Could this be the future

[Davyo]

Compulsary theory test followed by a Compulsary practical test for both SGC & FAC.I was out with the wife for a drive in the counrty on Sunday.Stopped of at a nice pub for lunch & overheard two guys in a pub over lunch talking about it.One seemed insistant that it be brought in,the other defensive.The insistant one said "99 percent of FAC holders havent even read the Home office guidlines let alone had any form of training before being granted FAC"

Later on i was at the bar and the defensive one came to the bar,we had a little giggle and a few words about his mate and his thoughts & he noticed us talking.Anyhow just as i was leaving the other bloke stopped me and said "do you hold FAC?" "no" i replied "i surrendered both my FAC & SGC in November 2015"."Well then your no longer qualified to comment on what me and my mate are discussing" The wife grabbed my arm as i said in his face "thats right according to you,i shouldnt have held FAC as i havent passed your Compulsay tests your trying to ram down your mates throat!"

[oowee]

well said. I suspect it will be next on the list. Hope it wont apply to existing holders

[Lloyd90]

The opposing guy sounds like an A-hole.

 

People like him are better off just ignored.

How many people can drive but haven't read fully all the legislation involved ? What a crock of ****!

[dob]

Maybe a probationary period for new fac applicants, not sure about shotguns.some building sites won't let you use a disc cutter or nail gun unless you have a ticket and therefore taking a test ,yet nothing in the system for novices who want to get a shotgun or rifle so god knows what could be round the corner?

[figgy]

The reason for certs for nail guns and disc cutters is training centres dreaming up bloody courses to make money for everything pushing it to companies and nothing to do with safety. If your instructed in a tools use safely that should be it. Hire centres or suppliers used to show you how to use them clean them etc.

 

We need less restrictions not more,what is there to learn. A safe backstop is a must and the right caliber for you qaurry,not rocket science is it.

[Scully]

The reason for certs for nail guns and disc cutters is training centres dreaming up bloody courses to make money for everything pushing it to companies and nothing to do with safety. If your instructed in a tools use safely that should be it. Hire centres or suppliers used to show you how to use them clean them etc.

 

We need less restrictions not more,what is there to learn. A safe backstop is a must and the right caliber for you qaurry,not rocket science is it.

 

This. It's all based on revenue.

Gardeners Guns near Longtown runs courses through the HSE for individuals and corporations and even the police, in shotgun and firearm handling. It isn't compulsory but is actively being pushed and of course entails a cost.

I have one of the leaflets given to me by a mate who often calls in there.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Scully

[wymberley]

I have no doubt that we'll get what we deserve and if it all goes wrong on 23June, odds on are it'll be sooner rather than later is my gut feeling.

[Guest cookoff013]

i had to attend a training course on how to fill a 20 liter container with water. that was the worst 11 days of my life.

[la bala]

i had to attend a training course on how to fill a 20 liter container with water. that was the worst 11 days of my life.

11 days, what had it got a big hole in it

[Guest cookoff013]

2" hole, with screw top, was deemed a drowning hazard. life jackets issued. i even had to dig out my old 1988 silver swimming certificate.

[Brodie]

i had to attend a training course on how to fill a 20 liter container with water. that was the worst 11 days of my life.

Some years ago it was reported in a trade magazine that a man had successfully sued his employer after he tripped over whilst sweeping up because he had received no training in using a broom!

[mossy835]

well said. I suspect it will be next on the list. Hope it wont apply to existing holders

 

 

if it comes in we will all have to do it.

[Les*1066]

AFAIK, all registered clubs have a compulsory course of some description plus a probationary period for new new/prospective members. I don't know how it works for shooting on permissions, but the interview with the police will sort most of the wheat from the chaff. The bloke obviously didn't have a clue, but unfortunately it's the likes of him that will make the most noise in the anti lobby.

[scotslad]

I used to be dead against most training courses, and most are fairly rubbish and teach u nothing that common sense doesnae.

 

But less and less people now have common senses and more and more people are coming into shooting who are complete novices, with absolutely no experience of guns or the etiquitte safety drill around them.

Not saying being brought up around them from a young age guarantees safety and sometimes oppisate is true and breeds complaciency.

 

I'm slowy coming round to the idea of compulsory testing, happens in most other countries to some degree, even in this country dsc1 is slowly becoming the standard needed to be granted a new deer rifle by many police forces.

Even in scotland in the WANE bill was a rule that all people who shoot deer should be on a register even to shoot der on ur own land (off coarse have to be qualified and pay money to register each year) thankfully that part was not brought in but mandoritory training will still be in their thoughts

[Dougy]

I would not be against some sort of test for FAC applications, specially after reading some of the questions sometimes seen on here. But then again when you think about it, putting the mentor conditions on serves a similar purpose. Assessment of the basic safe shooting of rifles, understanding the reasons for safe back drops. It's one he'll of a big jump from most people's 1st steps in the shooting world using air rifles.

