Fight for the future of game shooting - have you had your say?

[Old farrier]

1 minute ago, HantsRob said:

OF,

Lets round off this discussion by saying I am humbled once again by your kindness. Most of the reply can go privately. But publicly I would love to learn, understand, and appreciate. Whether that is observing, sharing, etc. The details are not relevant publicly, but I would love to understand more and come with you in some form. Whether I pull a trigger or just take enjoyment from an experience, as experiences are priceless either way.

Thankyou, humbly, for your continued support. Words cannot express my gratitude.

Not a problem we should sort out the details by private message and you will then hopefully be able to get a better understanding of the game shooting and the whole spectrum of the sport 

Thank you for taking the offer 😊👍

[jall25]

On 17/04/2023 at 10:21, Old farrier said:

Not a problem we should sort out the details by private message and you will then hopefully be able to get a better understanding of the game shooting and the whole spectrum of the sport 

Thank you for taking the offer 😊👍

Superb !

Be lovely to see what Rob thinks !

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Good on Old Farrier and well done to Rob for taking him up.

I know both and they are genuinely nice guys.

[Conor O'Gorman]

If you have yet to respond to the consultation please watch this statement by Welsh Climate Minister Julie James MS in a debate last night about the benefits of shooting for people and nature in Wales. If you have responded please spread the word.

https://www.facebook.com/BASCuk/videos/1376796739829619/

 

[Poor Shot]

What really concerns me with that video is the repeated use of the phrase "I do not think". Are ministers not elected to serve the population and act in the interests of the population despite potential conflict with their own beliefs? 

In Wales we are rapidly heading towards a dictatorship style of governance which is based entirely on thoughts and feelings of those in charge. This is based not only on the current ongoing game licensing proposals but the whole child smacking, 20MPH zones and upcoming proposals to charge people to drive within the city of Cardiff and countless other schemes being introduced against the general will of the population. Countless proposals at both government and council levels brought to public via consultations and the result of which blatantly ignored and proposals pushed through anyway. The most recent of which (based in RCT) is the proposal to change refuse collections from two to three weeks of which a huge majority of residents responded to in disagreement yet we are now faced with three weekly collections.

It just stinks of a group of quite liberal people introducing and changing laws based on their own view and beliefs based on being (or the feeling of) nigh on untouchable. At both government and council level, leaders are untouchable as they know that it's extremely unlikely that a Labor government will lose the majority in wales and a little less than likely that a labor councilor will loose their position in council. 

I truly believe that unless we see monumental changes within the way people in Wales vote in the next election then the end of field sports in wales is a done deal. I believe that by 2030 even catch and release fishing and clay pigeon shooting will be banned in Wales with the killing of any live quarry for any reason a distant memory. 

A truly awful time to be alive. 

[greylag]

I watched this debate yesterday and it should be a clarion call to everyone who shoots in Wales and beyond that if we don't take some action the days of sport shooting are finished  in Wales.The minister said that the Welsh Government is against any form of live shooting .

We cannot just lay down and let these ministers take this vital way of life away from us.

I am convinced the Welsh labour ministers are not fully aware of how many of their supporters

 they are going to loose when these new laws come in. If you or any of your friends or family haven't replied to the consultation please do so quickly.

 

 

[udderlyoffroad]

3 hours ago, Conor O'Gorman said:

If you have yet to respond to the consultation please watch this statement by Welsh Climate Minister Julie James MS in a debate last night about the benefits of shooting for people and nature in Wales. If you have responded please spread the word.

https://www.facebook.com/BASCuk/videos/1376796739829619/

 

Have you got a non-Facebook link Conor?

 

Edited April 27, 2023 by udderlyoffroad

[Poor Shot]

10 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

Have you got a non-Facebook link Conor?

 

http://www.senedd.tv/Meeting/Archive/abb7c535-6551-40a2-9cb1-eafbc0290c5c?autostart=True#

Starts at 03.37:15

Just now, Poor Shot said:

http://www.senedd.tv/Meeting/Archive/abb7c535-6551-40a2-9cb1-eafbc0290c5c?autostart=True#

Starts at 03.37:15

Its about 15-20 minutes long in total but the key parts to listen to is when the minister is dragged away from her scripted reply and presents her personal opinion.

[Scully]

The sheer arrogance of these people infuriates me; it’s not up to them to dictate what people should and shouldn’t be doing.

The next logical step is to tell people that in a civilised society they shouldn’t be eating meat. Chip chip chip. 

[harkom]

7 hours ago, Poor Shot said:

What really concerns me with that video is the repeated use of the phrase "I do not think". Are ministers not elected to serve the population and act in the interests of the population despite potential conflict with their own beliefs? 

In Wales we are rapidly heading towards a dictatorship style of governance which is based entirely on thoughts and feelings of those in charge. This is based not only on the current ongoing game licensing proposals but the whole child smacking, 20MPH zones and upcoming proposals to charge people to drive within the city of Cardiff and countless other schemes being introduced against the general will of the population. Countless proposals at both government and council levels brought to public via consultations and the result of which blatantly ignored and proposals pushed through anyway. The most recent of which (based in RCT) is the proposal to change refuse collections from two to three weeks of which a huge majority of residents responded to in disagreement yet we are now faced with three weekly collections.

