consider a pandemic that could weaken the target nations ability to fight too far fetched ?

Im not saying Russia, or even China did deliberately do this , but to not consider it , is inherently foolish..

[Smokersmith]

Let's consider it then ... if Putin was behind the virus, why would he wait till vaccines have been developed and deployed before striking? Currently Covid hasn't featured in a single article covering the conflict from Ukraine.

Think about the horrific scenes in Italy at the start of the pandemic ... how would that level of disease have impacted those sheltering together in the underground networks of Ukraine over recent weeks ... that's how to hurt a nation.

 

So ... I've considered it, and put it in the utter horse carp file.

 

He will not achieve his stated goals. China won't help Putin as he's backed a loser. He's destroyed one nation and plunged his own back 30 years.

Let's let history decide, but I can't see 'master tactician' being engraved anywhere just yet.

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Smokersmith
Typo

[Scully]

11 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

 

 

So ... I've considered it, and put it in the utter horse carp file.

 

 

 

Likewise. 👍

[Rewulf]

28 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

Let's consider it then ... if Putin was behind the virus, why would he wait till vaccines have been developed and deployed before striking? Currently Covid hasn't featured in a single article covering the conflict from Ukraine.

Think about the horrific scenes in Italy at the start of the pandemic ... how would that level of disease have impacted those sheltering together in the underground networks of Ukraine over recent weeks ... that's how to hurt a nation.

 

So ... I've considered it, and put it in the utter horse carp file.

I think you may have taken what I said a bit too literally 

Did I not say this ?

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

Im not saying Russia, or even China did deliberately do this

Do you not think NATO considered it , at ANY level ?
Warfare in the 21st century isnt going to be soldiers lining up in neat lines on a battlefield, all aspects of attack need to be considered.

32 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

He will not achieve his stated goals. China won't help Putin as he's backed a loser. He's destroyed one nation and plunged his own back 30 years.

Well that really depends on what Chinas ultimate aims are , if they have one ally against the US/NATO its Russia, why would they not help their enemies enemy ?

But if you want my prediction , it wont be anything like 30 years before Russia is back to at least where it was.
In 5 years China will be a dominant world power , with a vast improved military, and for that , it needs Russian oil products, Putin knows this , he also knows Northern Europe needs his gas.
So poor tactics aside, he knows the long game and is playing it.

[Mice!]

Channel 4 news is interesting at the moment, can't believe that Martin Bashir is questioning how Poland treated apparent refugees from Belarus compared to those from the Ukraine.

The Polish deputy foreign minister said they've been preparing for this for months, and that the previous refugees were sent deliberately to destabilise the area and not real refugees.

He wasn't cowed by MB spoke well and clearly saying what needed to be said.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

16 minutes ago, Mice! said:

Channel 4 news is interesting at the moment, can't believe that Martin Bashir is questioning how Poland treated apparent refugees from Belarus compared to those from the Ukraine.

The Polish deputy foreign minister said they've been preparing for this for months, and that the previous refugees were sent deliberately to destabilise the area and not real refugees.

He wasn't cowed by MB spoke well and clearly saying what needed to be said.

Yes that was an interesting interview.

[oldypigeonpopper]

23 minutes ago, Mice! said:

Channel 4 news is interesting at the moment, can't believe that Martin Bashir is questioning how Poland treated apparent refugees from Belarus compared to those from the Ukraine.

The Polish deputy foreign minister said they've been preparing for this for months, and that the previous refugees were sent deliberately to destabilise the area and not real refugees.

He wasn't cowed by MB spoke well and clearly saying what needed to be said.

Missed that 🤔🙄

[Mice!]

1 hour ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Missed that 🤔🙄

It'll be on catch up,  7pm news.

1 hour ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Yes that was an interesting interview.

I ran it back to listen again! interesting that Poland are saying they have been saying it'll happen for months and have been preparing,  probably because they know how it's going to affect them,  but I wonder if they were just ignored and it was put down to paranoia?

[ordnance]

On 12/03/2022 at 23:57, Dave-G said:

So was the bit about US admitting it on TV one day and denying it the next truth or BS?

And/or, as you've raised doubt over it, is just the 'US' bit BS - or are you questioning if there are bio labs in Ukraine at all?... some could be US funded in a carefully concealed way that got rapidly covered up - I read something about papers being burned in a bonfire outside one.

After splurging time on Google, as it seems we'll all have to do now: it seems its the propaganda bit that raised your concern - we all know propaganda is often simply twisting a slant on things.

https://scheerpost.com/2022/03/11/victoria-nuland-ukraine-has-biological-research-facilities-worried-russia-may-seize-them/

More: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Victoria+Nuland+bio+labs+Ukraine&ei=0z0tYpvgENGZgQbTlpngDw&ved=0ahUKEwjblYSl7cH2AhXRTMAKHVNLBvwQ4dUDCA4&oq=Victoria+Nuland+bio+labs+Ukraine&gs_lcp=Cgdnd3Mtd2l6EAwyBQgAEMQCOgQIABANSgQIQRgASgQIRhgAUJIMWOMnYNFLaAFwAXgAgAGWAogBugaSAQU4LjAuMZgBAKABAcABAQ&sclient=gws-wiz

So where do you suggest we fact check everything before pasting a link?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_is_not_a_reliable_source

I don't care and cant be bothered looking if their are labs in Ukraine, reason if they exist or not is nothing to do with why Russia invaded. Do you think their are no biological or chemical weapons labs in Russia. Let me think Novichok, I wonder where it came from. 

