Rioting in the streets.

[digger]

Cant post the link but the Washington Post covered just that scenario Fuddster. A white / Hispanic youth was shot by a black police officer in August. No coverage at all by the liberal press as it does not suit their agenda. Most of the shops being looted are owned by black people. The figures on the Post article back up what we know.

[The Mighty Prawn]

It's worth reading the whole transcript too as the bulk of witnesses, regardless of colour, more or less agreed with the 'official' version of events. The loss of life is a sad thing but theft from a shop with assault in the shop followed by failure to stop, assaulting a police officer and then charging back at same officer is highly likely to get you killed?

[Vince Green]

It's worth reading the whole transcript too as the bulk of witnesses, regardless of colour, more or less agreed with the 'official' version of events. The loss of life is a sad thing but theft from a shop with assault in the shop followed by failure to stop, assaulting a police officer and then charging back at same officer is highly likely to get you killed?

He was shot six times including two when he was on the ground. That surely should be enough to put the officer in court? It would have given the community some closure and started the healing process. As it is now the situation will be there for generations.

 

The police should not be above the law but the Grand Jury's verdict seems to say they are. Thats what the riot was about, not the shooting it was the way the authorities appeared to dismiss it and the knowledge that the people were being denied natural justice.

[Fuddster]

so what you're saying is that the grand jury are wrong?- above and beyond what a single cop done in a few seconds of threat perception?

 

hanging one white cop out to dry would not give the community closure and healing-thats why they are now wearing looted trainers and drinking looted beer.

 

justifying riot, extensive damage to property in their 'hood and threatening violence to all and sundry seems an adverse way of demonstrating denial of natural justice(your words).

 

The GJ backed a police officer defending himself. The GJ considered the law in all its aspects and made a decision.

 

that area was a racial tinderbox well before this incident, a scenario repeated far and wide through the US.

 

would they have rioted if a black cop had shot a white guy?

 

f.

[coatesy75]

put cops in shops shoot all looters

[Hamster]

Where has my post gone ?

[Vince Green]

It doesnt help to learn this morning that the cop is now charging for TV interviews! Only in America!

[maxie]

Where has my post gone ?

Censorship?

[Mentalmac]

A lot of the 'protestors' in the pictures surfacing today look overwhelmingly like a bunch of young oiks who just want to 'stick it to the man' regardless of why, as soon as the 'P' word is whispered all the anti-man placards come out.

 

The person at the centre of this all mentioned about that the lad wouldn't have been killed if he simply followed orders. This isn't a 'black people murdered by white cops' argument in my eyes as has already been said here - he was being arrested and resisted and fought the cop, the cop felt threatened and the perpetrator wouldn't back down and lunged at the cop whilst the cop had his gun drawn and was issuing warnings and he fired and ended the problem.

 

This lad who got shot wasn't exactly an 'angel' anyhow and thought he was above the law and ultimately paid the price. Suddenly every person who isn't caucasian will side with the deceased and make out it was a racially motivated incident and that this guys a martyr and the grieving mother is there all upset about his 'murder' - well if he was better parented and taught right from wrong he wouldn't have been in the situation he was in.

[geordieh]

You just have to look at this country 3.5% of the population is black but 11% of the prison population is black does this mean that the judges are racist or black people are more likely to be criminals

[deadeye18]

Crime is crime bud.race doesnt matter.your either a wrong un and you go to jail or your not and you dont.

[grrclark]

You just have to look at this country 3.5% of the population is black but 11% of the prison population is black does this mean that the judges are racist or black people are more likely to be criminals

Way too simplistic an argument. There is a really complex set of social and cultural issues that surround this that are significant contributing factors.

[STOTTO]

Way too simplistic an argument. There is a really complex set of social and cultural issues that surround this that are significant contributing factors.

 

Might just be easier to catch and convict or perhaps that their, “complex set of social and cultural issues that surround this and are significant contributing factors” conflict with ours!

[kdubya]

Way too simplistic an argument. There is a really complex set of social and cultural issues that surround this that are significant contributing factors.

would it equally be too simplistic to say that when I was young no one had anything no cars no washing machines no tv's jeesus christ kids actually walked to school,(apart obviously from the very few well off)and would it be too simplistic to say they did not vent their frustration by looting and setting fire to properties an businesses, or to resort to creating getto's crime riddled hell holes and no go area's for those who "did not belong"

 

KW

Edited November 26, 2014 by kdubya

[Penelope]

But the bottom line is 'choice'.

 

Way too simplistic an argument. There is a really complex set of social and cultural issues that surround this that are significant contributing factors.

