What happens when we all go electric

[pigeon controller]

Just thinking outside the box to the day that we all go electric, with a few questions as follows:-

Will we have a standard battery pod we can exchange at a refuelling station?
 

Will we be able to recycle the old battery ?

A recent recycling centre was opened in the Black Country and they had a fire due to batteries being lifted in woven sacks and the contact touched.

If we all charge at home at night will the heat generated in the mains stop the roads freezing?
 

Will electric cars be subjected to some form of jamming to prevent over speeding?

 

[discobob]

8 minutes ago, pigeon controller said:

Will electric cars be subjected to some form of jamming to prevent over speeding?

This is the norm on all new cars (not just electric) although can currently be overridden - however it is coming that you won't be able to with new cars...

[pigeon controller]

8 minutes ago, discobob said:

This is the norm on all new cars (not just electric) although can currently be overridden - however it is coming that you won't be able to with new cars...

On my last trip down to Greece , the car told me to take a break!!!!

[snow white]

How do you charge if you live on a Main Street with only a pavement you can’t have a cable going across the pavement 

[pigeon controller]

4 minutes ago, snow white said:

How do you charge if you live on a Main Street with only a pavement you can’t have a cable going across the pavement 

Good point, will all the lamp posts have charge points??.

[CoventryWire]

I've spent the last 10 years being involved in designing and building electric vehicles so I've got quite a good understanding on this.......

Removable Batteries/Pods - Nope, seems a good idea on the surface but due to the way that modern cars are designed, the battery case actually plays a big part in the structural strength of the car, so making it (quickly) removable so it can be swapped means lots of additional mass in the car.  If you think back 20 years ago to when mobile phones boomed, the batteries were all removable (Nokia's, Siemens, Ericssons Etc.) and people used to buy extra batteries so they could swap and change them to "always have a full battery" now no-one even thinks of it like that, we just know that we will charge the battery when it gets nearly empty.

Charging overnight - Yep, we will all just plug the cars in and charge them overnight when the grids at its lowest demand, in the next few years we'll see more and cars becoming "bi-directional" meaning they will actually just be a big battery on wheels, so if your car is sat on the drive fully charged and you are using power in the house, it will be coming from the cars battery and this will then be topped up by the grid again when the demand drops (usually overnight).

Speeding/Big Brother - Even ICE cars are so intelligent now that they could theoretically be speed controlled already by the government .  Its inevitable, its already pretty much happening through insurance "black boxes" being fitted to young drivers cars.

Recycling - Yep, still some challenges to fix on that, but it will happen as systems and processes become more advanced to recover all the valuable materials in the battery packs.

[Diver One]

There is little chance of the National Grid /DNO infrastructure coping with the increase in demand. Little known fact but if you increase your domestic load by more than 10kVA you are meant to get mains approval,from DNO. That equates to a standard electric shower.

street light charging points would need a serious upgrade to the cabling

[Fargo]

Hope we get a government in who scrap the stupid ideas of electric vehicles 

[Weihrauch17]

1 hour ago, pigeon controller said:

Just thinking outside the box to the day that we all go electric, with a few questions as follows:-

Will we have a standard battery pod we can exchange at a refuelling station?
 

Will we be able to recycle the old battery ?

A recent recycling centre was opened in the Black Country and they had a fire due to batteries being lifted in woven sacks and the contact touched.

If we all charge at home at night will the heat generated in the mains stop the roads freezing?
 

Will electric cars be subjected to some form of jamming to prevent over speeding?

 

We won't all be going electric, for the vast majority it is totally impractical and unaffordable.  A ridiculous policy totally out of touch with reality just like Heat Pumps.  They are also a serious fire hazard.

[Stonepark]

Speaking from a grid prospective, the grid in the UK is basically at capacity.

Connection dates for new solar and wind in Eng and Wales are 2032 to 2036 plus.

Other than the replacement Nuclear stations (Hinckley Point) and off shore wind there is no significant electricity capacity being added to the grid over the next 10 years and this will be mainly replacing older assets that are being decommissioned.

 

Currently there is an overnight (and afternoon in summer) decrease in electricy prices due to supply being adequate or exceeding demand.

If everyone starts overnight charging, that price differential will evaporate but by then we will have mainly (for all those with smart meters) have changed to half hourly pricing and you will be paying top whack for your electricity.

The current market share of new registrations for EV (of all types) is currently about 16%, which translates to an overall share of around 3% of vehicles on the road. 97% of vehicles are still ICE.

