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Putin announces 'military operation' in Ukraine.

Dave-G

By Dave-G,
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Mungler

Mungler

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, oowee said:

Because its part of Europe and a NATO candidate.

Ukraine were given weapons to defend themselves. They were invaded. 

Arming Taiwan and Ukraine fighting back is already detering China. War is just not worth the cost. 

It might be the bitterest end but that wont be avoided by letting Russia or China run riot. 


This. The only reason Ukraine got invaded by Russia was because it gave up its nukes.

From elsewhere:

 

 

I think we've more or less established the Russian system by now. When they take over an area they will have a list of people who are connected with the authorities or have served in the army. Most of these will have their hands tied and be shot in the head at once. As more turn up later once things are organised they will be tortured for information then it seems tortured for fun, often to death. Electric shocks, soldering irons, humiliation (all this seems to be done naked), sexual assault, broken fingers, barbed wire in orifices and daily beatings seem to be the main methods, along with cutting off people's genitals, carried out in rooms designated for the purpose. 

The evidence for this is utterly overwhelming.

There are three things about this I find incredible.

1- The industrial scale. In every conflict you get individuals or units who break the rules, in most conflicts you'll find people who really might know something truly vital being tortured. If you point out what Russia is up to you can expect lots of cretinous whataboutery from the usual shills. But this is clearly actual policy, not isolated instances. 

2- The sadism. As above, people who have been through it say it goes on for weeks or months. Any practical, if evil, purpose must be sorted in a day or two at most. Months? It's sadism. Where do they find the vast number of people who enjoy this?

3- That they clearly think it's normal. People are exchanged or the body released after this. The British aid worker who died was returned with his genitals cut off. Taira, a combat medic, was exchanged. I'll link to her testimony below (it doesn't contain the details, they are too gruesome, you can find them elsewhere). This could only happen because they don't understand they are doing anything wrong.

It's the Russian mindset. The country is a kleptocratic tyranny with the trappings of a democracy. Their armed forces are a bunch of thieves and murderers with the trappings of an organised force. Everything about the place and the people is a sick parody of the civilised, the economic dysfunction propped up with oil revenues, the social dysfunction with a thin gloss of propaganda. So, naturally, they imagine everywhere is the same and the rest of us are a bunch of hypocrites, unfairly picking on them.

 

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mchughcb

mchughcb

Posted
Posted
19 hours ago, Mungler said:


The suggestion that poorly trained young knuckle dragging Russian troops, convicts and mercenaries scooped from the four corners of the Evil empire could commit war crimes is just ridiculous right, like it couldn’t ever happen. I bet whatever evidence comes out is going to be all fabricated.

There, saved you the effort. 

Maybe if you thought about the fact that people killed in an artillery strike aren't going to be the easiest to pick up and burr, so when the opposition comes across a group of dead soldiers in a trench during summer they could either 1. leave them there, or 2. Given them a christian burial complete with cross on the grave. 

I feel that your emotions are clouding your judgement. The same claims were made when the there was a mass grave at the St Andrews church. Who bothers to bury the dead, supposedly from war crimes in an orthodox church grounds when they could have been buried in a forest or thrown in the reservoir. Even I can work out there was that many dead bodies the morgues couldn't cope and then the priest says he told them to bury them in his church.

In the shadow of a gilt-domed church in Bucha, a new mass grave gives up its dead | Daily Mail Online

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Mungler

Mungler

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, mchughcb said:

Maybe if you thought about the fact that people killed in an artillery strike aren't going to be the easiest to pick up and burr, so when the opposition comes across a group of dead soldiers in a trench during summer they could either 1. leave them there, or 2. Given them a christian burial complete with cross on the grave. 

I feel that your emotions are clouding your judgement. The same claims were made when the there was a mass grave at the St Andrews church. Who bothers to bury the dead, supposedly from war crimes in an orthodox church grounds when they could have been buried in a forest or thrown in the reservoir. Even I can work out there was that many dead bodies the morgues couldn't cope and then the priest says he told them to bury them in his church.

In the shadow of a gilt-domed church in Bucha, a new mass grave gives up its dead | Daily Mail Online


Is that the best you’ve got?

The accounts of torture and murder by Russian soldiers are to numerous to list, and yet are dismissed out of hand by those not with enquiring minds but a propensity to want to believe everything the Kremlin ever says. 

More will come out with the passage of time and no doubt still be dismissed out of hand by those who chose to close their eyes and claim NATO / MSM / Lizard people lies. 

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oowee

oowee

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, mchughcb said:

Maybe if you thought about the fact that people killed in an artillery strike aren't going to be the easiest to pick up and burr, so when the opposition comes across a group of dead soldiers in a trench during summer they could either 1. leave them there, or 2. Given them a christian burial complete with cross on the grave. 

I feel that your emotions are clouding your judgement. The same claims were made when the there was a mass grave at the St Andrews church. Who bothers to bury the dead, supposedly from war crimes in an orthodox church grounds when they could have been buried in a forest or thrown in the reservoir. Even I can work out there was that many dead bodies the morgues couldn't cope and then the priest says he told them to bury them in his church.