The only issue will be that someone will look at it as a money grabbing exercise

[bluesj]

I was sent on a course to use a bit of kit i had been using for years, the guy who was taking the course and singing the paper work to say I was safe to use it had been trained in its use by me

[phaedra1106]

I was sent on a course to use a bit of kit i had been using for years, the guy who was taking the course and singing the paper work to say I was safe to use it had been trained in its use by me

Reminds me of a job interview I had, went through the whole thing to be told at the very end they didn't think I'd be capable of doing the job :(

 

I asked if they were happy with the person who was leaving?, they said yes, he's great we're looking for someone like him, could of heard a pin drop when I told them I trained him and taught him everything he knew about the job

[scotslad]

I would not be against some sort of test for FAC applications, specially after reading some of the questions sometimes seen on here. But then again when you think about it, putting the mentor conditions on serves a similar purpose. Assessment of the basic safe shooting of rifles, understanding the reasons for safe back drops. It's one he'll of a big jump from most people's 1st steps in the shooting world using air rifles.

The only issue will be that someone will look at it as a money grabbing exercise

 

its some of the questions asked on here that make me think that too, they say there is no silly questions and there isn't if udon't know the answer.

 

Think i like many of the older generation were lucky enough to be brought up with 'mentors' all the time since we were kids, if we done owt wrong u got a slap/grounded or went back a few stages on ur quest to fire ur 1st gun so u knew exactly how to handle 1 long before u were ever allowed near it

[bluesj]

 

its some of the questions asked on here that make me think that too, they say there is no silly questions and there isn't if udon't know the answer.

 

Think i like many of the older generation were lucky enough to be brought up with 'mentors' all the time since we were kids, if we done owt wrong u got a slap/grounded or went back a few stages on ur quest to fire ur 1st gun so u knew exactly how to handle 1 long before u were ever allowed near it

Very good point, its easy to forget that some of us were lucky enough start our firearms training as soon as we could walk. I can remember following my grandad around carrying cartridges for him, must have tripped over something every few steps but never dropped the cartridges

[TONY R]

No different to the DSC courses what do they go up to now level 30 with an annexed module coming in on the first of June on cake decoration. :lol: Just jobs for the boys networking nothing new under the sun.

[Scully]

I used to be dead against most training courses, and most are fairly rubbish and teach u nothing that common sense doesnae.

 

But less and less people now have common senses and more and more people are coming into shooting who are complete novices, with absolutely no experience of guns or the etiquitte safety drill around them.

Not saying being brought up around them from a young age guarantees safety and sometimes oppisate is true and breeds complaciency.

 

I'm slowy coming round to the idea of compulsory testing, happens in most other countries to some degree, even in this country dsc1 is slowly becoming the standard needed to be granted a new deer rifle by many police forces.

Even in scotland in the WANE bill was a rule that all people who shoot deer should be on a register even to shoot der on ur own land (off coarse have to be qualified and pay money to register each year) thankfully that part was not brought in but mandoritory training will still be in their thoughts

 

A bit confusing this really, and some pretty broad statements.

You're coming round to the idea of compulsory training yet in your very first sentence you state most are fairly rubbish! Then what is the point? How do you know most are rubbish? Have you been on them all? Rubbish compared to what?

Then you go on to state that less and less people have common sense and more and more are coming into shooting who are complete novices...where have you gleaned this information from?

[Dekers]

Pub talk usually gets interesting.

 

Just the same, some sort of gun testing will be inevitable in the future.

 

The pathetic blame culture we live in will dictate that.

[Guest]

Problem with courses like the DSC1 is they don't teach anything about shooting safety. Don't get me wrong it's a very good course, but there is almost in it about actual shooting.

Yet as mentioned above its the industry standard now for bloody training!

[bluesj]

I suspect most of us that have been sent on courses through work have been using or doing what the course was about for years and didn't learn anything, just picked up a bit of paper to say we know what we are doing.

 

On the other hand there have been a number of posts on here by people saying that they are applying for their fac and asking what they should apply for, if someone doesn't know what rifle they need chances are the will not know how to use it.

Plus the first thing a lot of use tell someone who posts on here saying they are new to shooting is to book a lesson at a clay ground etc, so would such a course / lesson for new sgc fac applicants be that bad?

[scotslad]

I think thats the problem even thou ur DSC1/or clay lesson does have basic safety elements to them it's very hard to teach years of safety drills and experience in 1 course. Plus u know ur under test conditions so u will be on best behaviour, when ur 1st deer/buck/fox is skylined its far harder not to pull trigger.

Or on a clay shot u know everything down range is safe, very different environment on a game shoot esp if a walking gun so safe shots always changing, chance of a woodcock etc.

 

And the other problem is often younger/confident folk get 1 basic ticket and think there gods gift. Have heard plenty of novice stalkers get there dsc1 and think they are now expert stalkers and almost refuse to listen to advice of experienced but non dsc1 stalkers as if it really makes a difference

 

I remember after doing my 1st chainsaw ticket many moons ago, i knew i still had a lot to learn even thou i had used them for years (infact still do) and was lucky enough to work with a lot of older cutters who had done it for years i tried to learn as much as i could off them, i used to just labour/drag for them whereas the young pups used to race out of the van each morning desperate to get their saw started. Most of those younger guys i wouldnae trust to cut there finger nails never mind trees, some were pretty scary.

 

 

Quite hard to make a course actually worthwhile without making it too long/expensive as the simple fact u learn far more going out with an experienced safe shot 1 to 1