There is not the grid capacity to go all electric for transport or heating, never mind both at once.

We would need to increase our electric grid infrastructure by 500% to cope with this, when we are only barely replacing the generation assets we are losing.

[sutty2006]

13 minutes ago, Fargo said:

Hope we get a government in who scrap the stupid ideas of electric vehicles 

Agreed. 
 

I’ve no issue with green conscious folk buying electric, heck 90% of our fleet of vans at work are now electric. And it’s reducing ICE vehicles off the road. 
 

but to force it on the whole population is horrific. car tax is a big killer. Even if you don’t do many miles, you still pay lots of cash. 
 

two biggest problems with climate change right now? First is an ever increasing worldwide population. We aren’t getting smaller. We are expanding and it’s a problem. Secondly, larger countries don’t care about it. Mainly 3rd world like India etc. they don’t have euro style emissions regulations. Then there’s Russia that’s currently blowing the hell out of Ukraine. How much nasty stuff is going into the air from that kerfuffle? 
 

so until EVERYONE gets on board, I’m going to continue to drive old bangers that do hardly any damage until this properly change. 

[Penelope]

1 minute ago, Stonepark said:

Speaking from a grid prospective, the grid in the UK is basically at capacity.

Connection dates for new solar and wind in Eng and Wales are 2032 to 2036 plus.

Other than the replacement Nuclear stations (Hinckley Point) and off shore wind there is no significant electricity capacity being added to the grid over the next 10 years and this will be mainly replacing older assets that are being decommissioned.

 

Currently there is an overnight (and afternoon in summer) decrease in electricy prices due to supply being adequate or exceeding demand.

If everyone starts overnight charging, that price differential will evaporate but by then we will have mainly (for all those with smart meters) have changed to half hourly pricing and you will be paying top whack for your electricity.

The current market share of new registrations for EV (of all types) is currently about 16%, which translates to an overall share of around 3% of vehicles on the road. 97% of vehicles are still ICE.

There is not the grid capacity to go all electric for transport or heating, never mind both at once.

We would need to increase our electric grid infrastructure by 500% to cope with this, when we are only barely replacing the generation assets we are losing.

But 40 degree temperatures are going to be norm; we must do something!!!!!!!! 😲🤬🤪😆

[dead eye alan]

1 hour ago, snow white said:

How do you charge if you live on a Main Street with only a pavement you can’t have a cable going across the pavement 

Stick the lead out a bedroom window on a poll so it hangs over the car, simples!

[oowee]

58 minutes ago, CoventryWire said:

ICharging overnight - Yep, we will all just plug the cars in and charge them overnight when the grids at its lowest demand, in the next few years we'll see more and cars becoming "bi-directional" meaning they will actually just be a big battery on wheels, so if your car is sat on the drive fully charged and you are using power in the house, it will be coming from the cars battery and this will then be topped up by the grid again when the demand drops (usually 

I worked on the EV infrastructure strategy with UK govt I. Support of Nissan and BMW. There was a big hope that bi directional charging would be the way forward in support of the smart grid initiative. Unfortunately at the time, whilst fully possible, It ran into conflict with battery cycling and the negative impact life span and residual vehicle values. 

[Mr.C]

1 hour ago, snow white said:

How do you charge if you live on a Main Street with only a pavement you can’t have a cable going across the pavement 

See it all the time in London with the cable running in a rubber strip with sloped sides and yellow hazard stripes.

[old man]

1 hour ago, pigeon controller said:

Good point, will all the lamp posts have charge points??.

Yes apparently, points of benefit to copper thieves? 

Another benefit may lie in the number of shocks administered to nieve tinkerers?

Of course routine servicing will be out of the owners hands too, maybe?

So many benefits?😄😄😄

 

[Scully]

I’m hoping hydrogen may play a part before ‘we all go electric’. 
I’m not really sure how practical electric is for those of us who live pretty much in the sticks. There are currently two electric cars in our village; one owned by a retired GP the other by a mate who has his own IT business. Both have PV panels which generate much of their supply, but both are new builds ( one a converted barn ) so neither are listed, and I’m not sure about PV and listed building regulations, but considering we weren’t allowed to shove a pipe from a wood burner through our roof I’m guessing it’s a no. 🤷‍♂️