It just stinks of a group of quite liberal people introducing and changing laws based on their own view and beliefs based on being (or the feeling of) nigh on untouchable. At both government and council level, leaders are untouchable as they know that it's extremely unlikely that a Labor government will lose the majority in wales and a little less than likely that a labor councilor will loose their position in council. 

I truly believe that unless we see monumental changes within the way people in Wales vote in the next election then the end of field sports in wales is a done deal. I believe that by 2030 even catch and release fishing and clay pigeon shooting will be banned in Wales with the killing of any live quarry for any reason a distant memory. 

A truly awful time to be alive. 

A great synopsis of the entire situation ....well,er, huh? ....apart from the last line.

[Scully]

Just a thought. I’m assuming this woman’s opinion/intention encompasses angling also?

There must surely be a lot more anglers than shooters in Wales? 

[grahamch]

On 27/04/2023 at 11:20, Conor O'Gorman said:

If you have yet to respond to the consultation please watch this statement by Welsh Climate Minister Julie James MS in a debate last night about the benefits of shooting for people and nature in Wales. If you have responded please spread the word.

https://www.facebook.com/BASCuk/videos/1376796739829619/

 

Did she look in the mirror before leaving the house?

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

In BASC's latest Podcast (Ep. 34) hear from people and businesses impacted by proposals to ban gamebird releasing in Wales.

Click here to listen to the BASC Podcast

Responding to the consultation (via a public opinion survey) only takes a few minutes to complete. All you have to do is add your name and answer NO to Qs 4 to 8

Click here to start the public opinion survey

 

[Poor Shot]

16 hours ago, Scully said:

Just a thought. I’m assuming this woman’s opinion/intention encompasses angling also?

There must surely be a lot more anglers than shooters in Wales? 

It encompasses all fieldsports from top to bottom. Anything that involves an animal.

They've set their sights on greyhound racing and now horse racing following this year's Grand National and all the fuss made over some horses being eithanised due to injury.

Farming of livestock is also high on their ban list.

 

[Genghis]

On 27/04/2023 at 18:42, Scully said:

The sheer arrogance of these people infuriates me; it’s not up to them to dictate what people should and shouldn’t be doing.

The next logical step is to tell people that in a civilised society they shouldn’t be eating meat. Chip chip chip. 

Given the size of that woman, i doubt she’s against the eating of meat in general.

She must think that all of the meat she buys from the supermarket comes from animals that died of natural causes.

[Keith 66]

Well that vid made my wee boil, reminds me of Millie Tant from Viz magazine.

Trouble is you cant reason with them at any level, this was driven home to me the other night when i popped into the yacht club for a couple of jars, An old friend & his wife was there with their daughter, late 30's, intelligent, good job, lovely girl, Hadnt seen her for years. A few more people turned up & a good conversation was had.

The subject of deer locally & across the country came up, Now locally muntjac numbers have exploded but there is zero control like most areas. She objected to any form of control for any reason, "Its cruel". Trophy hunting & the ramifications of our government banning import of big game trophies then came up, Same again, "Its cruel" No thought that the fees paid by hunters pays for the wages & very existence of the conservation departments of the countries where it takes place. A couple of us pushed this point until in the end she refused to argue with us & literally just stuck her fingers in her ears.

To people like her & the wind filled hippy in the video there is no argument or middle ground allowed, democratic debate is alien, Unfortunately they are everywhere, local & national government, opposition, councils & education.

They are so utterly convinced of their own righteousness it is terrifying.

[McSpredder]

Please warn your non-shooting acquaintances that this minister’s attitudes could damage leisure activities totally un-connected with field sports.

How does she think elite sports teams can be assembled if the mass of the population is only able to practise and develop skills on pitches with rabbit holes and mole hills?   A big city stadium may be able to exclude pests, but the cost of installing rabbit-proof and mole-proof fencing around every village football pitch and every rural school playing field would be astronomic (steel mole netting can cost £10/m).  

Would Wales have much chance of hosting major golfing events if the fairways were likely to be pock-marked with burrows, and molehills might appear overnight on the greens?  

Would you send your child for riding lessons at an equestrian centre with rabbit holes?   Maybe safer to take her across the border into England.

Rats and mice in a sports pavilion?   They might damage the structure, gnaw through wiring and initiate a life-threatening fire, or spread disease by urinating all over the kitchen area, but it’s a leisure facility, so the Welsh Government minister apparently regards the killing of such rodents to be uncivilised.

The minister has said: "Personally I'm a lifelong vegetarian but there is nothing wrong with eating meat…”, so she obviously thinks animal slaughter is OK.   What she abhors is the pleasure, not the killing, but how would she feel if those abattoir staff actually enjoyed their work?   Is she just a smug politician, strutting around in her highly paid post, looking down on the people who do the dirty work and hoping that they are having a miserable time in their rather poorly paid jobs?  

If a Local Authority pest controller enjoyed killing rats, or an RSPB employee enjoyed shooting foxes, would that be uncivilised?   Or is the minister’s contempt reserved for farmers and amateur pest controllers?

