24 hours in Police Custody. Ch.4 documentary.

[Scully]

15 minutes ago, Rim Fire said:

1. no you wouldn't but the woke brigade would be shouting human rights and Well it don't stop them in America and they got the death penalty 

Yes, you’re right, and that’s where it all goes awry, as no one seems to be giving priority to anyone’s right not to be burgled. 
Again, you’re right, and it didn’t stop anyone committing murder when we had the death penalty in the UK either; what it is very effective at however, is stopping reoffending. 👍

[Gordon R]

Quote

As usual when a explanation is requested. No response required.

Your command of the English language is somewhat lacking. I would find it hard to have a sensible debate with you, as I think you aren't very bright. I will respond to no more of your juvenile posts.

[amateur]

53 minutes ago, Rem260 said:

As usual when a explanation is requested. No response required.

Why would you be asking Gordon to give you lessons in spelling, grammar or logic?

That should have been covered in your elementary education

[Rem260]

2 minutes ago, amateur said:

Why would you be asking Gordon to give you lessons in spelling, grammar or logic?

That should have been covered in your elementary education

Why would you ask me that question if you already knew the answer.

Edited November 30, 2022 by Rem260

[shaun4860]

I’ve watched it today.

Had I been the homeowner I wouldn’t have chased them (but I also wouldn’t have advertised a dirt bike for sale on FB marketplace)

Thats how people die, if they had stopped what would he have done, they might have caused him great harm or even worse.

They didn’t break into his house or even try to break into his house, it was his garage, they were after the bike.

As soon as he saw them he should have called the police. Whether they would have come or not is a different topic.

The camera doorbell looked like “ring”.

They have the ability to let you talk to who is outside, he could have just told them the police have been called.

Despite the “attempted” burglars pleading guilty and having a charge sheet as long as your arm, suspended sentence was probably right. 👨🏼‍🚀

And finally, the car the bike hit, what if one of your loved ones had been driving it, bike comes through the drivers window as it did, glass covers and scars the driver, then you find out the bike had been rammed from behind and forced into the car, still want a suspended sentence 🤷🏻‍♂️

and finally finally, if I find you INSIDE my house then you take your chance as I would use every means possible to defend myself.

 

 

[Surfer]

We have a rule in our house,if we’re in bed and they break in down stairs they can take what they like as it can be replaced.

Come upstairs then we dream it to be not just a burglary and will do what ever it takes to defend our selves as the same as if we’re still down stairs 

they come armed with screw drivers and crow bars which gives them the upper hand 

[Rewulf]

1 hour ago, Rim Fire said:

Well it don't stop them in America and they got the death penalty

It's very  hard to commit more crimes if you're in prison or dead.. 

The system is designed to protect the innocent and deliver justice, yet we seem more interested in defending the 'rights' of criminals, and delivering very liitle justice for victims. 

[Rim Fire]

26 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

It's very  hard to commit more crimes if you're in prison or dead.. 

The system is designed to protect the innocent and deliver justice, yet we seem more interested in defending the 'rights' of criminals, and delivering very liitle justice for victims. 

I don't think anyone is arguing against that 🤷‍♂️

[Sciurus]

I thought the householder came over as a thoroughly decent guy, however given the circumstances (losing control, clipping the bike and then driving under the van), he was clearly driving too fast, caused an accident and injury to the thieves and as such the jury had to find him guilty. I do think the prison sentence was harsh. Given the provocation of the break in, good integrity of the householder and that he is unlikely to reoffend, I thought a suspended sentence would have been appropriate.

I also thought the judge was correct to make clear that thieves were largely responsible for the events leading to their injury. It is ironic that these life changing injuries didn’t prevent them continuing their life of crime a few weeks later. I can’t think of any punishment that would be a deterrent to those scumbags.

As a 69 year old wimp, I wouldn’t have given chase but if I was fit and lived in an area where burglary was rife and the police take no action, I think there can be justification in giving chase. It is ok to say you are not in danger if the burglars are running away, but who is to say, they won’t return that night or any other night to get/do what they wanted? I certainly don’t accept the argument that they only wanted to steal the motorbike and the owner and wife were in no danger. The householder didn’t know that- hindsight is a wonderful thing.

[12gauge82]

9 minutes ago, Sciurus said:

I thought the householder came over as a thoroughly decent guy, however given the circumstances (losing control, clipping the bike and then driving under the van), he was clearly driving too fast, caused an accident and injury to the thieves and as such the jury had to find him guilty. I do think the prison sentence was harsh. Given the provocation of the break in, good integrity of the householder and that he is unlikely to reoffend, I thought a suspended sentence would have been appropriate.

