Following on from the Budget, why shouldn't Farmers pay inheritance tax like the rest of us?

[ShootingEgg]

And before you try to argue.. attached is DEFRA figures of net worth 

 

 

4 minutes ago, button said:

Don’t waste your time, fully bought in labour fan who like them can’t tell us what a working man is

100% 

[old man]

3 hours ago, oowee said:

It is in part because people are buying land for tax avoidance purposes that the cost of land is uneconomic for farming. Close that loophole and hopefully reduce the demand and price for land. 

Mm, a potential benefit of this bombshell maybe, lots of land available to build on?

[oowee]

8 minutes ago, button said:

Straight from the labour pitch book, just as expected

Don’t waste your time, fully bought in labour fan who like them can’t tell us what a working man is

So no ideas then. 

 

[ShootingEgg]

2 minutes ago, old man said:

Mm, a potential benefit of this bombshell maybe, lots of land available to build on?

Political land grab for developers to smash and grab. 

 

Control the food you control the people. Labour are going to destroy this country. 

[oowee]

3 minutes ago, old man said:

Mm, a potential benefit of this bombshell maybe, lots of land available to build on?

That's an interesting proposition. I think the vast majority of farm land close to settlement (readily developable will already be under option. 

[button]

2 minutes ago, oowee said:

So no ideas then. 

 

What ideas you looking for?

[oowee]

1 minute ago, ShootingEgg said:

Political land grab for developers to smash and grab. 

 

Control the food you control the people. Labour are going to destroy this country. 

This country is on it's knees following the last 14 years of mismanagement and the 2016 vote. Can labour make it worse, of course they can but they also have a slim chance to stop the rot.

[old man]

1 minute ago, oowee said:

That's an interesting proposition. I think the vast majority of farm land close to settlement (readily developable will already be under option. 

Quite possibly?

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, Labour are bleating over and over again , It will only affect a small number of Farms , I did not see Sir Dyson on the Rally 🤔, Nothing said about another big land owner from Denmark i think ?, I know quite a few 3rd generation farming families and despite the long hours and not that big financial return want the next generation to continue, It is not all about becoming Millionaires ££££££££££££££££££££SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

[oowee]

2 minutes ago, old man said:

Quite possibly?

For a time I did consultancy identifying farm land for development and getting it into local plan boundaries. 

13 minutes ago, ShootingEgg said:

And before you try to argue.. attached is DEFRA figures of net worth 

 

 

100% 

What does this show? 

[ShootingEgg]

16 minutes ago, oowee said:

This country is on it's knees following the last 14 years of mismanagement and the 2016 vote. Can labour make it worse, of course they can but they also have a slim chance to stop the rot.

Well they are rotting more right now. Admitting an additional 50k pensioners will be in poverty due to fuel payment joke too. But you are red through and through so no point in having these discussions.

14 minutes ago, oowee said:

What does this show? 

You seriously have to ask this .. case and point your just a labour luvvy...

It shows that over 50% of farms in the UK ARE IMPACTED. but heaven for I'd you remove your labour tinted glasses.

 

[oowee]

9 minutes ago, ShootingEgg said:

Well they are rotting more right now. Admitting an additional 50k pensioners will be in poverty due to fuel payment joke too. But you are red through and through so no point in having these discussions.

You seriously have to ask this .. case and point your just a labour luvvy...

It shows that over 50% of farms in the UK ARE IMPACTED. but heaven for I'd you remove your labour tinted glasses.

 

I can see that the chart shows 50% of the farms recorded have a net worth of £1.5m and over.

What it does not show is what proportion of these farms might have to pay IHT.  Owning a farm worth more than £m and being subject to IHT is not the same thing. Many farms will already be in a company structure. Not least to protect it from children.

 

[Newbie to this]

55 minutes ago, button said:

the only thing we do know is his dad was a tool maker

And his first job was on a farm, or so he is claiming, but then Reeves was claiming to be an economist at Halifax, which turned out to be the usual lies.

[Dave-G]

Pariah's tin hat on now, dare I write the following in this thread... 

We/UK are having to raise a hellofalot more money from somewhere since Russia invaded Ukraine, and not just for its defence - which we pledged to assist with when they surrendered their nukes. I think the 'net zero' topic is getting some of the blame to avoid the general public turning against that country.

That money has to come from taxation of the general population in ways that are deeply unpopular and unforeseen a few years ago. It is easier afforded by the well off than the poorer section of society.