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

Powys meeting raises fears of catastrophic game shooting restrictions

Representatives from the British Association for Shooting and Conservation, Countryside Alliance, Game and Wildlife Conservation Trust and National Gamekeepers’ Organisation spoke of concerns they had over damage that could be caused to conservation, the local economy and rural communities through restricting shooting.

They were joined by local Conservative politicians, Craig Williams, MP for Montgomeryshire and Parliamentary Secretary to the Prime Minister; Russell George, MS for Montgomeryshire; and Simon Baynes, MP for Clwyd South.

Representatives from each shooting organisation spoke of the importance of responding to the consultation and having the voices on the ground heard.

A spokesperson for the shooting organisations said: “The NRW consultation is the biggest threat to shooting that Wales has seen to date. It is essential to respond to this if you are involved either directly or indirectly with shooting in Wales.

 “It was great to get in front of a packed hall and speak to those who would be affected the most should the Welsh Government ban the releasing of gamebirds in Wales. It will be catastrophic for rural communities across Wales both in terms of conservation and the economy and, of course, people’s health and wellbeing.” 

Powys Country Times

Shropshire Star

[Conor O'Gorman]

Consultation closes on Tuesday (20 June).

BASC helped facilitate TV interviews with the BBC and S4C that aired yesterday. Balanced coverage with NRW on back foot. Links below - note they may expire at 7pm tonight. 

Watch S4C from 21 minutes: 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p0frl9vf/newyddion-s4c-thu-15-jun-2023-1930 

 

Watch BBC Wales from 17 minutes:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m001mywq/bbc-wales-today-evening-news-15062023 

Edited June 16, 2023 by Conor O'Gorman

[Poor Shot]

An unexpected reply from the Plaid Cymru representative this late in the day. I've posted below, lots of waffle and kind of sounds like they are telling us what we want to hear with enough caveats to renege on it should they ever see power. 

Thank you for reaching out to Plaid Cymru regarding our party's policy position on the release and shooting of game birds. We appreciate your interest in this matter and would like to provide you with a stock response that outlines our stance. 
Plaid Cymru recognizes the cultural and economic significance of game shooting in Wales. We understand that it can contribute to rural economies, support employment, and provide recreational opportunities for many individuals. However, we also believe that it is essential to adopt a balanced and sustainable approach to this activity, taking into account various considerations. 

First and foremost, Plaid Cymru emphasizes the importance of animal welfare. We believe that the treatment and welfare of game birds should be a priority, ensuring that their breeding, rearing, and release practices adhere to stringent standards. It is crucial to minimize stress, suffering, and any negative impacts on the natural ecosystem. 

Furthermore, we advocate for the conservation of biodiversity and the protection of habitats. Plaid Cymru supports the responsible management of shooting estates to ensure that they do not harm local ecosystems, flora, and fauna. We believe in promoting sustainable practices that safeguard the balance between game shooting and the environment. 
In addition, Plaid Cymru recognizes the importance of consulting and engaging with local communities, including conservation organizations, farmers, landowners, and relevant stakeholders. We believe that decisions regarding the release and shooting of game birds should be made in collaboration with these groups to ensure a comprehensive understanding of local perspectives and concerns. 

Plaid Cymru also supports measures to address any illegal activities associated with game shooting, such as the persecution of protected species or the use of prohibited methods. We believe in enforcing existing legislation and implementing effective monitoring and enforcement mechanisms to prevent any unlawful practices. 
In summary, Plaid Cymru supports the release and shooting of game birds in Wales, recognizing its cultural and economic significance. However, we advocate for a balanced approach that prioritizes animal welfare, biodiversity conservation, community engagement, and the prevention of illegal activities. By striking this balance, we aim to ensure the long-term sustainability and responsible management of game shooting in Wales. 

[Scully]

Couldn’t watch the first one; presenter has an awful cold. Could probably do with some Covinia or similar to clear his throat. 👍

[Gas seal]

Plaid Cymru emphasises the importance of animal welfare. Conservation ,biodiversity,and habitats.  illegal  activities, monitoring and enforcement. I don’t do this type of shooting but in my experience it’s better to meet with all concerned . It’s always better to make the first move than leaving it until the last minute.

[Conor O'Gorman]

Natural Resources Wales have confirmed 42,000 responses to the consultation, which closed yesterday.

Click link below for more information

https://basc.org.uk/welsh-gamebird-release-proposals-breach-human-rights-law/ 

Click link below to download BASC's consultation response

https://basc.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/BASC-response-NRW-gamebird-release-consultation.pdf 

[PeterHenry]

@Conor O'Gorman that sounds promising - I don't suppose there is a rough estimate of for / against available yet?

[Conor O'Gorman]

3 hours ago, PeterHenry said:

@Conor O'Gorman that sounds promising - I don't suppose there is a rough estimate of for / against available yet?

We should expect further details when/if Natural Resources Wales publishes a summary of responses to the consultation, which is usual practice, but we are perhaps in new territory here with a potential win for shooting on the public opinion survey which won't suit the agenda of an anti-shooting Welsh government.