I also thought the judge was correct to make clear that thieves were largely responsible for the events leading to their injury. It is ironic that these life changing injuries didn’t prevent them continuing their life of crime a few weeks later. I can’t think of any punishment that would be a deterrent to those scumbags.

As a 69 year old wimp, I wouldn’t have given chase but if I was fit and lived in an area where burglary was rife and the police take no action, I think there can be justification in giving chase. It is ok to say you are not in danger if the burglars are running away, but who is to say, they won’t return that night or any other night to get/do what they wanted? I certainly don’t accept the argument that they only wanted to steal the motorbike and the owner and wife were in no danger. The householder didn’t know that- hindsight is a wonderful thing.

A very well written assessment. 

I would add however that had those low lives not decided to break the law in the first place, none of it would of happened. I'd like to see a system that blame criminals for the instigating action rather than say a police officer for not breaking off a persuit, or a man trying to recover his stolen property. 

[Rim Fire]

Prisoners could be held in police cells as government tries to cut jail overcrowding

Critics say the decision paints a picture of a government in chaos

 

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NEWS

By

Flora Thompson, PA

Elizabeth Arnold, PA

David Lynch, PA

Ben Hatton, PA

Todd Fitzgerald

• 18:27, 30 NOV 2022
• UPDATED22:56, 30 NOV 2022

Enter your postcode for local news and info  

A prison guard walks through a cell area (Image: Dan Kitwood/Getty Images)

 

Prisoners could be held in police cells in a bid to reduce 'acute and sudden' overcrowding in jails, MPs have been told. Justice minister Damian Hinds said the government has asked to use 400 police cells to hold inmates after a surge in overcrowding in male prisons over the last few months - the 'first time ever' such a rapid increase has happened.

It comes after there was an 'unprecedented increase' in the number of offenders coming into prisons in the north, according to the Ministry of Justice (MoJ). Critics said the problem could have been predicted and that the decision paints a picture of a government in chaos.

We are already there by the looks of it overcrowding 

[Newbie to this]

7 minutes ago, Rim Fire said:

We are already there by the looks of it overcrowding 

We've been there for many years, but the rate at which prisons are built hasn't increased.

Just build more prisons, it's not rocket science, instead they decide to use house arrest etc. it's a joke/scandal.

[Rim Fire]

1 minute ago, Newbie to this said:

We've been there for many years, but the rate at which prisons are built hasn't increased.

Just build more prisons, it's not rocket science, instead they decide to use house arrest etc. it's a joke/scandal.

We definitely need more prisons with the amount of people that are in the UK now 

 

[12gauge82]

2 minutes ago, Newbie to this said:

We've been there for many years, but the rate at which prisons are built hasn't increased.

Just build more prisons, it's not rocket science, instead they decide to use house arrest etc. it's a joke/scandal.

Absolutely this. It's been proven, rehabilitation does not work in the vast majority of cases, we should spend that money instead building prisons and cheaply warehousing criminals who contine to offend. Crime rates would drop over night. 

[Scully]

Judging from the rate in which houses are being built around here ( without the infrastructure to cater for the occupants ) you would think it wouldnt be too much of a problem to build new prisons. There again, that would mean more prison guards, and I wouldn’t want that job. 

[Mungler]

I saw the TV program.

My view…. not that long ago when London was plagued by gangs of robbers on mopeds, the police were given powers / the green light to drive into them and to knock them off in pursuit of an arrest.

Here, Mr White was pursuing escaping criminals (on a stolen motor bike) to perform a citizen’s arrest. No difference in my book and don’t give me all that specialist police training nonsense - when it comes to knocking someone off a motor bike all bets are off.

All the shrugging about how the bloke had it coming because he advertised a dirt bike on Facebook - victim blaming. Give your head a wobble. 

And all the shrugging that it was only a bit of burglary and they should have been allowed to escape and because burglary is somehow now just one of those things we all have to live with. Really?

And the end result - two victims of crime receive justice and one criminal sent to prison. The problem is the two victims were, are and always will be career criminals with a police record longer than your arm and the convicted criminal was a working family man with no previous criminal record.

Anyway, I sent Mrs White’s crowd funder some money (the money is directed to Mr White’s wife because the thieves are now suing him for personal injury).

fundraiser link here:

https://gofund.me/6aeeef3d

 

 

.

Edited December 1, 2022 by Mungler

[Rim Fire]

10 minutes ago, Mungler said:

Anyway, I sent Mrs White’s crowd funder some money (the money is directed to Mr White’s wife because the thieves are now suing him for personal injury).