In the shadow of a gilt-domed church in Bucha, a new mass grave gives up its dead | Daily Mail Online

Fortunately Ukraine have invited hundreds of foreign journo's to witness the unearthing so there will be more eyes in the witness stand.

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mchughcb

mchughcb

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Mungler said:


Is that the best you’ve got?

The accounts of torture and murder by Russian soldiers are to numerous to list, and yet are dismissed out of hand by those not with enquiring minds but a propensity to want to believe everything the Kremlin ever says. 

More will come out with the passage of time and no doubt still be dismissed out of hand by those who chose to close their eyes and claim NATO / MSM / Lizard people lies. 

No doubt there will be on both sides but you are choosing the wrong examples. 

12 minutes ago, oowee said:

Fortunately Ukraine have invited hundreds of foreign journo's to witness the unearthing so there will be more eyes in the witness stand.

Journalists can witness all they like. In the absence of eye witnesses and a prosecution,  I would be relying on a coroner or forensic pathologist.

It's the Ukrainians that we're filming themselves shooting surrendered soldiers at the start of the invasion which is a war crime.

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Mungler

Mungler

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, mchughcb said:

No doubt there will be on both sides but you are choosing the wrong examples. 

Journalists can witness all they like. In the absence of eye witnesses and a prosecution,  I would be relying on a coroner or forensic pathologist.

It's the Ukrainians that we're filming themselves shooting surrendered soldiers at the start of the invasion which is a war crime.


That’s an out of hand dismissal with a side of whataboutery thrown in. 

We all choose who we want to believe, right?

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ditchman

ditchman

Posted
Posted
53 minutes ago, mchughcb said:

Mass graves with christian crosses does not mean war crimes as you are implying. This has been the inference by the mainstream media for some time. 

What is a Lizard person?

Is that someone like Eddie Izzard that has fully transitioned?

A lizard person....Hhmmmmm

i believe it stems from a alien investigation team...that found out that all the influential people in the world are actually aliens..(dont ask me what planet).....these lizards have the ability to change their form and appearance to that of human beings.....and they control the direction of humanity and eventually making the planet earth suitable for lizard take over

i also believe they are the sworn enemies of "the flatearthers"

life is very complicated when you know stuff...:w00t:

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ditchman

ditchman

Posted
Posted (edited)
37 minutes ago, mchughcb said:

That would explain Hillary then.

yup...........you've got it now...:good:.......you are now "in the know"

just to let you know .....over 12 million americans alone support this theory......:hmm:

Edited by ditchman
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Jaymo

Jaymo

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

114 pages and still the same arguments …

It’s would actually only be 74 pages. 
But due to the cost of living crisis, the Mods have had to reduce the size of the pages but keep the format the same.

Just like the packet of Rolo’s I purchased the other day! Either my hands have grown to goal keeper sized, or they have dramatically shrunk the size? 
 

Oops, carry on with the thread dear chaps. 

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Jaymo

Jaymo

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Not quite, Ditchman and Co are off on another tangent!   :rolleyes:

How can ‘Tangent’ be involved when with a flat earth scenario, trigonometry is not required for zero angular variation. 
I suppose we should really be talking about the absence of Pi, in relation to our transition from an oblate spheroid to a piece of flat terrain!

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TIGHTCHOKE

TIGHTCHOKE

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Jaymo said:

How can ‘Tangent’ be involved when with a flat earth scenario, trigonometry is not required for zero angular variation. 
I suppose we should really be talking about the absence of Pi, in relation to our transition from an oblate spheroid to a piece of flat terrain!

Go back to bed, you have got up too quickly!  :w00t:

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Mungler

Mungler

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, islandgun said:

Thought this was quite significant, dont dismiss her easily as she has 3.5 million followers on instagram

 https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/9/19/russian-pop-star-alla-pugacheva-condemns-putins-war-in-ukraine


Good for her and her husband - their lives won’t be made any easier as a result.

She’s nailed it of course:

“Putin’s war in Ukraine; he is killing soldiers for “illusory” aims, burdening ordinary people, and turning Russia into a pariah state.”

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mchughcb

mchughcb

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Mungler said:


Good for her and her husband - their lives won’t be made any easier as a result.

She’s nailed it of course:

“Putin’s war in Ukraine; he is killing soldiers for “illusory” aims, burdening ordinary people, and turning Russia into a pariah state.”

Pugacheva is the Russian equivalent of Cher. Her husband some 25 years younger than her and they both fled to Israel. I heard they split up and she's getting another husband that isn't gay, but who believes those rumours.

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Rewulf

Rewulf

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Mungler said:

Good for her and her husband - their lives won’t be made any easier as a result.

She should be safe from open windows, she has more popularity than Putin (The dark lord himself) 🤪

And as Mchughcb said , she does her criticising from Israel just to be sure.

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