The Budget

[Flashman]

4 minutes ago, oowee said:

At least they have let the OBR have sight and comment on the budget unlike previous.

You don’t understand my previous comment. 

I presume you work (or not) in a State entity, so much of the budget won’t affect you. 

[shaun4860]

2 hours ago, CaptC said:

At least we 1.7% off a pint!

You won’t, it will be sucked up by the NI employers increase.

[Mice!]

5 hours ago, Weihrauch17 said:

It is if you are an Employer!  Raynor's new workers rights Bill, minimum wage up and NI up and thresholds down.  They will pass on the costs with less jobs so less Tax take for Mrs Thieves.

They'll put prices up to cover costs, so it's going to cost people more, but the Gov can claim they didn't put the prices(tax) up.

I've not looked at much yet, but the IHT, shocking, your already taxed on earnings,  savings, and now what you leave your family will be taxed again. 

Death and taxes, then taxes again.

[Mungler]

I posted this in the other budget thread, and here it is again. Farage nails it.

 

 

[Good shot?]

5 hours ago, marsh man said:

Did I see something about an extra £100 on petrol car road tax   MM

I am just about to renew my wife's 23 year old Nissan Micra car tax that does between 5 & 600 miles per year. The car tax is £210. 😡 Hope it has not gone up before tomorrow.

[Weihrauch17]

1 hour ago, Mice! said:

They'll put prices up to cover costs, so it's going to cost people more, but the Gov can claim they didn't put the prices(tax) up.

I've not looked at much yet, but the IHT, shocking, your already taxed on earnings,  savings, and now what you leave your family will be taxed again. 

Death and taxes, then taxes again.

Yep my aim all my working life has been to sort my kids out, never had a new car fancy house or fancy holidays.  In come Labour to take Income Tax plus now IHT on my SIPP where all my money went into my Pension went so 67% tax to spend on illegals and the bottomless pit of a totally useless Civil Service and NHS.  I can't begin to describe the utter hatred I feel for this Govt.  Landowners (and Businesses) who are asset rich but cash strapped, what are they going to do?  Sell out to Solar and Wind and stop producing food?  Insane policies from an insane Govt

Edited October 31 by Weihrauch17

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, While watching all the news on the Budget one thing i noticed on Farming and the families that look after their farms which i am sure most on PW have permissions for shooting , They are on the 3rd generation on my friends farm as my dear farmer friend in his 80s recently passed away , Will the Inheritance tax make more land being sold or is that the idea for Labours plan on more Housing ????, 

[marsh man]

6 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, While watching all the news on the Budget one thing i noticed on Farming and the families that look after their farms which i am sure most on PW have permissions for shooting , They are on the 3rd generation on my friends farm as my dear farmer friend in his 80s recently passed away , Will the Inheritance tax make more land being sold or is that the idea for Labours plan on more Housing ????, 

That was front page news in our local paper this morning , but how I read it the inheritance tax changes are on farm that are valued at £1 million or over , under that they are as they were    MM

[oldypigeonpopper]

39 minutes ago, marsh man said:

That was front page news in our local paper this morning , but how I read it the inheritance tax changes are on farm that are valued at £1 million or over , under that they are as they were    MM

Hello, How may farms are worth less than £ 1 Million ?? My friends farm is worth at least 18 million

Edited October 31 by oldypigeonpopper

[amateur]

1 hour ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, How may farms are worth less than £ 1 Million ?? My friends farm is worth at least 18 million

This merely shows up Labour's ridiculously outdated thinking.

The "rich" is anyone having assets of over £1m.

Anyone in the London area (and some parts of Cheshire!) owning anything like a half-decent house automatically qualifies.

[oldypigeonpopper]

3 minutes ago, amateur said:

This merely shows up Labour's ridiculously outdated thinking.

The "rich" is anyone having assets of over £1m.

Anyone in the London area (and some parts of Cheshire!) owning anything like a half-decent house automatically qualifies.

Hello, Wait and see what Starmer and Reeves net worth after the next general election ??

[JohnfromUK]

Like many of us, I would hope and wish to leave something to my various 'family descendants' which in my cases are nieces and nephews on my death, but as always there are difficulties arranging this;

1. I don't know when I will die, so I don't know how much I will need to keep to live out my days and how much will be 'left'.
2. I don't know how much (if any) will be left after any care I may need etc.
3. I don't know what the rules will be at the time I die

Added to this, assuming I leave an 'estate' of more than £325K (very likely as I own my house and have some savings), inheritance tax (IHT) will have to be paid before probate and so nothing can be sold to raise money, so in effect the IHT due has to be borrowed (unless the beneficiaries have spare cash to hand).  I'm told probate on estates with IHT due can take now over a year due to Gov't depts delays and inefficiencies.