[Mice!]

4 minutes ago, ordnance said:

Let me think Novichok, I wonder where it came from. 

China 😳

[oowee]

Looking increasingly likely that a deal is in the air to avoid a stalemate. How long will the sanctions resolve last post deal, i wonder?

[Jaymo]

12 minutes ago, oowee said:

Looking increasingly likely that a deal is in the air to avoid a stalemate. How long will the sanctions resolve last post deal, i wonder?

Bloody hope so. 

[ordnance]

14 minutes ago, oowee said:

Looking increasingly likely that a deal is in the air to avoid a stalemate. How long will the sanctions resolve last post deal, i wonder?

I wonder will Russia paying for the damage they did in Ukraine be part of a deal if there is one, sanctions should stay until they do. Russia / Putin should be allowed to walk away with anything they can spin as a victory. 

Edited March 15, 2022 by ordnance

[Mice!]

17 minutes ago, oowee said:

Looking increasingly likely that a deal is in the air to avoid a stalemate. How long will the sanctions resolve last post deal, i wonder?

I can't see Russia making any deals that leaves them losing face.

This was why I said the Ukraine shouldn't have resisted,  I doubt Russia expected such resistance but how long is it going to take to repair and rebuild the damage done?

And what stops Russia doing it again?

[oowee]

8 minutes ago, Mice! said:

I can't see Russia making any deals that leaves them losing face.

 

And what stops Russia doing it again?

Nothing with Ukraine out of NATO. 

 

[Mungler]

6 minutes ago, Mice! said:

I can't see Russia making any deals that leaves them losing face.

This was why I said the Ukraine shouldn't have resisted,  I doubt Russia expected such resistance but how long is it going to take to repair and rebuild the damage done?

And what stops Russia doing it again?

The Ukrainians have certainly taken one for team Europe. Indeed, it’s a good job they took a stand - if the Russians were at the border of France, do you ever see the French cultural snobs sacrificing their precious Paris to maintain sovereignty? Not a chance. 

I can’t see Putin having another go for a while, or he’ll at least think twice perhaps.

 

[ordnance]

Quote

This was why I said the Ukraine shouldn't have resisted,  I doubt Russia expected such resistance but how long is it going to take to repair and rebuild the damage done?

Seriously they should not have resisted, and just let a gangster Mafia run country Russia take over their country. If they made it that easy for Putin do you think he would have stopped there. Its as well Great Britain didn't think like that during WW2. 

Quote

And what stops Russia doing it again?

The same thing that is stopping them this time, the Ukrainians. Of course countries could avoid being invaded for a second time by throwing their hands up the first time and surrendering. Sounds like a cunning plan, its a wonder the Ukrainians never thought of that 

Edited March 15, 2022 by ordnance

[Mice!]

1 minute ago, oowee said:

Nothing with Ukraine out of NATO. 

 

That's the thing, this is the third time now, I'm not sure if this is the biggest because I didn't follow what happened in Crimea or Belarus,  I don't recall it being anything like this big?

6 minutes ago, Mungler said:

The Ukrainians have certainly taken one for team Europe. Indeed, it’s a good job they took a stand - if the Russians were at the border of France, do you ever see the French cultural snobs sacrificing their precious Paris to maintain sovereignty? Not a chance. 

I can’t see Putin having another go for a while, or he’ll at least think twice perhaps.

 

Three times now he's done this now with no repercussions to him, just the Russian people, I don't see him giving up the territory they've taken.

[oowee]

Interesting quote from Ukraine that they expend ammunition in a day what the West supplies in a week. 

I remember from field battle trials easily expending 700 rounds in a day. That was until i realised just how hard my SLR would be to clean afterwards. 

[Mice!]

6 minutes ago, ordnance said:

Seriously they should not have resisted, and just let a gangster Mafia run country Russia take over their country. If they made it that easy for Putin do you think he would have stopped there. Its as well Great Britain didn't think like that during WW2. 

The same thing that is stopping them this time, the Ukrainians. Of course countries could avoid being invaded for a second time by throwing their hands up the first time and surrendering  

It's only going to be settled through negotiation,  the Ukrainian people are resisting bravely but the cities are being trashed in the process,  they are on there own and they know it.

I think it was @oowee that said about the Ukraine government and being corrupt which is why they aren't in NATO.

And this isn't a world war, that's what's being avoided at all costs, I'm sure if the Russians decided to take the gloves off the West might be forced to act rather than watch.

[ordnance]

Quote

It's only going to be settled through negotiation,  the Ukrainian people are resisting bravely but the cities are being trashed in the process,  they are on there own and they know it.

The UK was trashed during WW2, and for a while it stood alone, should they have thrown their hands up and let Hitler invade.  If the Ukrainians did as you suggested their would be no need for negation, they would be ruled by Russian gangsters. Sounds like you are blaming the destruction in Ukraine on the Ukrainians for not surrendering, rather than Putin for invading. 

Edited March 15, 2022 by ordnance