 

Edited Tuesday at 20:34 by Dave-G

[Agriv8]

Just bringing this back on track has NFU published the figures for farms this will affect. How does that compare to the gov’s

Mr Clarkson comments that he originally bought his farm for its pheasant shoot but the public would not like that so found out it could be used to dodge inheritance tax may back fire.

I think this has moved on to the farmers wanting to give the labour gov there first bloody nose !

Agriv8

[Dave-G]

4 minutes ago, Agriv8 said:

Just bringing this back on track has NFU published the figures for farms this will affect. How does that compare to the gov’s

Mr Clarkson comments that he originally bought his farm for its pheasant shoot but the public would not like that so found out it could be used to dodge inheritance tax may back fire.

I think this has moved on to the farmers wanting to give the labour gov there first bloody nose !

Agriv8

Fair thinking there.

[Agriv8]

4 minutes ago, Dave-G said:

Fair thinking there.

Did anyone else notice a fair number of placards with Conservative Party in the bottom corner!

I think there is a certain amount of coordination going on !

Agriv8

[Yellow Bear]

3 minutes ago, Agriv8 said:

think there is a certain amount of coordination going on !

Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander most would say.

[oowee]

15 minutes ago, Agriv8 said:

Just bringing this back on track has NFU published the figures for farms this will affect. How does that compare to the gov’s

 

@ShootingEgg produced a chart from the NFU which you can see above. Unfortunately it has no data as to how many farms will fall within the new thresholds. I cannot see how they could possibly know. I have spoken to a couple of farmers (both dairy) that dismissed it as a non story with a decent accountant. 

[JohnfromUK]

 

21 minutes ago, Agriv8 said:

 

Mr Clarkson comments that he originally bought his farm for its pheasant shoot but the public would not like that so found out it could be used to dodge inheritance tax may back fire.

I think Clarkson having a shoot on his farm is widely known even though he doesn't mention it much now he's doing the Clarkson's Farm show. 

I suspect Clarkson has measure in place for tax planning, of which the farm will only be an element.  He's a rich man and no doubt has good advisors.  But the current protest is more about small and medium family farms.  It gets Clarkson's support and I expect most are glad to have him 'on team', because he brings press coverage. 

Clarkson makes a play on farming, but also freely admits he is only able to live as he does and farm because he has loads of other income streams which he can use to subsidise his farm.

But like everyone he pays the taxes he owes (well I assume he does as it has not been suggested otherwise), so why shouldn't he be able to give away his property on which he has already paid the taxes?

Edited Tuesday at 21:02 by JohnfromUK

[Dave-G]

I've just seen on GBN Starmer saying the tax threshold is 3M, where's that figure coming from?

[ShootingEgg]

25 minutes ago, oowee said:

@ShootingEgg produced a chart from the NFU which you can see above. Unfortunately it has no data as to how many farms will fall within the new thresholds. I cannot see how they could possibly know. I have spoken to a couple of farmers (both dairy) that dismissed it as a non story with a decent accountant. 

No I produced DEFRA chart.. did you choose not to read the bit where the chart itself shows Source - DEFRA ..

 

[button]

10 minutes ago, ShootingEgg said:

No I produced DEFRA chart.. did you choose not to read the bit where the chart itself shows Source - DEFRA ..

 

Must have missed busy still working out what a working man is

[JohnfromUK]

15 minutes ago, Dave-G said:

I've just seen on GBN Starmer saying the tax threshold is 3M, where's that figure coming from?

It comes from adding together all the various allowances;

1. Standard allowance everyone gets £325K
2. Additional dwelling house allowance (only available under limited to direct descendants rules) up to £1M
3. The two above available per person in an (in the 'giving' generation) couple (i.e £1M each - £2m for a couple)
4. Then 1M for the actual 'farm' allowance bit

Item 2 is limited to certain direct descendants and also for this to be the case, the farm would have to be jointly owned and neither person have any other personal assets. And with many farmers holding on to their businesses until death, it is likely that some are widowed and therefore this will not apply to them.

Basically it isn't true for many many instances.  It is true in quite limited circumstances that are unlikely to apply in a great many cases.  Most farms/farmers have other assets - pension, livestock, house, some savings - as well as gthe actual farmland.

[oowee]

14 minutes ago, ShootingEgg said:

No I produced DEFRA chart.. did you choose not to read the bit where the chart itself shows Source - DEFRA ..

 

Missed that bit. Either way shows nothing of substance.