The GP doesn’t venture far in winter and mate is keeping his 4x4 for when the roads ‘are beyond playtime’, but if the scaremongers are right then we’ll all be in bikinis in winter anyhow, so there should be a glut of cheap off roaders on the market before too long, so all that is possibly irrelevant. 
Meanwhile Kahn has been given the go ahead to extend the exclusion zone in London for the highest polluting vehicles ( unless you pay of course ) so it looks like electric may be here ( or at least in the metropolitan areas ) for a while. 
Incidentally, how does the planet know you’ve paid the excess, thereby making it ok to drive through a city? I asked that of a councillor in Newcastle and never received a reply; can’t think why. 😀

[discobob]

1 minute ago, Scully said:

Meanwhile Kahn has been given the go ahead to extend the exclusion zone in London

ULEZ - coming to everywhere near you - sooner than you think

2 minutes ago, Scully said:

I’m hoping hydrogen may play a part before ‘we all go electric’. 

The Hydrogen Village at Port Sunlight hasn't gone well - and I heard a snippet last week that the government is dropping Hydrogen in part because of the botched rollout

[FOXHUNTER1]

1 hour ago, Weihrauch17 said:

We won't all be going electric, for the vast majority it is totally impractical and unaffordable.  A ridiculous policy totally out of touch with reality just like Heat Pumps.  They are also a serious fire hazard.

+1

[Scully]

2 minutes ago, discobob said:

ULEZ - coming to everywhere near you - sooner than you think

The Hydrogen Village at Port Sunlight hasn't gone well - and I heard a snippet last week that the government is dropping Hydrogen in part because of the botched rollout

I seriously doubt any of it will have much effect on me; I’m 64 now. The only thing which really really annoys me is people being priced out of being able to afford to drive; there will be many many who can’t afford the change but will be priced out of running their current vehicles. 
Like all other aspects of Net Zero policies, it will cause much stress and uncertainty, and have such a detrimental effect on those who can least afford it while those who can, just carry on as before. 
And the REALLY REALLY annoying aspect of this is that it won’t have any effect on the planet or it’s climate! 🤪

Bonkers! 

[FOXHUNTER1]

59 minutes ago, Penelope said:

But 40 degree temperatures are going to be norm; we must do something!!!!!!!! 😲🤬🤪😆

The norm says who ?

[morgan]

I would have thought they would be updating public transport, rather than everyone driving electric vehicles in the same way we use combustion engine cars now. Cant really see them having either the capacity or political will to get enough charging points built, or the grid to support it. Probably business use will be prioritised and the public will have to reduce the number of single car journeys. Though to be honest I doubt very much they will meet the EV targets and they will just tax the living daylights out of IC car use, dispproportionally effecting working people but not really effecting the wealthy. If they awarded business contracts to local firms rather than utility firms, that would reduce the carbon footprint of industry enormously. The number of times I have driven a 100 miles to work, passing contractors from where I am working driving to work in my region🙄

Edited July 28, 2023 by morgan

[discobob]

26 minutes ago, morgan said:

the public will have to reduce the number of single car journeys

believe it or not, they have camera's that can detect the number of people within vehicles... ask yourself why!!!

Edit: Perhaps this is why it seems like PLOD is cracking down on window tinting from the amount of "aren't we doing great" posts by police forces on FB

Edited July 28, 2023 by discobob

[Penelope]

42 minutes ago, Scully said:

I seriously doubt any of it will have much effect on me; I’m 64 now. The only thing which really really annoys me is people being priced out of being able to afford to drive; there will be many many who can’t afford the change but will be priced out of running their current vehicles. 
Like all other aspects of Net Zero policies, it will cause much stress and uncertainty, and have such a detrimental effect on those who can least afford it while those who can, just carry on as before. 
And the REALLY REALLY annoying aspect of this is that it won’t have any effect on the planet or it’s climate! 🤪

Bonkers! 

It's never been about the planet or climate; they are just good excuses to hang the control measures on.

51 minutes ago, FOXHUNTER1 said:

The norm says who ?

All of the news programs have been spouting the Met Office's latest crystal ball gazings.

https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/about-us/press-office/news/weather-and-climate/2020/chances-of-40c-days-in-the-uk-increasing-due-to-human-influence

[Scully]

22 minutes ago, Penelope said:

It's never been about the planet or climate; they are just good excuses to hang the control measures on.

 

Indeed. It’s never really been about air quality either; Londons air quality levels of pollution have always exceeded stipulated EU ( even when we were a member ) maximum pollution levels. 
I’m not claiming that makes it acceptable, but for Kahn to claim he is pursuing this on the grounds of health issues is sheer ********!