IMO if you get injured in the process of committing a crime  or fleeing the crime you should not be allowed to  claim for personal injury  

[Mungler]

2 minutes ago, Rim Fire said:

IMO if you get injured in the process of committing a crime  or fleeing the crime you should not be allowed to  claim for personal injury  

Makes sense to me too. It has to fall under the heading of ‘occupational hazard’ for a career criminal. 
.

Edited December 1, 2022 by Mungler

[welsh1]

14 hours ago, shaun4860 said:

I’ve watched it today.

Had I been the homeowner I wouldn’t have chased them (but I also wouldn’t have advertised a dirt bike for sale on FB marketplace)

Thats how people die, if they had stopped what would he have done, they might have caused him great harm or even worse.

They didn’t break into his house or even try to break into his house, it was his garage, they were after the bike.

As soon as he saw them he should have called the police. Whether they would have come or not is a different topic.

The camera doorbell looked like “ring”.

They have the ability to let you talk to who is outside, he could have just told them the police have been called.

Despite the “attempted” burglars pleading guilty and having a charge sheet as long as your arm, suspended sentence was probably right. 👨🏼‍🚀

And finally, the car the bike hit, what if one of your loved ones had been driving it, bike comes through the drivers window as it did, glass covers and scars the driver, then you find out the bike had been rammed from behind and forced into the car, still want a suspended sentence 🤷🏻‍♂️

and finally finally, if I find you INSIDE my house then you take your chance as I would use every means possible to defend myself.

 

 

Hit the nail on the head.
If there is no threat to yourself or a loved one then you shouldn't give chase, the law says you can use reasonable and proportionate force to DEFEND yourself.
If you come into my house and attack anyone i will use all resonable and proportionate force to stop you, i am not going to chase you after you leave as the threat is no longer there.

[discobob]

14 hours ago, Surfer said:

We have a rule in our house,if we’re in bed and they break in down stairs they can take what they like as it can be replaced.

Come upstairs then we dream it to be not just a burglary and will do what ever it takes to defend our selves as the same as if we’re still down stairs 

they come armed with screw drivers and crow bars which gives them the upper hand 

It would be the same here - contact the police - then shout down to notify them that the police had been contacted - however, one foot on the stairs and they would have a big naked fella throwing themselves down the stairs at them with the stick for opening the loft hatch in one hand and squirting shower gel/head and shoulders with the other with a hope of getting them in the eyes.....

[daveboy]

25 minutes ago, welsh1 said:

Hit the nail on the head.
If there is no threat to yourself or a loved one then you shouldn't give chase, the law says you can use reasonable and proportionate force to DEFEND yourself.
If you come into my house and attack anyone i will use all resonable and proportionate force to stop you, i am not going to chase you after you leave as the threat is no longer there.

He said he thought they had stolen his tools.... what about defending your property... 99% of the police officers involved agreed with his actions. The gofundme page is up to £126,000 already.

Edited December 1, 2022 by daveboy

[oowee]

1 hour ago, Newbie to this said:

We've been there for many years, but the rate at which prisons are built hasn't increased.

Just build more prisons, it's not rocket science, instead they decide to use house arrest etc. it's a joke/scandal.

More prisons more doctors, more care staff, more ambulance drivers, more criminal lawyers, more nurses. The joke / scandal lies at the door of the Tories and those that put them in power. 

[Newbie to this]

3 minutes ago, oowee said:

More prisons more doctors, more care staff, more ambulance drivers, more criminal lawyers, more nurses

All sounds good to me, lots of job creation 

Then there are all the trade jobs to build them in the first place. 

Win win

 

3 minutes ago, oowee said:

The joke / scandal lies at the door of the Tories

I don't think this is just a tory joke/scandal, I think this has been a failure of governments for many decades.

Edited December 1, 2022 by Newbie to this

[Mungler]

4 minutes ago, oowee said:

More prisons more doctors, more care staff, more ambulance drivers, more criminal lawyers, more nurses. The joke / scandal lies at the door of the Tories and those that put them in power. 

It all needs paying for and when the government puts up tax again (not just income tax but all the hidden and indirect taxes, levy’s, charges) and then raids pensions and cuts expenditure elsewhere…. will we all be singing the praises of the government?

The government never spends our money better or more wisely than the people who actually earned it. 

 

[Newbie to this]

3 minutes ago, Mungler said:

It all needs paying for and when the government puts up tax again (not just income tax but all the hidden and indirect taxes, levy’s, charges) and then raids pensions and cuts expenditure elsewhere…. will we all be singing the praises of the government?

The government never spends our money better or more wisely than the people who actually earned it. 

 

Maybe we can scrap vanity projects like HS2, that next to no one wants or needs.

Oh and of course foreign 'aid'

Edited December 1, 2022 by Newbie to this