Like many, I had a 'plan' in place in that I have been leaving my pension 'pot' untouched as long as I can - as that falls outside my 'estate' and so is not subject to IHT and can be cashed in before probate to provide funding to pay IHT.   That would have paid any inheritance tax due.  It is a very common, sensible and good plan making it easy for the beneficiaries, easy for HMRC as they can be paid quickly and probate organised (more) quickly and easily sorted without the need to borrow money (which as a bridging loan is expensive).

The Chancellor has now said that from April 2027 pension pots will be treated as an inclusive part of the deceased's estate - and so will be subject to tax themselves and also not available until after probate.  This will make obtaining probate much harder and costly.

For many, this is a massive change and will hit relatives hard, both financially and in terms of additional worry at a difficult time.  Sheer malice by the Chancellor.

[Mungler]

2 hours ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, How may farms are worth less than £ 1 Million ?? My friends farm is worth at least 18 million

Most farmers are asset rich and cash poor. 

I still can’t get my head round the attack on business property relief for farmers.

I guess Labour just have it in for anyone with land or assets. 

[JohnfromUK]

8 minutes ago, Mungler said:

I guess Labour just have it in for anyone with land or assets. 

A mix of spite and jealousy

[Rob85]

Would almost sound like the start of long term collectivism on the farmland reminiscent of how the communists operated in Russia after the revolution. Except this time instead of just outright taking it they will make it so unaffordable to keep that over years they will get it anyway. Some of the government land grab will go to housing, some to solar panels and eventually they could just run some as government funded farms. Pay people a pittance to farm the land and sell the goods to the plebs at rock bottom prices.

Maybe I'm thinking too much "1984"

[Flashman]

It’s a hateful and vindictive budget, only benefiting those who evade taxation or those who are new enough to the country that don’t yet have assets easily traced by HMRC. 

First & second generation migrants probably won’t hit the IHT, CGT or business taxes threshold.  Those who flit  between other countries where they hold dual nationality or other family won’t worry about these taxes.  

The only people who will pay are the middle classes - those who own property to be handed down, farmers and those not rich enough to afford or benefit from estate planning. 

You were told by the Tories that Labour would do this, so don’t bleat now that Labour do what they always do - soak the rich (or nowadays, soak the “not poor”).

Edited October 31 by Flashman

[ditchman]

1 hour ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, Wait and see what Starmer and Reeves net worth after the next general election ??

very very valid point

[oowee]

40 minutes ago, Mungler said:

Most farmers are asset rich and cash poor. 

I still can’t get my head round the attack on business property relief for farmers.

I guess Labour just have it in for anyone with land or assets. 

Wow.

It's a bit rich to whinge about the property relief for farmers and at the same time celebrate the Brexit vote which was surely the biggest kick in the nether regions for farmers since foot and mouth?

Every astute farmer I know with an asset over a £1m has the farm in a company structure so no gains to pay.  

[Mice!]

1 hour ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, Wait and see what Starmer and Reeves net worth after the next general election ??

I couldn't care less what they are worth, it's the normal folk running a business with a nice house who are going to get rinsed.

47 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

Like many of us, I would hope and wish to leave something to my various 'family descendants' which in my cases are nieces and nephews on my death, but as always there are difficulties arranging this;

1. I don't know when I will die, so I don't know how much I will need to keep to live out my days and how much will be 'left'.
2. I don't know how much (if any) will be left after any care I may need etc.
3. I don't know what the rules will be at the time I die

Added to this, assuming I leave an 'estate' of more than £325K (very likely as I own my house and have some savings), inheritance tax (IHT) will have to be paid before probate and so nothing can be sold to raise money, so in effect the IHT due has to be borrowed (unless the beneficiaries have spare cash to hand).  I'm told probate on estates with IHT due can take now over a year due to Gov't depts delays and inefficiencies.

Like many, I had a 'plan' in place in that I have been leaving my pension 'pot' untouched as long as I can - as that falls outside my 'estate' and so is not subject to IHT and can be cashed in before probate to provide funding to pay IHT.   That would have paid any inheritance tax due.  It is a very common, sensible and good plan making it easy for the beneficiaries, easy for HMRC as they can be paid quickly and probate organised (more) quickly and easily sorted without the need to borrow money (which as a bridging loan is expensive).