[Gordon R]

kdubya - short, to the point and accurate. :good:

[Hamster]

Way too simplistic an argument. There is a really complex set of social and cultural issues that surround this that are significant contributing factors.

 

Correct.

[grrclark]

Guys all i said is that the argument of being black is more likely to commit crime is too simplistic.

 

I am not defending those who do wrong.

 

The causal relationship to crime is not skin colour, there is a far more complex set of things behind that. Nothing more nothing less.

 

Ignorance on the part or the perpetrators of crime doesn't mean we should excuse it when looking at the cause.

[Flashman]

The Mighty Prawn, on 25 Nov 2014 - 9:21 PM, said:

It's worth reading the whole transcript too as the bulk of witnesses, regardless of colour, more or less agreed with the 'official' version of events. The loss of life is a sad thing but theft from a shop with assault in the shop followed by failure to stop, assaulting a police officer and then charging back at same officer is highly likely to get you killed?

 

6'5', 300lb guy runs at a cop. After calling the cop a pussy and gaining speed over 25 yards, the cop shoots him when he gets to 8 yards away.

 

All this was discussed on R4 yesterday morning and I'd say, like the Grand Jury by the way, that the cop was in fear of his life and was right to blaze away. Shooting to wound only happens in films and the cop's training kicked in and he shot at centre mass and head.

 

But don't let the truth get in the way of a looting spree just before Christmas...

[Mentalmac]

 

6'5', 300lb guy runs at a cop. After calling the cop a pussy and gaining speed over 25 yards, the cop shoots him when he gets to 8 yards away.

 

All this was discussed on R4 yesterday morning and I'd say, like the Grand Jury by the way, that the cop was in fear of his life and was right to blaze away. Shooting to wound only happens in films and the cop's training kicked in and he shot at centre mass and head.

 

But don't let the truth get in the way of a looting spree just before Christmas...

+1. I think he he showed restraint.

[Hamster]

 

The person at the centre of this all mentioned about that the lad wouldn't have been killed if he simply followed orders. This isn't a 'black people murdered by white cops' argument in my eyes as has already been said here - he was being arrested and resisted and fought the cop, the cop felt threatened and the perpetrator wouldn't back down and lunged at the cop whilst the cop had his gun drawn and was issuing warnings and he fired and ended the problem.

 

This lad who got shot wasn't exactly an 'angel' anyhow and thought he was above the law and ultimately paid the price. Suddenly every person who isn't caucasian will side with the deceased and make out it was a racially motivated incident and that this guys a martyr and the grieving mother is there all upset about his 'murder' - well if he was better parented and taught right from wrong he wouldn't have been in the situation he was in.

 

Hell of a way of ending a problem, plenty of Caucasians would agree.

+1. I think he he showed restraint.

 

What else do you suggest he should have done ?

[maxie]

You just have to look at this country 3.5% of the population is black but 11% of the prison population is black does this mean that the judges are racist or black people are more likely to be criminals

The black population of the U.S. is 12.6% according to the 2010 census.

[Muddy Funker]

The one thing that strikes me about policing in the states is that there always seems to be too few tactical options available.
There doesn't seem to be much separating a subject complying and getting shot.

I normally hate it when people bang on about tazer as though it's the answer to everyones prayers, but if the reports are correct then this sounds like a situation where it may have stopped the threat without using a firearm.
I'm well aware that the level of threat faced by cops in the US is far greater than that in the UK, but I struggle to accept it can be justified to shoot someone 6 times just because they are running at you, regardless of what might have happened.

Obviously it is justified by the court outcome, but why not give cops a less lethal option that might help bridge the gap between compliance and the almost certainty of death after a firearm is drawn.

Or do all US cops carry tazer?

[The Mighty Prawn]

Seriously? When what might have happened is they grab your gun and kill you? You'd rather take your chances with a couple of shots and hope they change their mind? If it gets to the point where you are pulling that trigger you make damn sure you keep pulling it until they stop - it ain't like the movies, one shot and down they go, a man of that size would be like the duracell bunny and just keep going and going so yeah he kept firing

I struggle to accept it can be justified to shoot someone 6 times just because they are running at you, regardless of what might have happened.

[Thunderbird]

Watching QI recently, there was an interesting question about why people fall down when they are shot. The premise was that (obviously excepting when someone has been instantly fatally shot or very severely injured like their leg being blown off) people do not tend to fall over when shot, until they know they have been, then they do.

 

It reminds me of a few military memoirs I've read where people have only realised they had received an injury when someone pointed it out to them, or the adrenaline has stopped pumping.

 

Wasn't there a story years ago about a guy that was high on PCP who took a full mag from an Uzi but still kept coming?