The Chancellor has now said that from April 2027 pension pots will be treated as an inclusive part of the deceased's estate - and so will be subject to tax themselves and also not available until after probate.  This will make obtaining probate much harder and costly.

For many, this is a massive change and will hit relatives hard, both financially and in terms of additional worry at a difficult time.  Sheer malice by the Chancellor.

Have you looked at the 7 year thing, I'm sure you can or could gift money and if you live more than 7 years afterwards there's no tax, I could be very wrong but it's worth looking at, you could gift it, hoping you live past the 7 years, with them knowing you may need some back, I'm sure it could be worked out?

1 hour ago, amateur said:

This merely shows up Labour's ridiculously outdated thinking.

The "rich" is anyone having assets of over £1m.

Anyone in the London area (and some parts of Cheshire!) owning anything like a half-decent house automatically qualifies.

Not just those areas, many many houses these days are £300k plus easy 

48 minutes ago, Mungler said:

Most farmers are asset rich and cash poor. 

I still can’t get my head round the attack on business property relief for farmers.

I guess Labour just have it in for anyone with land or assets. 

Labour don't like farmers or land owners, folk who work 7 days a week and rarely take a holiday,  yeah let's squeeze them 😱😱

[Mice!]

8 minutes ago, oowee said:

Wow.

It's a bit rich to whinge about the property relief for farmers and at the same time celebrate the Brexit vote which was surely the biggest kick in the nether regions for farmers since foot and mouth?

Every astute farmer I know with an asset over a £1m has the farm in a company structure so no gains to pay.  

I should have known it eas Brexits fault 😅😅 we should just have rolled over and done as France, sorry Europe wanted, especially as there all doing so well, Labour seems to want to drag us down to there level.

[JohnfromUK]

4 minutes ago, Mice! said:

Have you looked at the 7 year thing, I'm sure you can or could gift money and if you live more than 7 years afterwards there's no tax, I could be very wrong but it's worth looking at, you could gift it, hoping you live past the 7 years, with them knowing you may need some back, I'm sure it could be worked out?

Yes, thank you, I am aware of that.  Unfortunately my current assets are mainly my house (which I currently live in and want to continue to live in) and my (smallish) investments/savings in ISA - which I really need as a 'reserve' and my pension 'pot' which has to date been reserved to pay IHT.  I do now need to re-look at that now I know that my pension pot will be part of my estate. 

It's just that I had sensible, legal, affordable arrangements made - and now they have all been 'ripped up'.

You cannot easily 'give away' your dwelling house and continue to live there - it is seen as tax evasion rather than legitimate tax planning.  If you give something away you must either sever your connections with it, or rent it back on a commercial basis (but even that has it's pitfalls).

 

[oowee]

17 minutes ago, Mice! said:

I should have known it eas Brexits fault 😅😅 we should just have rolled over and done as France, sorry Europe wanted, especially as there all doing so well, Labour seems to want to drag us down to there level.

? What is?

[Mungler]

38 minutes ago, oowee said:

Wow.

It's a bit rich to whinge about the property relief for farmers and at the same time celebrate the Brexit vote which was surely the biggest kick in the nether regions for farmers since foot and mouth?

Every astute farmer I know with an asset over a £1m has the farm in a company structure so no gains to pay.  

 

Brexit? Oh dear Lord that was a decade ago.

Here's what the NFU say about the budget, but what would they know? Bizarrely, they don't mention Brexit. Go figure.  🙂

https://www.nfuonline.com/updates-and-information/budget-blow-for-british-farming-says-nfu/

[Rewulf]

13 minutes ago, oowee said:

What is?

Apparently, beating their constituents up if they question their policies 

[Mice!]

14 hours ago, Mungler said:

I posted this in the other budget thread, and here it is again. Farage nails it.

 

 

Shame there were only 20 people there 🙄

But some of it is bang on, unfortunately Labour want to punish anyone who makes a successful life for themselves.

I've just seen that Manchester is keeping the £2 bus fair while the rest of the country goes up to £3, Manchester that has good transport with buses,  trams and trains when compared to the Lakes where trains are often cancelled with no notice,  irregular buses and a lot of people working in the tourist industry on minimum wage, never mind just how spread out places are??